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Thread: Hb45 signed, now what?

  1. #1
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    Hb45 signed, now what?

    so how many have gone through their local areas ordinances to see what preemption violations they could find?

    pasco co has three

    Sec. 70-51. - Firearms.

    The possession or discharging within any park of any air rifle, airgun, water gun, toy cannon, slingshot, bow and arrow, speargun or any toy or instrument that discharges projectiles by explosive substance, air or any other means is prohibited, unless specifically authorized in writing by the county administrator.
    Sec. 30-32. - The role of the county administrator during state of emergency.

    (a)

    Upon the declaration of a state of emergency pursuant to this article, the county administrator or his designee shall have the authority, without further board action, to take emergency measures as he may deem appropriate to protect the health, safety and welfare of the community. Appropriate measures include, but are not limited to:

    (1)

    Suspend or limit the sale, dispensing or transportation of alcoholic beverages, firearms, explosives and combustibles.
    Sec. 66-37. - Handgun purchase cooling-off period.
    (d)

    Cooling-off period established. No delivery of a handgun shall be made to a purchaser until the expiration of 48 hours from the time of purchase.
    next local county commissioners meeting is the 21st, i think i'll swing by and have a chat.

  2. #2
    Regular Member ~*'Phoenix'*~'s Avatar
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    I found a local park (Hollywood) with a 'no firearms' rule in the sign. Gonna get onto the city about it. Looking into it now.
    American Government 101:
    The Executive branch's job is to provide celebrity figureheads for the pandering populace.
    The Legislative branch's job is to progressively destroy our freedoms for the "safety" of "We the Sheeple."
    The Judicial branch's job is to look like they're defending our freedoms against the abuses of the Legislative branch, only by token gestures that do not interfere is this pivotal process, but enough to deceive "We the People" into a false sense of security.

  3. #3
    Regular Member 77zach's Avatar
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    Now nothing. Don't get me wrong, I'm glad it passed but since we don't have OC this really doesn't do a lot. So we get this and the doctor bill which does nothing for us while infringing a little on the first amendment. What an awesome session!
    “If the natural tendencies of mankind are so bad that it is not safe to permit people to be free, how is it that the tendencies of these organizers are always good? Do not the legislators and their appointed agents also belong to the human race? Or do they believe that they themselves are made of a finer clay than the rest of mankind? ” -Bastiat

    I don't "need" to openly carry a handgun or own an "assault weapon" any more than Rosa Parks needed a seat on the bus.

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    This is a Palm Beach County Ordinance. Is it now illegal? In particular, the 5 day wait and (b) where it says you have to do a background check on a private sale.

    Sec. 28-23. - Mandatory waiting period; criminal history records check requirement.

    (a)
    No person shall deliver a firearm to another person, other than a licensed dealer, licensed manufacturer or licensed importer, in connection with the sale of such firearm for a period of five (5) business days from the date of the sale.

    (b)
    No person shall deliver a firearm to another person, other than a licensed dealer, licensed manufacturer or licensed importer, in connection with the sale of such firearm until the seller, either directly or through a licensed dealer, licensed manufacturer or licensed importer, has:

    (1)
    Requested a national criminal history records check of the potential purchaser or transferee of the firearm from FDLE or NICS, and

    (2)
    Received an approval/identification number from FDLE or NICS signifying the potential purchaser or transferee of the firearm would not be prohibited by state or federal law from receiving or possessing a firearm.

    (c)
    The provisions of this section shall not apply to holders of a concealed weapons permit issued pursuant to general law of the State of Florida when purchasing a firearm.

  5. #5
    Regular Member Rich7553's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 996twint View Post
    This is a Palm Beach County Ordinance. Is it now illegal? In particular, the 5 day wait and (b) where it says you have to do a background check on a private sale.

    Sec. 28-23. - Mandatory waiting period; criminal history records check requirement.

    (a)
    No person shall deliver a firearm to another person, other than a licensed dealer, licensed manufacturer or licensed importer, in connection with the sale of such firearm for a period of five (5) business days from the date of the sale.

