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OC/CC for cab drivers

MSC 45ACP

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Apr 23, 2009
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2,840
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Newport News, Virginia, USA
I do have a company in mind and have already been hired. I'm just waiting for the last "hoop" (the city permit). I'll play it like any of us would when they CC... If you're doing it right, no one will ever know. I've read the company policies for drivers and didn't see anything about carrying. Reminds me of another OC/CC habit we have... If they don't have a sign, don't ask for them to post one. I've read every scrap of paper put before me for signature very carefully and none of them has mentioned firearms. Don't Ask, Don't Tell. Been thinking about the pizza delivery gig, too.
There aren't too many things a disabled retiree can do to make ends meet and these two jobs may fit the bill.

I've been waiting for the VA to get back to me for YEARS about "retraining" for another career. Every time I call, they still say "Its in process..." Its been 5 years. I guess "fresh-returnees" get priority over us old farts that served more than 20 years and retired at the beginning of the current "war".

OCd at Suntrust bank, Verizon Wireless and around the "new" outdoor shopping mall at Oyster Point (whose name escapes me at the present time). Got a "hairy eyeball" from the unarmed Rental-Cop at Verizon. (I think she was jealous 'cause my Kimber is more perty than she.) The security guys at Oyster Point don't like OCers, either. I've had them ask me to leave a store or two after someone called them about MWAG. I keep track of the stores I've been asked to leave and don't return to them. The list is short. One of them is the jewelry store (whose prices are too high anyway).

msc
 
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45acpForMe

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Nov 21, 2008
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Yorktown, Virginia, USA
Does this apply to passengers or just the driver? because if the passengers can carry that then the driver is subject to robbery without self defence.

All those ordinances apply to the operator/driver not to the passengers. I did some research on knife laws since there is no preemption in VA for knives. Some of the ordinances are redundant (school property) others apply to knives over 3.something inches long (everyone and anyone) and others only apply to taxi drivers!??? I don't know why taxi drivers would have a restriction tighter than any other member of society. Go figure.

Here is the full list I found:

Amherst Co. VA 12-25 in any park to have in his possession any knife with a blade of more than three (3) inches
Ashland, VA 12-12 hidden from common observation, clasp knife having a blade more than (3 1/4) inches in length,
Chesterfield, Co. VA 15-210 to operate a taxicab at any time with a knife with a blade longer than 3"
Danville, VA 39-31. & 23-52. to operate a taxicab at any time with a knife with a blade longer than 3" / No Knife on buses and at bus stops
Farmville, VA 18-48 to have in his possession a clasp knife having a blade more than three and one-quarter (3 1/4) inches
Fauquier Co. VA 16-7 for any person to use, carry or have in his possession any knife with a blade of more than 3" in any park.
Hanover Co. VA 22.1-47. operate and drive a for-hire car with a knife with a blade longer than three (3) inches in length in his possession,
Henrico Co. VA 21-139. operate and drive a for-hire car with a knife with a blade longer than three (3) inches in length in his possession,
Norfolk, VA 47-6. on any public/private/parochial/elementary/middle/high school, including buildings & grounds, W/blade 3" or longer
Petersburg, VA 74-207. on any public/private/parochial/elementary/middle/high school, including buildings & grounds, W/blade 3" or longer
Pulaski, VA 70-132. Parades/Rallies/Noncommercial Gatherings No participant shall carry knives/edged weapons, either openly or concealed.
Richmond, VA 66-347. knife having a blade more than 3 1/4 inches in length./ drive a taxicab with a blade longer than three inches

The definition of clasp knife is any folding blade that will lock into the open position, so most folders.

The school ordinances are redundant because the current state law only allows folding knives of length less than 3" and anything else is defined as a weapon.
 
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2a4all

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Jul 1, 2008
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Newport News, Virginia, USA
As an armed (CC handgun) cab driver, you face a certain risk of not being able to fulfill your fare's contract. For example, you could be asked to drive to a location where firearms carry is restricted (school, regional jail in James City County, where you might need to exit the cab e.g. access the trunk) or onto a military base. Since service by any given cab is demand driven, there's no way for you to predict where your next fare will take you.

What contract, you may ask? The one that's implied when your fare gets into your cab.
 

peter nap

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Oct 16, 2007
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Valhalla
All those ordinances apply to the operator/driver not to the passengers. I did some research on knife laws since there is no preemption in VA for knives. Some of the ordinances are redundant (school property) others apply to knives over 3.something inches long (everyone and anyone) and others only apply to taxi drivers!??? I don't know why taxi drivers would have a restriction tighter than any other member of society. Go figure.

