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Thread: 337,503 Active CPL's in Washinton State

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    State Researcher Bill Starks's Avatar
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    337,503 Active CPL's in Washinton State

    I was doing some research for a project and requested the number of CPL holders. I was very surprised that the number was over 300k.

    population: 6,724,540
    Active CPL's: 337,503
    percentage: 19.924 (or 1 in 20 people have a CPL)

    from DOL Firearms FIREARMS@dol.wa.gov
    to Bill Starks <m1gunr@gmail.com>
    date Thu, May 19, 2011 at 3:22 PM
    subject RE: license numbers
    mailed-by dol.wa.gov


    Good Afternoon,
    There are currently 337,503 Active CPL holders in Washington state.

    Firearms Unit
    Business & Professions Division
    Department of Licensing
    (360) 664-6616
    firearms@dol.wa.gov
    Last edited by Bill Starks; 06-07-2011 at 06:33 PM.

  2. #2
    Regular Member NavyMike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by M1Gunr View Post
    I was doing some research for a project and requested the number of CPL holders. I was very surprised that the number was over 300k.

    population: 6,724,540
    Active CPL's: 337,503
    percentage: 19.924 (or 1 in 20 people have a CPL)

    firearms@dol.wa.gov
    That fraction goes up when you consider that about 1/4 of our population is under 21 years of age.
    cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscripti catapultas habebunt

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NavyMike View Post
    That fraction goes up when you consider that about 1/4 of our population is under 21 years of age.
    Goes up for those over 21, (yet many under 21 carry anyway).

    Still doesn't change M1gunrs statistic though, 1 in 20 people you run into are possibly carrying concealed. Although I have found in my line of work a lot more people have guns on them or in the car than that percentage.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    Goes up for those over 21, (yet many under 21 carry anyway).

    Still doesn't change M1gunrs statistic though, 1 in 20 people you run into are possibly carrying concealed. Although I have found in my line of work a lot more people have guns on them or in the car than that percentage.
    SVG I would hope the percentage was higher than the general population, look at who you hang out with not many of us are going to be unarmed very often.

  5. #5
    Regular Member amlevin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orphan View Post
    SVG I would hope the percentage was higher than the general population, look at who you hang out with not many of us are going to be unarmed very often.

    And this doesn't even count those who carry concealed without a CPL. Yes, there are more than a few "Non Felons" that do this and so far have had no contact with LEOs.

    A real interesting number would be the TOTAL number of firearms "on the street" at any given time both in the hands of law abiding citizens and those who are not so law abiding and are prohibited.
    Last edited by amlevin; 05-19-2011 at 09:38 PM.
    "If I shoot all the ammo I am carrying I either won't need anymore or more won't help"

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    Regular Member 1245A Defender's Avatar
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    well,,,

    sorry about your math,,
    1 in 20 have a CPL,,,
    thats really about 5%, not 19.
    divide the other way...
    EMNofSeattle wrote: Your idea of freedom terrifies me. So you are actually right. I am perfectly happy with what you call tyranny.....

    “If ever a time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in Government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin.”

    Stand up for your Rights,, They have no authority on their own...

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    it is their right and duty to be at all times ARMED!

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orphan View Post
    SVG I would hope the percentage was higher than the general population, look at who you hang out with not many of us are going to be unarmed very often.
    Couldn't be in finer company either.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  8. #8
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by amlevin View Post
    And this doesn't even count those who carry concealed without a CPL. Yes, there are more than a few "Non Felons" that do this and so far have had no contact with LEOs.

    A real interesting number would be the TOTAL number of firearms "on the street" at any given time both in the hands of law abiding citizens and those who are not so law abiding and are prohibited.
    I agree totally. I know "felons" and "law abiding" that carry anyway. I always think as any person I meet as armed.

    I remember a Canadian fellow telling me how they stereo type Americans and joke about how any American they see in a truck probably has a gun. I told him that "joke" probably isn't very far from the truth.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Yall have nearly 340,000 licenses with a population less than 7 million????!!!
    Texas has about 24 million people living here with only 460,000 licenses!!!
    I have said the Texas License cost too much and is way too restrictive.

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    Regular Member jt59's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by M1Gunr View Post
    I was doing some research for a project and requested the number of CPL holders. I was very surprised that the number was over 300k.

    population: 6,724,540
    Active CPL's: 337,503
    percentage: 19.924 (or 1 in 20 people have a CPL)

    from DOL Firearms FIREARMS@dol.wa.gov
    to Bill Starks <m1gunr@gmail.com>
    date Thu, May 19, 2011 at 3:22 PM
    subject RE: license numbers
    mailed-by dol.wa.gov


    Good Afternoon,
    There are currently 337,503 Active CPL holders in Washington state.