    (b)
    No person shall deliver a firearm to another person, other than a licensed dealer, licensed manufacturer or licensed importer, in connection with the sale of such firearm until the seller, either directly or through a licensed dealer, licensed manufacturer or licensed importer, has:

    (1)
    Requested a national criminal history records check of the potential purchaser or transferee of the firearm from FDLE or NICS, and

    (2)
    Received an approval/identification number from FDLE or NICS signifying the potential purchaser or transferee of the firearm would not be prohibited by state or federal law from receiving or possessing a firearm.

    (c)
    The provisions of this section shall not apply to holders of a concealed weapons permit issued pursuant to general law of the State of Florida when purchasing a firearm.
    No sir, it is not illegal, at least not in its entirety. The Florida Constitution, Article VIII, Section 5(b) states:

    "Each county shall have the authority to require a criminal history records check and a 3 to 5-day waiting period, excluding weekends and legal holidays, in connection with the sale of any firearm occurring within such county. For purposes of this subsection, the term “sale” means the transfer of money or other valuable consideration for any firearm when any part of the transaction is conducted on property to which the public has the right of access. Holders of a concealed weapons permit as prescribed by general law shall not be subject to the provisions of this subsection when purchasing a firearm."

    A statute cannot supersede the constitution. Only a constitutional amendment can do away with this provision. However, the ordinance can be challenged as it does not recognize private sales that occur wholly on private property. But it isn't a preemption issue.
    Last edited by Rich7553; 06-06-2011 at 07:13 PM.
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    there is a wait even if we have a concealed permit???? or is that general public wait?

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    Founder's Club Member ixtow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hvtopiwala View Post
    there is a wait even if we have a concealed permit???? or is that general public wait?
    CWFL holders are 'special' only ones. They're better than the 'general public.'

    I don't show mine. I take the waiting period. I refuse to act like I'm better than 'the commoners.'
    "The fourth man's dark, accusing song had scratched our comfort hard and long..."
    http://edhelper.com/poetry/The_Hangm...rice_Ogden.htm

    https://gunthreadadapters.com

    "Be not intimidated ... nor suffer yourselves to be wheedled out of your Liberties by any pretense of Politeness, Delicacy, or Decency. These, as they are often used, are but three different names for Hypocrisy, Chicanery, and Cowardice." - John Adams

    Tyranny with Manners is still Tyranny.

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    Founder's Club Member ixtow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mach1chris View Post
    Who said anything about CWFL holders being they are the "special" only ones?.... just cause you have or show a firearm permit don't mean your better then anyone. In fact it dont mean anything, besides your right to carry. Showing your CWFL to a gun store rep just means you have already gone through the background check and the five to seven day waiting period is no longer needed.
    The general mindset of elitism among FL CWFL holders starts there. Special provisions in law that make one person better than another and worthy of more privileges than another in regard to a basic human Right.
    "The fourth man's dark, accusing song had scratched our comfort hard and long..."
    http://edhelper.com/poetry/The_Hangm...rice_Ogden.htm

    https://gunthreadadapters.com

    "Be not intimidated ... nor suffer yourselves to be wheedled out of your Liberties by any pretense of Politeness, Delicacy, or Decency. These, as they are often used, are but three different names for Hypocrisy, Chicanery, and Cowardice." - John Adams

    Tyranny with Manners is still Tyranny.

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    Campaign Veteran Schlitz's Avatar
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    Exclamation

    I show mine because I don't want to wait... I think it is crazy and I don't agree to it, but SINCE I DO HAVE IT I might as well just get my gun over the counter. There is no elitism here. I hate the CWL, and given the opprotunity to support efforts to get rid of it for constitutional carry I would!

  10. #10
    Founder's Club Member ixtow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schlitz View Post
    I show mine because I don't want to wait... I think it is crazy and I don't agree to it, but SINCE I DO HAVE IT I might as well just get my gun over the counter. There is no elitism here. I hate the CWL, and given the opprotunity to support efforts to get rid of it for constitutional carry I would!
    I'm not suggesting that all CWFL holders are elitist ****** bags. But a majority of them are. Many gun owners on FL see owning a gun as a status symbol of superiority and only 'certain people' should be allowed to own one at all.

