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Now that we know we have been lied to...

S

safcrkr

Regular Member
Joined
May 16, 2009
Messages
318
Location
Vilas County, WI, ,
comp45acp said:
With all due respect, some of you really need to chill out and give some thought to all the "vote them out" rhetoric. It will do absolutely nothing to improve our situation. Do you think anyone in any state gets everything they want in any bill dealing with any issue? It just does not happen. I am solidly in the Constitution Carry camp but folks, the votes just weren't there! There is a variety of reasons for that, RINO radio talk show hosts, the recall elections, etc. But that said you have to realize we went from a state that has a 130 year history of ZERO lawful concealed carry to one of the best permit to carry laws in the country. That is no small first step. You can still open carry as you do now with no permit if you want. Instead of writing all these negative posts we must focus on education of the public and our elected representatives to improve rights. We are much better off having, for instance, Senator Luther Olson (a RINO for sure on many issues) in the State Senate than his opponent in the recall election. His opponent is going to be now Representative Fred Clark who is against ANY form of concealed carry no matter how restrictive. We need to be smart about this. If we don't like Olson we need to find a credible Constitutional Conservative to run against him in the primary election. That would be an improvement. But to just throw him out and end up with Clark would be a huge net loss. To lose control of the State Senate would be a serious defeat for any further improvement of our rights for the rest of the Senate term.
Click to expand...

Well said, and I agree. To vote against a RINO in a primary is one thing... but to vote for a Dem instead of a RINO to "teach the RINO a lesson" is political suicide, and insane. There's more at stake here than just gun rights.
 
HandyHamlet

HandyHamlet

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 17, 2010
Messages
2,772
Location
Terra, Sol
comp45acp said:
You can still open carry as you do now with no permit if you want.
Click to expand...

As I stated in another thread this is NOT TRUE. Here, let me rephrase it for you.

********.

I am completely surrounded by school zones. I can't legally step off my property while open carrying. I can't walk to any of my local stores, shops... can't walk around downtown. I have to drive to a location before I can open carry.



Instead of writing all these negative posts we must focus on education of the public and our elected representatives to improve rights.
Click to expand...

Thank you for the insight. None of us here ever thought of that.

:banghead::cuss::banghead::cuss::banghead::cuss:

WTF do you think everyone on this forum has been doing for a year?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? The only negativity I see in this forum are the suggestions that we sit back and do nothing.


You honestly think the Status quo is somehow working out to your benefit? Well bully for you. Don't do anything. That's exactly what they want you to do, expect you to do, and are counting on you to do.

No accountability. No responsibility. Happy ******* days for the politicians as they write more checks with our money.


wait. let me break out my mother******* happy dance.
 
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M

Max

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 30, 2008
Messages
335
Location
, Wisconsin, USA
You replace these RINOS when you have someone better to replace them with. Replacing them with someone worse then them in order to punish them is self-destructive. If true, liberty loving conservatives challenge them in a primaries support the true conservatives. Should the true conservatives loose, we must support the RINO instead of a flaming liberal democrat. IMHO
 
HandyHamlet

HandyHamlet

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 17, 2010
Messages
2,772
Location
Terra, Sol
I'm not Doug!

But thanks for bringing up the levity thing.

comp45acp PLEASE do not misconstrue my post as a personal attack against you. It is not. I write the way I write.

Like a dick.

Which in fact is my middle name.

However I am here to also assure you I am not what I eat.









Should I stop now?

:uhoh:


Max said:
Replacing them with someone worse then them in order to punish them is self-destructive.
Click to expand...

I disagree. That's what we have been doing for years and years and years. That's exactly what they WANT us to do. That's exactly what the know we will do. This way they can do WHATEVER they want with absolutely NO ramifications whatsoever.

It is time to make a stand. Look. We are already taking it standing up without so much as a thank you. If we have to sit through a term with another ******* in office in order to convince them all we are serious, well then that's what we have to do. We literally can not afford the status quo.

Time to man up.
 