    Staff
    Firearms Unit
    Business & Professions Division
    Department of Licensing
    (360) 664-6616
    firearms@dol.wa.gov
    actually, I think it will get better than that. I have followed this number too...the last time I asked was April, and they had just under 300,000. The next question though was important...they had input 14,500 in Feb, give or take and more importantly were only entering info for last October/November.

    Then when I did some population demographics in WA, and you take out the number of folks under 21, the illegals (estimated), the convicted folks no longer eligible, I came up with a number closer to 1:9

    jt
    Last edited by jt59; 06-09-2011 at 10:00 AM.
    Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the grey twilight that knows not victory nor defeat....Teddy Roosevelt

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    Regular Member maclean's Avatar
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    It also does not count LEO's who do not have CPL's.
    Squeak!

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    Campaign Veteran gogodawgs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jt59 View Post
    actually, I think it will get better than that. I have followed this number too...the last time I asked was April, and they had just under 300,000. The next question though was important...they had input 14,500 in Feb, give or take and more importantly were only entering info for last October/November.

    Then when I did some population demographics in WA, and you take out the number of folks under 21, the illegals (estimated), the convicted folks no longer eligible, I came up with a number closer to 1:9

    jt
    I don't believe your math is correct. I did this last year with 280k and it works out to about 1:19, I will see if I can do the math later...

    Quote Originally Posted by maclean View Post
    It also does not count LEO's who do not have CPL's.
    Do you have a CPL? I have 2 LEO in this state and they both have a CPL.
    Live Free or Die!

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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    Couldn't be in finer company either.
    Absolutely!

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    Regular Member maclean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gogodawgs View Post
    Do you have a CPL? I have 2 LEO in this state and they both have a CPL.
    I do, it makes purchases convenient and it also preserves my right to be armed if I were to be under some sort of discipline. It also allows me to choose to be armed without carrying LEO ID.

    Same reason I advise all of my students to obtain a WA and UT permit.

    Not many do, however.
    Last edited by maclean; 05-20-2011 at 01:06 AM.
    Squeak!

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    Regular Member jt59's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=gogodawgs;1534820]I don't believe your math is correct. I did this last year with 280k and it works out to about 1:19, I will see if I can do the math later...

    I would concede you point....but like my daddy said, statistics never lie, but liars use statistics....and I don't want to be a damz lier.

    What we need to do is agree on what we are measuring to get to the number we think we want....

    My premise was working toward a number of CPL holders to those that are eligible to have them....this is differn't from the general population in WA if that is the metric.

    I'm happy to develop bragging rights, but I suppose we (should) develop the metric first....and then determine the number or percent.

    What do you think it should be?
    Last edited by jt59; 05-20-2011 at 06:36 PM.
    Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the grey twilight that knows not victory nor defeat....Teddy Roosevelt

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    Regular Member Freedom First's Avatar
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    I brought this up last year (and totally screwed up the math...) but I think we are missing the real point: "How many actually carry?"

    In my experience, very few. I can think of nine CPL holders and only 1 carries on a daily basis and 1 other will carry when going "someplace dangerous"... I haven't figured that out.
    Freedom can never be lost, only given away by ignorance, by choice, or at the point of a gun. Here in America we can still choose.

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    Regular Member BigDeeeeeeee's Avatar
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    How many of those are out of state like me & my wife? That would change the percentage some, probably not a lot.

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    Regular Member jt59's Avatar
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    New math

    So here is in part, my rationale, or at least math...and is based on those that I can see eligible to have a permit.

    As of the last census there were 6,664,000 folks in WA.

    http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/53000.html

    30.4% were by definition out of the mix due to age: 2,018,560 = 4,645440

    Then the variance to account for:

    Ineligible Felons: 167,316 (note that the statistics here appear to be based on the 2009census less the same percentage above that are also ineligible to vote) but represents by another 3.7% with "probationers" being the highest represented.

    But, it could get a lot worse (or make my argument a lot stronger) with 17,000 folks in Prison and what the GOV is thinking about:

    http://www.correctionsreporter.com/2...tion-changing/

    http://felonvoting.procon.org/view.r...ourceID=000287


    Foreign Persons: Dump another 10% - But some may be eligible?

