The Final Lap?

technician · Jun 8, 2011

safcrkr said:
I could be totally wrong about this.... but I don't like this development.

The only reason for a bill to go to a "joint" committee is to make changes to it.

I hope not! If there are any changes let's hope they are for the better. Guess we'll find out tomorrow. Will this be available to watch online?

safcrkr · Jun 8, 2011

technician said:
This is Paul's list (minus names in bold) but with the individual's e-mail address linked for ease.

Senator Alberta Darling, Co-Chair
Senator Luther Olsen
Senator Sheila Harsdorf
Senator Randy Hopper
Senator Lena Taylor
Senator Robert Jauch

Representative Robin Vos, Co-Chair
Representative Dan Meyer
Representative John Nygren
Representative Tamara Grigsby
Representative Jennifer Shilling

Taylor, Jauch, Grigsby, and Shilling are amongst the most vehement opponants to ANY CC bill as you'll find in WI... or anywhere else. Shilling's parents were murdered in an armed robbery in their business in ILL, and she blames guns, not criminals. Similar situation to Suzanna Hupp from Texas, but a totally opposite reaction. She's a fanatical anti.

safcrkr · Jun 8, 2011

technician said:
Will this be available to watch online?

If it is, it'll be here -> http://www.wiseye.com/

Not on the schedule as of now. Check again later today or tomorrow morning.

davegran · Jun 8, 2011

safcrkr said:
I could be totally wrong about this.... but I don't like this development.

The only reason for a bill to go to a "joint" committee is to make changes to it. ....

No. It's just part of the bill process to check fiscal stuff before passing it on. The Joint Committee (Sometimes known as the "Weiner Committee" thanks to Anthony....:monkey) does this for any bill from either house:

The Joint Finance Committee just looks at fiscal stuff:

Review of Other Fiscal Bills

The Committee's fiscal oversight duties include
the review of all other (non-budget) revenue or
spending bills. This responsibility emanates from a
statutory requirement [s. 13.093(1)] which specifies
that, "All bills introduced in either house of the legis-
lature for the appropriation of money, providing
for revenue or relating to taxation shall be referred
to the joint committee on finance before being
passed."

Here is a further description of what their responsibilities are: http://legis.wisconsin.gov/lfb/Infor...%20Finance.pdf
This bill is getting closer to a vote....

davegran · Jun 8, 2011

phred said:
I did not generate this file. It came from the Tea Party. It sure would be nice if it got into the hands of all Republican Legislators. Those of you in districts represented by them, feel free to pass this along to your Republican Legislators.

Thanks, Phred! I sent this PDF to my representative with this note:

RE: A plea for your constituents.

Dear Representative Loudenbeck,
As you have heard, SB93, the Concealed Carry bill is making it's way through the Senate. It is now in the Joint Committee on Finance, so it will be on the Senate floor soon.

This is an important bill for Wisconsin. Our law-abiding citizens have been unable to defend themselves for many, many years; literally hundreds of people have been robbed, injured and even killed with no way to prevent the violence. This bill can change all that. One of the most important components of the bill is the ability to carry a concealed weapon in Wisconsin, with some limitations, with no permit, or training; sometimes referred to as "Constitutional Carry". This is the part of the bill that will allow our low income people to defend themselves without having to pay onerous fees for permits and training. I have included a brochure which outlines the important aspects of Constitutional Carry.

The bill also allows for a permit process to enable people who travel to other states to be able to take advantage of those states' reciprocal concealed carry agreements. This part of the bill will mandate training and background checks plus a renewable permit.

In the absence of Concealed Carry in Wisconsin, I have held a Utah non-resident Concealed Carry permit for the past four years which allows me to carry in 30 other states, but not Wisconsin. What is wrong with this picture?

I am hoping and praying that you will sign on as a cosponsor of this bill and support it and vote for it when it comes to the Assembly; your constituents deserve to be able to defend themselves against the random violence which exists in Wisconsin. Self-preservation is a God-given right that should not be denied to any law-abiding citizen.

Thank you very much for your attention in this matter, Representative Loudenbeck.

Now I'll send it to my Democratic Senator, Tim Cullen.

Wisconsin Carry Inc. - Chairman · Jun 8, 2011

Interceptor_Knight said:
Threats never work. Those making them simply appear to be extremists instead of reasonable.

Dealing with a legislator is like being in a marriage. You must do EVERYTHING in your power to work WITH them (because you have to live with them) up until the point when you know beyond ANY doubt that its not going to work. Then you divorce and "its on".

Like it or not. We are married to our legislators right now.

There VERY well may come a time to 'make them pay' for their previous votes, but that won't be until the next election cycle in the primary when someone MORE freedom minded steps up to challenge.

You can always communicate your point and do it in a way that won't alienate the person who's help you need if you think about how you ask for something.

There IS a way to unequivocally communicate to a legislator that your future support for them depends on their support for you without being angry or threatening them.

Anger = burning the bridge.

springfield 1911 · Jun 8, 2011

Wisconsin Carry said:
Dealing with a legislator is like being in a marriage. You must do EVERYTHING in your power to work WITH them (because you have to live with them) up until the point when you know beyond ANY doubt that its not going to work. Then you divorce and "its on".

Like it or not. We are married to our legislators right now.

There VERY well may come a time to 'make them pay' for their previous votes, but that won't be until the next election cycle in the primary when someone MORE freedom minded steps up to challenge.

You can always communicate your point and do it in a way that won't alienate the person who's help you need if you think about how you ask for something.