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RR_Broccoli

RR_Broccoli

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 14, 2010
Messages
170
Location
WI
comp45acp said:
With all due respect, some of you really need to chill out and give some thought to all the "vote them out" rhetoric. It will do absolutely nothing to improve our situation. Do you think anyone in any state gets everything they want in any bill dealing with any issue? It just does not happen. I am solidly in the Constitution Carry camp but folks, the votes just weren't there! There is a variety of reasons for that, RINO radio talk show hosts, the recall elections, etc. But that said you have to realize we went from a state that has a 130 year history of ZERO lawful concealed carry to one of the best permit to carry laws in the country. That is no small first step. You can still open carry as you do now with no permit if you want. Instead of writing all these negative posts we must focus on education of the public and our elected representatives to improve rights. We are much better off having, for instance, Senator Luther Olson (a RINO for sure on many issues) in the State Senate than his opponent in the recall election. His opponent is going to be now Representative Fred Clark who is against ANY form of concealed carry no matter how restrictive. We need to be smart about this. If we don't like Olson we need to find a credible Constitutional Conservative to run against him in the primary election. That would be an improvement. But to just throw him out and end up with Clark would be a huge net loss. To lose control of the State Senate would be a serious defeat for any further improvement of our rights for the rest of the Senate term.
Click to expand...

I think you are missing a few key points.

The first one (and most subtle I think) is that we are ALREADY not getting what we want. Wait, we would STILL not get what we want if they were out? So?

In plainer English we have nothing left to lose. Anybody (and that includes politicians) should be wary of creating a situation where people think that.

Secondly, the one with the power wins. That's true for personal romantic relationships as well as politics. Thinking that "oh we can't get rid of 'our guy' because that means THEY get THEIR guy completely strips the power from the people who vote.

That results in "career politicians" who sell their actions to the highest bidder once they get in office, and who completely fabricate their pre-election persona in order to get to do that.

Politicians need to be frightened of lying. They need to be frightened of pulling a complete 180 from their campaigns like Walker hand half the republicans in the legislature have done. Seriously. REPUBLICANS LIE. This is true and you admitted it was the case and then shrugged your shoulders "we can't do anything or the other guy wins".

I have news for you. We don't HAVE a guy. We have some issues that are getting swept under the rug. Nobody up there cares about them. Never did, and lied about it when it was convenient.

It's time to remove everybody. And to keep doing it until the system is changed.
 
bigdaddy1

bigdaddy1

Regular Member
Joined
May 7, 2009
Messages
1,320
Location
Southsider der hey
Its really very simple. We elect officials based on what they say they will stand for and do once they reach office. If your an employer and a prospective employee tells you he can perform a specific task you need completed, and once hired you find he cant perform that task you don't keep him employed. You terminate that employee and find one that will work for what you need done. That is the electoral method, only it has been twisted into a joke. These politicians have been elected and remain in office far too long. We know they lie, cheat and steal to get into office and we turn the other way because the alternative MAY be worse. That may be very true, however NOT doing anything about it also sends a strong message to these vile people (I don't hide the fact that I despise politicians) that we will continue to blindly follow their leadership regardless of their actions. That is what I am bitching about, we are enabling these politicians by not holding them to task.
 
P

protias

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 18, 2008
Messages
7,308
Location
SE, WI
comp45acp said:
With all due respect, some of you really need to chill out and give some thought to all the "vote them out" rhetoric. It will do absolutely nothing to improve our situation. Do you think anyone in any state gets everything they want in any bill dealing with any issue? It just does not happen. I am solidly in the Constitution Carry camp but folks, the votes just weren't there! There is a variety of reasons for that, RINO radio talk show hosts, the recall elections, etc. But that said you have to realize we went from a state that has a 130 year history of ZERO lawful concealed carry to one of the best permit to carry laws in the country. That is no small first step. You can still open carry as you do now with no permit if you want. Instead of writing all these negative posts we must focus on education of the public and our elected representatives to improve rights. We are much better off having, for instance, Senator Luther Olson (a RINO for sure on many issues) in the State Senate than his opponent in the recall election. His opponent is going to be now Representative Fred Clark who is against ANY form of concealed carry no matter how restrictive. We need to be smart about this. If we don't like Olson we need to find a credible Constitutional Conservative to run against him in the primary election. That would be an improvement. But to just throw him out and end up with Clark would be a huge net loss. To lose control of the State Senate would be a serious defeat for any further improvement of our rights for the rest of the Senate term.
Click to expand...