    Illegal Aliens: 280,000 = 3.6%

    http://immigrationroad.com/resource/...s-by-state.php

    Total: close on to 48%....or 3,465,406 eligible....

    I come out around 9.7%

    ....and then I want to add in that the DOL has only input data through Dec ....maybe January....and I get pretty close to 1 in 9.

    .....at least that's what I tell all my Anti friends.
    Last edited by jt59; 05-20-2011 at 07:22 PM.
    Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the grey twilight that knows not victory nor defeat....Teddy Roosevelt

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    New poster.

    Quote Originally Posted by MR Redenck View Post
    Yall have nearly 340,000 licenses with a population less than 7 million????!!!
    Texas has about 24 million people living here with only 460,000 licenses!!!
    I have said the Texas License cost too much and is way too restrictive.
    New to the forums and doing lots of research about open carry laws here in Washington State. Getting my CPL this month so i'm going to add myself along with several friends and family to that number. Going to Cabella's here in WA on my birthday in a few months. : )

    I grew up in Arkansas/Texas area. i have noted that a lot of conservative and religious areas like where I grew up tend to have harsher carry laws and bans. TX, OK, FL, SC are examples. (Old religious folks who disapprove of firearms that vote?) WA adheres to the 2nd amendment damn well the way it was written with some local common sense restrictions. (IE: illegal to: have your gun drawn, hand on weapon, pointing it to intimidate,.. unless you are protecting yourself, etc.) I'm glad to live in a 'stand your ground' state where open carry is legal. Any state banning open carry in my opinion does not uphold the 2nd amendment of the United States.

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    Regular Member fire suppressor's Avatar
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    That's not bad for this state I would be curious to know the difference between eastern and western Washington. 1 in 20 is not bad but would like to see that number go up in the next few years
    "Fight like you train, train like you fight"

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fire suppressor View Post
    That's not bad for this state I would be curious to know the difference between eastern and western Washington. 1 in 20 is not bad but would like to see that number go up in the next few years
    If it makes you feel better there are a lot more who carry without a government permission slip to exercise that right.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Regular Member Wolfebane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Turney View Post
    New to the forums and doing lots of research about open carry laws here in Washington State. Getting my CPL this month so i'm going to add myself along with several friends and family to that number. Going to Cabella's here in WA on my birthday in a few months. : )

    I grew up in Arkansas/Texas area. i have noted that a lot of conservative and religious areas like where I grew up tend to have harsher carry laws and bans. TX, OK, FL, SC are examples. (Old religious folks who disapprove of firearms that vote?) WA adheres to the 2nd amendment damn well the way it was written with some local common sense restrictions. (IE: illegal to: have your gun drawn, hand on weapon, pointing it to intimidate,.. unless you are protecting yourself, etc.) I'm glad to live in a 'stand your ground' state where open carry is legal. Any state banning open carry in my opinion does not uphold the 2nd amendment of the United States.
    My guns are very important to me, and the right carry (even concealed) but especially openly is also of importance to me. But all the places I might be interested in living (other than WA) when I go looking for a job/career once I graduate have restrictive laws/conditions.

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    Regular Member skiingislife725's Avatar
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    I always like to tell the anti's/fence-sitters that about 1 out of 12 or 13 adults that you see probably has their licence to carry a concealed pistol. I tell them this because weeding out kids is easy to do visually, but the felon's/illegal's part is a lot harder. But, I guess if you tell them that for those eligible to carry, 1 in 9 are licensed to do so...it might be eye-opening too. It just requires more explaining...depends on if you "have their ears" for that long or not.

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    Regular Member p85-GSXwheelman's Avatar
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    Sowing CC/OC seeds :))

    Someobody made a very good point....how many CPL holders ACTUALLY CARRY! Thats the biggest factor I think. Because how can you count the CPL holder as a number in your statistics if they are not upholding their RESPONSIBILITY to carry? I personally carry EVERYTIME I leave the house, no exceptions unless im going to the bar, a school, etc...obviously. I'd like to think I'm doing my part to help make people informed....I OC and have had many conversations started because of it, both positive and negative, that gave me the oportunity to share the facts with them. And ontop of that, I also talk to my friends about it. As a result, several of my responsible gun-owning friends, have come to me to walk them thru the process (including females). From the application process, to choosing the gun thats right for them, and what options of carry work best for them. Anyway, feels good. haha thought id share.

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    Regular Member WOD's Avatar
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    Make that 337,504....

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