    This is why we face such a hard uphill battle for OC. This half-assed deceptive attempt that just failed has been turned into a weapon against us, and a power grab for LEOs and the State in general. And still touted as a good thing...
    "The fourth man's dark, accusing song had scratched our comfort hard and long..."
    http://edhelper.com/poetry/The_Hangm...rice_Ogden.htm

    https://gunthreadadapters.com

    "Be not intimidated ... nor suffer yourselves to be wheedled out of your Liberties by any pretense of Politeness, Delicacy, or Decency. These, as they are often used, are but three different names for Hypocrisy, Chicanery, and Cowardice." - John Adams

    Tyranny with Manners is still Tyranny.

  11. #11
    Regular Member LibertyDeath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ixtow View Post
    the general mindset of elitism among fl cwfl holders starts there. Special provisions in law that make one person better than another and worthy of more privileges than another in regard to a basic human right.
    lol.

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    Florida has waiting periods on firearms purchases!? Does that mean gun shows are even more popular for private sales?

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    Regular Member ~*'Phoenix'*~'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daylen View Post
    Florida has waiting periods on firearms purchases!? Does that mean gun shows are even more popular for private sales?
    Oh yeah, almost every table there says "Private Collection" some of them even say "must be FL resident w/ FL ID"
    lol
    American Government 101:
    The Executive branch's job is to provide celebrity figureheads for the pandering populace.
    The Legislative branch's job is to progressively destroy our freedoms for the "safety" of "We the Sheeple."
    The Judicial branch's job is to look like they're defending our freedoms against the abuses of the Legislative branch, only by token gestures that do not interfere is this pivotal process, but enough to deceive "We the People" into a false sense of security.

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    I see it as protecting the public from "NON" trust worthy people getting their hands on a firearm. their are a lot of irresponsible people out there which should never get their hands on a firearm.
    NO Law written is going to keep guns out of "NON" trust worthy people nor "irresponsible people out there which should never get their hands on a firearm".

    Laws only affect Law abiding people. Period, end of sentence.

    Read your own quote....

    "False is the idea of utility that sacrifices a thousand real advantages for one imaginary or trifling inconvenience; that would take fire from men because it burns, and water because one may drown in it; that has no remedy for evils except destruction. The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes. Thomas Jefferson"
    Last edited by xd shooter; 06-08-2011 at 08:59 PM.

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    Regular Member LibertyDeath's Avatar
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    It is rather ironic, the only laws governing possession should prohibit those law breakers from possessing a gun. Even though those people have proven they don't care about breaking laws.

  16. #16
    Regular Member ~*'Phoenix'*~'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyDeath View Post
    It is rather ironic, the only laws governing possession should prohibit those law breakers from possessing a gun. Even though those people have proven they don't care about breaking laws.
    +1
    LOL... Isn't this the exact same problem with "Gun-Free Zones"?
    American Government 101:
    The Executive branch's job is to provide celebrity figureheads for the pandering populace.
    The Legislative branch's job is to progressively destroy our freedoms for the "safety" of "We the Sheeple."
    The Judicial branch's job is to look like they're defending our freedoms against the abuses of the Legislative branch, only by token gestures that do not interfere is this pivotal process, but enough to deceive "We the People" into a false sense of security.

  17. #17
    Founder's Club Member ixtow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mach1chris View Post
    I completely understand where your coming from, but your missing my point. My question if you can read correctly, is would you rather have a responsible, and lawful person getting their hands on a firearm or a felon?... I never said anything about laws that would make it impossiable for irresponsible people to get their hands on a firearm.
    We get your point, it simply doesn't make sense.

    How can you write a law to prevent an action by people who don't care about breaking the law? When do words on a piece of paper stop anyone from doing anything? You can write it twice, say, a restraining order. Can you say that no one with a restraining order has ever been harmed? It's already illegal to kill. You can't make it MORE illegal.