We do not know if the votes were there or not. There was no vote taken on the original SB93. At both the Madison and Wausau public hearings, THE PEOPLE overwhelmingly supported Constitutional Carry.
 
bigdaddy1

bigdaddy1

Regular Member
Joined
May 7, 2009
Messages
1,320
Location
Southsider der hey
My opinion is doing nothing rewards failure. I'm not saying we all need to shift our votes and suddenly vote with the leftist agenda. What I am saying is these career politicians need to get the message that they do not have free reign. How does that happen? By voting those people out of office. How do you decide when you've had enough? That depends on you. I for one have had enough of lying and cheating politicians who feel they know what we REALLY want.
 
HandyHamlet

HandyHamlet

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 17, 2010
Messages
2,772
Location
Terra, Sol
Exactly.
I could care less about what Walker wants to see. Or what Philanderin' Flynn is worried about. Or how hard Nobbie's job is.

I don't pay them to think. I pay them to do what I say.
 
oak1971

oak1971

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 8, 2008
Messages
1,937
Location
Wisconsin, USA
Somehow I doubt they are shaking in their boots. We may be a vocal minority, but we are still a minority...for now.
 
bigdaddy1

bigdaddy1

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Joined
May 7, 2009
Messages
1,320
Location
Southsider der hey
Weren't the founding fathers a minority at one time? Am I comparing myself to the founding fathers, no but that doesn't mean I am going to wait for a large group to develop. I will want my voice being heard, regardless of who thinks who will hear it.
 
HandyHamlet

HandyHamlet

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 17, 2010
Messages
2,772
Location
Terra, Sol
Minority?

According to all the polls, the packed house in Madison at the hearing, the fact that Walker is in office, and the fact that the Wisco Constitution supports our Second Amendment Right says that we are the very vocal MAJORITY.

:cool:
 
J

Jason in WI

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 5, 2010
Messages
542
Location
Under your bed
HandyHamlet said:
Minority?

According to all the polls, the packed house in Madison at the hearing, the fact that Walker is in office, and the fact that the Wisco Constitution supports our Second Amendment Right says that we are the very vocal MAJORITY.

:cool:
Click to expand...

And let's not forget the last important election (supreme court) was only won on a mere 7k'ish margin. Not much, the base party voters wouldn't even need to vote against they need only find something else to do instead of going to the polls.




Sent from my DROID2 GLOBAL using Tapatalk
 
bigdaddy1

bigdaddy1

Regular Member
Joined
May 7, 2009
Messages
1,320
Location
Southsider der hey
Jason in WI said:
And let's not forget the last important election (supreme court) was only won on a mere 7k'ish margin. Not much, the base party voters wouldn't even need to vote against they need only find something else to do instead of going to the polls.




Sent from my DROID2 GLOBAL using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

I think I read there was only 17% turn out for that election, and that was actually higher than normal. So that slim lead doesn't impress me as to the direction the state is leaning.
 
wild boar

wild boar

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2011
Messages
445
Location
wisconsin
How many friends...

...does Walker have in Madison? How long has he had to even get his feet wet? If Flynn was an ally it would be a victory for Constitutional Carry. Just who can Walker faithfully caucus with, no one. Walker may be the man, he can say I want "A", then everyone else goes to work on it. Just once, get out of your shoes and stand in his! The one sided anger of some on these threads is a clear indication who would be the first to get up and slap the **** out of someone, and wouldn't that get us places. Just a thought.
 
Outdoorsman1

Outdoorsman1

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 1, 2011
Messages
1,248
Location
Silver Lake WI
oak1971 said:
Somehow I doubt they are shaking in their boots. We may be a vocal minority, but we are still a minority...for now.
Click to expand...

I have been considering the above point for some time now... and waiting for the right opportunity to bring it up for discussion....

I also agree that based on the entire state population and the ignorance of non-firearm people, radio talk show hosts, etc., etc.,. I also refquent a few sportsmans websites with forums on hunting, firearms, etc. I was suprised to see how many hunters and shooters were in favor of (or at least ok with) permits and trainning. Because we have a membership in the thousands and the Tea Party Group is also involed, that does not mean we are in a majority in the big picture. I attended the state meeting in Fitzberg (sp?) and there were what(?) maybe 300 - 350 people there. Some say the hearings in Wausau and Madison were "Packed" by Constitutional Carry supporters, but in reality, how many people were there? Compare that number to the combined number on "Anti's (for whatever reasons thet are anti)... and we just might be in a minority... I have considered that is why SB-93 went from a acceptable Consitutional Carry Bill to what we will end up with... The majority got what they wanted...

OK... let me have it...flame suit on....

Outdoorsman1
 
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