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Thread: national parks and NC laws

  1. #1
    Regular Member papa bear's Avatar
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    national parks and NC laws

    hope y'all can help me out. i know this has been discussed before. i tried to use the search but couldn't get it to work.

    i was in a conversation with a fellow gun enthusiast, and he was under the impression that the phrase;
    quote from the blue ridge parkway web site "
    The new federal law makes possession of firearms in national parks also subject to the firearms laws of the state/commonwealth and communities where the parks are located.
    Visitors who wish to bring firearms to the park are responsible to know what state/commonwealth they are in and are subject to the laws of the different state or commonwealth and counties, depending on their location. end quote
    meant that if you are in NC and since NC doesn't allow firearms in their parks, this meant that you could not carry in the blue ridge parkway in NC. he said this was also told to him by a park ranger (i do not trust what some individual gov. personal would say)


    i would appreciate cite to either to confirm or deject this. thanks
    Luke 22:36 ; 36Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

    "guns are like a Parachute, if you don't have one when you need it, you will not need one again"
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    i you call a CHP a CCW then you are really stupid. period.

  2. #2
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Yep - no guns in NC state parks.
    http://www.ncparks.gov/Visit/faq/main.php

    Therefore no guns on NPS lands (National Parks) within NC.

    Edit to correct:
    However, NPS lands allow carry in accordance with the state law in which they are located and NOT in relationship to whether such carry is allowed specifically in state parks. Therefore OC or CC w/permit IS legal on NPS lands located within NC.
    http://www.nps.gov/grsm/parkmgmt/lawsandpolicies.htm

    http://www.nationalparkstraveler.com...ebruary-225345

    Last edited by Grapeshot; 05-30-2011 at 08:10 AM. Reason: edited to correct
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

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    Regular Member Dreamer's Avatar
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    Grape, I don't want to step on your toes, but I believe your interpretation of this new law regaring carry on NPS land is incorrect...

    Carry in a National Park s NOT contingent on the laws of that given state regardig carry in State Parks. As of February 22, 2010, the new federal law allows people who can legally possess firearms under applicable federal, state, and local laws, to legally possess firearms in this park.

    If you are not a prohibited person, and may carry a firearm in public in a given state, then the new NPS laws say you can carry in a National Park, even if that state prohibits carry in State Parks.

    And my personal experience has borne that out.

    I am NOT allowed to carry in NC State Parks (and during our trip to Jockey Ridge last summer, I had to leave my firearm in my car, parked off State Park property.)

    But I OCed a full-size Para Ordnance S-14.45 in a Serpa holster at the Wright Brothers National Memorial, and didn't have a single issue, even when stopping to converse with several NPS rangers. (But I couldn't carry in the buildings).

    If you go to this thread:

    http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...=1#post1302391

    You can even see a photo of me standing on the WBNM beside a bust of Orville Wright, my OC'd Para in plain view...

    So either I was REALLY lucky, or the Rangers at WBNM don't know the law...
    Last edited by Dreamer; 05-30-2011 at 12:42 AM.
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    The original law connected NPS carry with State Park Carry. That was through the NPS process and was struck down by a Fed Court.

    Second law went through Congress and only specified per state law, also did not specify OC or CC. Per state law does not mean State park carry though. State Parks and NP's are different animals. But don't take my word for it, take the Great Smoky Mountains NP site.

    http://www.nps.gov/grsm/parkmgmt/lawsandpolicies.htm

    I talked to a Ranger in the Smokies about CC, while carrying. I mentioned I was carrying in the process. No issue.
    I have OC'd around Rangers on the Blue Ridge Parkway. My wife told me that they definitely noticed. No issue.

    It's a common misconception.

  5. #5
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Dreamer and chiefjason you are both correct -my post above was the result of obvious synapse failure because I do know better.

    NPS lands allow carry in accordance with the state law in which they are located and NOT in relationship to whether such carry is allowed specifically in state parks. Therefore OC or CC w/permit IS legal on NPS lands located within NC.

    Note that I edited my post above (#2) to correct the faulty response.
    Last edited by Grapeshot; 05-30-2011 at 08:16 AM. Reason: added
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

  6. #6
    Regular Member papa bear's Avatar
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    thanks grapeshot, the dialog started about being able to carry in VA side of the parkway, but not on the NC side.

    thanks dreamer, i had remembered your post about the Wright Brothers Memorial, and it was an example that i used. but like most, we needed a cite for clarity.

    thanks chiefJason, the Smoky Mtn site has more info. and better than the BRP site.
    like usual it seems to fall into interpretation, which is where the rub is. do all of the LEOs interpret it the same way. all the sites i looked at seem to have this same line. the part in bold was my doing
    "As of February 22, 2010, a new federal law allows people who can legally possess firearms under applicable federal, state, and local laws, to legally possess firearms in this park."
    the words "legally possess" seems to be the key, IMO. but then opinion only means anything if you are a judge. will we have to have a test case of this?
    Luke 22:36 ; 36Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

    "guns are like a Parachute, if you don't have one when you need it, you will not need one again"
    - unknown

    i you call a CHP a CCW then you are really stupid. period.