Here is the full list I found:

Amherst Co. VA 12-25 in any park to have in his possession any knife with a blade of more than three (3) inches
Ashland, VA 12-12 hidden from common observation, clasp knife having a blade more than (3 1/4) inches in length,
Chesterfield, Co. VA 15-210 to operate a taxicab at any time with a knife with a blade longer than 3"
Danville, VA 39-31. & 23-52. to operate a taxicab at any time with a knife with a blade longer than 3" / No Knife on buses and at bus stops
Farmville, VA 18-48 to have in his possession a clasp knife having a blade more than three and one-quarter (3 1/4) inches
Fauquier Co. VA 16-7 for any person to use, carry or have in his possession any knife with a blade of more than 3" in any park.
Hanover Co. VA 22.1-47. operate and drive a for-hire car with a knife with a blade longer than three (3) inches in length in his possession,
Henrico Co. VA 21-139. operate and drive a for-hire car with a knife with a blade longer than three (3) inches in length in his possession,
Norfolk, VA 47-6. on any public/private/parochial/elementary/middle/high school, including buildings & grounds, W/blade 3" or longer
Petersburg, VA 74-207. on any public/private/parochial/elementary/middle/high school, including buildings & grounds, W/blade 3" or longer
Pulaski, VA 70-132. Parades/Rallies/Noncommercial Gatherings No participant shall carry knives/edged weapons, either openly or concealed.
Richmond, VA 66-347. knife having a blade more than 3 1/4 inches in length./ drive a taxicab with a blade longer than three inches

The definition of clasp knife is any folding blade that will lock into the open position, so most folders.

The school ordinances are redundant because the current state law only allows folding knives of length less than 3" and anything else is defined as a weapon.

As far as the regulations for commercial drivers, I think the localities can regulate the possession of knives.
But if I understand the Dillon rule, a locality may not impose greater regulation than the state.

Since the state has no prohibition against specific blade length, except on school grounds and possibly a few other exceptions, the local laws forbidding specific blade lengths are unenforceable.

anyone have a cite on that.
 

TFred

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Oct 13, 2008
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Most historic town in, Virginia, USA
All those ordinances apply to the operator/driver not to the passengers. I did some research on knife laws since there is no preemption in VA for knives. Some of the ordinances are redundant (school property) others apply to knives over 3.something inches long (everyone and anyone) and others only apply to taxi drivers!??? I don't know why taxi drivers would have a restriction tighter than any other member of society. Go figure.

Here is the full list I found:

Amherst Co. VA 12-25 in any park to have in his possession any knife with a blade of more than three (3) inches
Ashland, VA 12-12 hidden from common observation, clasp knife having a blade more than (3 1/4) inches in length,
Chesterfield, Co. VA 15-210 to operate a taxicab at any time with a knife with a blade longer than 3"
Danville, VA 39-31. & 23-52. to operate a taxicab at any time with a knife with a blade longer than 3" / No Knife on buses and at bus stops
Farmville, VA 18-48 to have in his possession a clasp knife having a blade more than three and one-quarter (3 1/4) inches
Fauquier Co. VA 16-7 for any person to use, carry or have in his possession any knife with a blade of more than 3" in any park.
Hanover Co. VA 22.1-47. operate and drive a for-hire car with a knife with a blade longer than three (3) inches in length in his possession,
Henrico Co. VA 21-139. operate and drive a for-hire car with a knife with a blade longer than three (3) inches in length in his possession,
Norfolk, VA 47-6. on any public/private/parochial/elementary/middle/high school, including buildings & grounds, W/blade 3" or longer
Petersburg, VA 74-207. on any public/private/parochial/elementary/middle/high school, including buildings & grounds, W/blade 3" or longer
Pulaski, VA 70-132. Parades/Rallies/Noncommercial Gatherings No participant shall carry knives/edged weapons, either openly or concealed.
Richmond, VA 66-347. knife having a blade more than 3 1/4 inches in length./ drive a taxicab with a blade longer than three inches

The definition of clasp knife is any folding blade that will lock into the open position, so most folders.

The school ordinances are redundant because the current state law only allows folding knives of length less than 3" and anything else is defined as a weapon.
This is a sober reminder of why 15.2-915 is one of the most important RKBA laws on the books in the state of Virginia, and why it should be defended to the very end.

This mish-mash of laws is what you get when you let each locality decide what's best for you.