There IS a way to unequivocally communicate to a legislator that your future support for them depends on their support for you without being angry or threatening them.

Anger = burning the bridge.

Not tonight legislator! I have a headache!:uhoh:

paul@paul-fisher.com · Jun 8, 2011

https://www.facebook.com/notes/vick...-reached-on-concealed-carry/10150212623123150

1. permit required
2. training required
3. open carry protected
4. transport rules changed to allow carrying in cars
5. no public database
6. uses florida model of training/licensing
7. 5 year renewal period.
8. military, hunters safety participants, law enforcement, former law enforcement, and anyone who has already received licensed instruction will be exempt from training requirement
9. no felony for carrying w/o permit
10. no fingerprinting for permit
11. training classes will be one day, and not require live-fire range (meaning sim-training will suffice)-- cost expected to be around $50 for training
12. 1000 ft school zone will be lifted for permit holders
13. no changes to long gun rules

i may have missed some stuff, but this is a good summary of the main points

darren will be on my milwaukee program on 1130 WISN at 10:06 tomorrow to answer questions.

We are getting ******!

safcrkr · Jun 8, 2011

paul@paul-fisher.com said:
https://www.facebook.com/notes/vick...-reached-on-concealed-carry/10150212623123150

We are getting ******!

Not registered on facebook, so link won't work. What exactly is that, and how reliable is the source?

EDIT: Nevermind, I got on (wife's registered).

WTF????

Glockface · Jun 8, 2011

? on # 8
8. military, hunters safety participants, law enforcement, former law enforcement, and anyone who has already received licensed instruction will be exempt from training requirement.

I was in the military,so am i exempt from paying the $50?

safcrkr · Jun 8, 2011

Glockface said:
? on # 8
8. military, hunters safety participants, law enforcement, former law enforcement, and anyone who has already received licensed instruction will be exempt from training requirement.

I was in the military,so am i exempt from paying the $50?

If you mean the estimated cost of training, if it's really like FL, yes... in FL to use military as training you need to supply a copy of a "DD214".

Jason in WI · Jun 8, 2011

safcrkr said:
Not registered on facebook, so link won't work. What exactly is that, and how reliable is the source?

EDIT: Nevermind, I got on (wife's registered).

WTF????

Link to Vicki McKenna's podcast with NRA rep Darren LaSorte. (Hour 3)

http://www.wiba.com/cc-common/podcast/single_page.html?podcast=upfront&selected_podcast=upfront%2520hr%25203%252006-08-11.mp3

Edited to add: Sorry, you edited while I was posting ...lol

Jason in WI · Jun 8, 2011

Posted by Vicki McKenna on her facebook page:

darren said that some of the GOP REFUSED to bend on permits or training, and refused to support concealed CONSTITUTIONAL CARRY.

I wonder if the names of those involved will leak out? Not really upset at the ones that said all along they wanted permits but I want to see how many tell us one thing and do another.

springfield 1911 · Jun 8, 2011

Jason in WI said:
Posted by Vicki McKenna on her facebook page:

I wonder if the names of those involved will leak out? Not really upset at the ones that said all along they wanted permits but I want to see how many tell us one thing and do another.

Sen. Wanggaard To start the list, Stated would support Constitutional carry if it came up. That was prior to being elected.

GLOCK21GB · Jun 8, 2011

cleveland said:
I have not spoken to a single person that was for constitutional carry, and I talk to A LOT of people. They all say the same thing. They want people to have to prove they are proficient, take training, etc... When I explain that the states that offer constitutional carry haven't had issues, that doesn't seem to effect them. I explain that I have taken a class for a permit and most of that class could be wrapped up in a small book or video. Again, it seems to have little effect on their opinion.

I think that it will be the fault of the pro constitutional crowd when it doesn't pass. Not because we didn't want this bill enough, but because we did not educate people properly. Lack of funds to advertise our view? Not enough interest from the general public? I don't know.

Amazing how many gun owners are totally IGNORANT of the 2nd Amendment, Ignorant of what FREEDOM really means..

safcrkr · Jun 8, 2011

Jason in WI said:
Link to Vicki McKenna's podcast with NRA rep Darren LaSorte. (Hour 3)

http://www.wiba.com/cc-common/podcast/single_page.html?podcast=upfront&selected_podcast=upfront%2520hr%25203%252006-08-11.mp3

Edited to add: Sorry, you edited while I was posting ...lol

Just got done listening to the 30 minute podcast. What's on Vicki McKenna's facebook page, and posted by Paul in this thread's post #28, will be announced at tomorrow's finance committee meeting, according to NRA's Darren LaSorte. So I'll say it again, like I did in post #20... "I don't like this delevopment" & "Ruh-Roh".

It's too early to say "I told you so". Paul said it best.. "We got ******!!! "

technician · Jun 8, 2011

paul@paul-fisher.com said:
https://www.facebook.com/notes/vick...-reached-on-concealed-carry/10150212623123150

We are getting ******!

This pretty much ruined my evening. We had a perfect shot at Constitutional Carry and our state government screwed us. Very interested to hear names, sounds like people were bent out of shape over training. Tomorrow will be a sad day...

safcrkr · Jun 8, 2011

technician said:
This pretty much ruined my evening. We had a perfect shot at Constitutional Carry and our state government screwed us. Very interested to hear names, sounds like people were bent out of shape over training. Tomorrow will be a sad day...

That Charlie Sykes guy didn't help much.

Drakon · Jun 8, 2011

Walker did this to us. My wife and I will be signing that recall petition come January.

ksks · Jun 8, 2011

Can folks specify what their concerns are please?

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