  7. #7
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    Just to share my own tidbit...In PA OC is not legal in state parks, but it IS legal in NP. Just another thought agreeing SP and NP are not connected. :-)

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    forset service lands???

    How about forest service lands. my little piece of land boarders nfs game lands i was under the inpression i was limited to 22 cal carried open. am i mistaken or is it correct??
    thanks

  9. #9
    Regular Member REDFIVE48's Avatar
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    Your understanding is correct, unless its hunting season, then you can carry other than the .22 and be OK

    Sent from C-3PO (my Android) using Tapatalk Pro

  10. #10
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gabe View Post
    How about forest service lands. my little piece of land boarders nfs game lands i was under the inpression i was limited to 22 cal carried open. am i mistaken or is it correct??
    thanks
    The only regulations specific to use of weapons imposed by the Forest Service is that you cannot discharge a weapon within 150 yards of any structure/development or occupied area, within or into a cave, across or on a road or body of water, or in any manner that endangers a person. You also cannot use any tracer or incendiary ammunition. Forest Service regulations require that you also comply with all State laws regarding the use of firearms while hunting.

    If you are planning on visiting a designated Wilderness Area, the Regional Forester or Forest Supervisor has the option to implement a special local order which additionally prohibits the mere possession of a firearm within that Wilderness Area. Although this prohibition is not common, you should contact the Forest Supervisor's office to find out whether such a restriction has been imposed.

    http://www.fs.fed.us/recreation/prog.../welcome.shtml
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

  11. #11
    Regular Member papa bear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gabe View Post
    How about forest service lands. my little piece of land boarders nfs game lands i was under the impression i was limited to 22 cal carried open. am i mistaken or is it correct??
    thanks
    i was wondering if i understood this right, do you own land adjacent to NFs game land?
    i thought you could carry pretty much what you wanted to, on private property
    Luke 22:36 ; 36Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

    "guns are like a Parachute, if you don't have one when you need it, you will not need one again"
    - unknown

    i you call a CHP a CCW then you are really stupid. period.

  12. #12
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    Grapeshot, the problem in NC is that all National Forest lands are considered Gamelands as well. They then fall under the tighter state Gamelands restrictions. It's dumb. Also there is no restriction on OC or CC. If you have a permit you could CC as well. I've been personally campaigning on this site and others to change this for the last 3 years. Basically, during most open hunting seasons for game animals there is no restriction on what you can carry. Once hunting seasons end, it reverts back to the .22 restriction. The reasoning from the state is to increase coyote and hog hunting. You could carry a .223 during dove season, but I can't carry a G19 while trout fishing in the summer. Dumb, dumb, dumb!



    During the big game turkey season, only shotguns and archery equipment may be possessed on game lands.
    ● During closed seasons and closed hunting days on game birds (waterfowl, doves, woodcock, snipe, rails, gallinules, moorhens, coots, grouse, pheasant, quail, turkey) and game animals (deer, bear, fox, rabbits, squirrels, boar, bobcats, opossum, raccoon), it is unlawful to possess any firearm or bow and arrow readily avail- able for use. During that time in which fox season is the only open season for a game animal, it is also unlawful to possess these weapons. The following exceptions, however, should be noted:
    - Possession is allowed on field-trial and designated target shoot- ing areas and in camping areas for defense of person or property.
    - 22-caliber pistols with barrels, not greater than 7.5 inches in length and shooting only short, long or long rifle ammunition, may be carried as side arms on game lands at any time, except by hunters during the special bow-and-arrow and muzzle- loading firearms deer hunting season and on any game lands with regulations that prohibit the possession of handguns.
    - Individuals training dogs during closed season without field- trial authorization are prohibited from carrying any weapon.
    - A bow and fishing arrows may be possessed when used as a licensed special fishing device in those waters, where such use is authorized.

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    yes my home is ajacent to nfs land. when i am on the private roads or my land i have taken to OC of whatever i want but have been careful not to cross the boundry with a SAA or 1911. just wanted to find out if my understanding was correct. set to take the cc course this week and spoke to leo about local oc attitudes and will give it a try next time i go to town. thanks for the feedback

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