TFred
 

shulatt

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Jun 7, 2010
Messages
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Location
Virginia Beach, Virginia, United States
Pizza delivery woes

... Been thinking about the pizza delivery gig, too.
There aren't too many things a disabled retiree can do to make ends meet and these two jobs may fit the bill. ...
msc

Pizza delivery is not a carry friendly job :(
OC is virtually out of the question and even CC for employees is forbidden for most companies (at least the major chains). Some Mom and Pop shops may be more sensible about allowing their people to exercise their right to self defense but the corporate/franchise chains are more concerned about potential liability than personal safety of their personnel that are known (and expected) to carry cash and enact transactions at the customers locations.
Being that I work in the pizza business, I can't "officially" endorse ignoring a company's policy about the carry of firearms or any other weapon, but if you're doing it right, concealed means concealed and the only way they'll be made aware that you've disregarded their rule is if you're faced with the choice of keeping your job or keeping your life.
With that said, as far as I know (and someone please correct me if I'm mistaken), a companies policy against having a firearm on your person (outside of their physical storefront location) or in your personal vehicle does not have the force of law. The most they can do is terminate your employment for ignoring their rules.
Another potential complicate to carrying while delivering pizza (or anything else) is that you are obligated by the nature of the job to go to where the customer is located and rather often the customer is in a gun free zone such as a school, military facility, etc.

Shawn
 

Glockster

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Dec 24, 2010
Messages
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Houston
That is correct at least for Virginia Beach. I have done numerious ride alongs and you must sign an agreement to terms to be accepted. and in that you agree to not have any weapon.

In what I consider to be a touch of irony, when being briefed by the officer conducting the ride along you are also told that you may be requested to provide the officer with assistance if necessary (think that's on the form also). And to me, that sounds sort of silly given that I don't have access to a weapon to provide that particular assistance. And although you could say that assistance could be lots of things, each officer that I've road with has made a point of showing me how to use the radio, how to use the remote terminal, how to turn on all the lights AND asked if I know how to use firearms.


I expect you sign more than a few forms BEFORE riding along. Probably not even fine print prohibiting it. Straight out prohibited would be my guess. Tons of legal issues in a city/county vehicle and a non "trained" gun carrier.
 

MSC 45ACP

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Apr 23, 2009
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Newport News, Virginia, USA
I appreciate all the words of wisdom offered here. I see a great deal of experience and forethought in each and every post. It would be awkward carrying onto a military base or K-12 school. I never have been one to carry a knife to a gunfight and never learned much more than basic knife-fighting skills. As posted above... If you're doing it right, no one will ever know until you have to defend your life.
 

ocholsteroc

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Virginia, Hampton Roads, NC 9 miles away
I looked up hour wage for a pizza job, its like $5.75 :uhoh: One of the lowest paying jobs out there and you have to use your own car. I had a classmate work for delivery food service, he got robbed by 10 men. They just bullyed him into giving them the pizza's.
 
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AbNo

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Jun 8, 2007
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Shenandoah Valley, Virginia
Anyone have any thoughts/input on OC or CC as a cabbie? I thought I remember an OCDO “member” (or two) being cab drivers...

Well, I don't know about others, but cab drivers and former cabbies would include me.

I don't know how your area does cab driving, but when I drove in Harrisonburg you had to file a small business license. You were in business for yourself.

You then leased the cab. Dispatching service was included in the lease.

Under this setup, you were an independent agent, operating on your own, you just had a central call center to tell you where fares were waiting.

I'm of the opinion that, as an independent business man, you're free to make your own decisions.

Let's see, how did User (Dan) put it today? Something along the lines of

"When you're wearing your gun don't mention it, don't draw it, don't point to it, unless you need to use it." (note that I'm paraphrasing)

In other words, it's just like carrying anywhere else. It's not an issue until someone brings it up.

Why be the one to bring it up?


I also carried when I delivered pizzas a couple of years ago, even though we were specifically told we weren't supposed to.

Then again, they don't search peoples' vehicles there.
 

MSC 45ACP

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Newport News, Virginia, USA
They don't normally search vehicles at military bases, either... except when the THREATCON is higher (like right now) and probably again this coming Fall on The 10th Anniversary. Probably not a good time to be driving on base in a cab. Looks like a great time to examine all vehicles (that aren't privately owned by military members) with a fine-toothed comb. We'll play it by ear... See how the job goes, where I work, etc. No sense counting chickens before they hatch.
 

shulatt

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Jun 7, 2010
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Virginia Beach, Virginia, United States
I looked up hour wage for a pizza job, its like $5.75 :uhoh: One of the lowest paying jobs out there and you have to use your own car. I had a classmate work for delivery food service, he got robbed by 10 men. They just bullyed him into giving them the pizza's.

Sounds like old info (from before min wage increased)
I know for a fact that my drivers typically avg anywhere from $8-9 an hour on a slow crappy night where the customers are being tightfisted or simply aren't ordering much pizza to as much as $19-20 and hour plus on a good night.

Shawn
 

user

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Well, here's my considered opinion on this subject: shoulder holster. Too hard to draw from a hip-mounted holster while driving.
 

2a4all

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Newport News, Virginia, USA
Well, here's my considered opinion on this subject: shoulder holster. Too hard to draw from a hip-mounted holster while driving.
MSC is left handed (as am I). A cross draw holster works very well. I also have a Miami Vice rig, which would point the gun at the back seat.:eek:
 
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