    Is your daughter 'sort of' pregnant? Did your wife 'kinda' cheat on you? Is it 'more' wrong if the UPS guy, or the FedEx guy was involved?

    Me acting like a dick aside, it still doesn't make sense. Who are 'the wrong people?' How can the worst human beings on Earth be the ones that define who 'the wrong people' are?

    Do I want Pot Dealers to carry guns? Hell yeah! That's a dangerous business, what with cops shooting at them all the time... :-p

    Oh, I'm in a mood. Don't sweat it.
    "The fourth man's dark, accusing song had scratched our comfort hard and long..."
    http://edhelper.com/poetry/The_Hangm...rice_Ogden.htm

    https://gunthreadadapters.com

    "Be not intimidated ... nor suffer yourselves to be wheedled out of your Liberties by any pretense of Politeness, Delicacy, or Decency. These, as they are often used, are but three different names for Hypocrisy, Chicanery, and Cowardice." - John Adams

    Tyranny with Manners is still Tyranny.

  18. #18
    Regular Member 77zach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ixtow View Post
    Who are 'the wrong people?' How can the worst human beings on Earth be the ones that define who 'the wrong people' are?
    This.

    Not being a slight against all people working for the state, as I have family and friends who do. BUT, look at history. Look at it briefly. Powerful states allow the evil all individuals have to reign freely. People in charge of the state murdered hundreds of millions of people in the 20th century and destroyed incalculable wealth.

    If you and one hundred people were stranded on an island and one family said, "Only we can make spears, bows, daggers or other weapons. If you want a weapon you must ask us permission", the only thing we could do is laugh. Then, you'd never even turn your back to them or let that family help you because you'd think to yourself "what kind of sick bastards could even think of such a thing. What are they planning...." But that is precisely what all manner of "gun control" is. From background checks to the OC ban.
    Last edited by 77zach; 06-09-2011 at 08:29 AM.
    “If the natural tendencies of mankind are so bad that it is not safe to permit people to be free, how is it that the tendencies of these organizers are always good? Do not the legislators and their appointed agents also belong to the human race? Or do they believe that they themselves are made of a finer clay than the rest of mankind? ” -Bastiat

    I don't "need" to openly carry a handgun or own an "assault weapon" any more than Rosa Parks needed a seat on the bus.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by 77zach View Post
    Now nothing. Don't get me wrong, I'm glad it passed but since we don't have OC this really doesn't do a lot. So we get this and the doctor bill which does nothing for us while infringing a little on the first amendment. What an awesome session!
    I don't view it as infringing on the first amendment any more than not allowing a doctor to talk about patient records is an infringement. If you own a gun that is your business and a doctor shouldn't be able to ask about it unless it directly relates to the care that your recieving (such as a psych eval).

    Quote Originally Posted by ixtow View Post
    CWFL holders are 'special' only ones. They're better than the 'general public.'

    I don't show mine. I take the waiting period. I refuse to act like I'm better than 'the commoners.'
    While I don't agree with a waiting period, to me showing my CFP simply proves that I've already undergone the required waiting period; while people without one simply don't have a way to prove that they have already waited before.

    Quote Originally Posted by mach1chris View Post
    Having a firearm is a liberty, but dont you think liberty's can be taken away?... wouldnt you prefer a firearm in the hands of someone that has been proven trust worthy and not a felon?.... I don't see it as worthy of more privileges. I see it as protecting the public from "NON" trust worthy people getting their hands on a firearm. their are a lot of irresponsible people out there which should never get their hands on a firearm. All those irresponsible people do for lawful gun owners is give them a bad name... No offense bro, but in my opinion i think you should maybe change your way of thinking.
    So because someone out there can't legally own a gun I should have to wait to get mine? Especially in this day and age of the instant background check? As has been pointed out, criminals are going to break the law and get weapons so why should my liberties be infringed because of someone who is going to break the law regardless? Hell criminals typically pay less for guns anyways, so why would they want to pay more and leave a papertrail?

    Another question would be, if someone has gone to prison and served their time, then why are their rights restricted? Either they are rehabilitated and are safe to be released, or they aren't rehabilitated and shouldn't be released.

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