Monroe State Pen

Just some food for thought

The Monroe facility is a State Corrections facility. It's operated by the State and as such "preemption" wouldn't apply. It only applies if the City of Monroe, or Snohomish County, were to pass an ordinance regulating firearms on the premises of the "Prison". The State Law doesn't preempt the State's actions.

Only statute that would apply is the one pertaining to corrections facilities, not the preemption statute.

RSperry79 said:

i got the information from the receptionist. Not the best person, but as a visitor I'd like to stay one. I did talk to a lawyer and the did say that .300 doesn't apply as it has no local governing body to enforce the statute.

they did say that no where in the law does the facility have to allow me access, so the best advice is to, "leave it at home."

statistics show that felons that don't get visitors are at a greater risk to re-offend. we need a clear law that says, they cant refuse me just because I'm not a felon and exercise my rights as such.

sorry about the delay, too much drama in my life as of late.

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It is clear you are not reading or comprehending as I have laid this out for you in this thread a few times that 9.41.300 does not apply but under chapter covering 9.94 RCW Prisoners — correctional institutions Does !

So either take the time to read it and understand it or go unarmed for your entire trip.

Your misguided exercise is a great example that not all attorneys know all the laws and what applies, you gave him a specific question and he answered it correctly but did not know the RCW that applies that requires DOC to secure your weapon and return it upon your arrival and departure.

RCW 9.94.043 Deadly weapons -- Possession on premises by person not a prisoner -- Penalty.

A person, other than a person serving a sentence in a penal institution of this state, is guilty of possession of contraband on the premises of a state correctional institution in the first degree if, without authorization to do so, the person knowingly possesses or has under his or her control a deadly weapon on or in the buildings or adjacent grounds subject to the care, control, or supervision of a state correctional institution. Deadly weapon is used as defined in RCW 9A.04.110: PROVIDED, That such correctional buildings, grounds, or property are properly posted pursuant to RCW 9.94.047, and such person has knowingly entered thereon: PROVIDED FURTHER, That the provisions of this section do not apply to a person licensed pursuant to RCW 9.41.070 who, upon entering the correctional institution premises, proceeds directly along an access road to the administration building and promptly checks his or her firearm(s) with the appropriate authorities. The person may reclaim his or her firearm(s) upon leaving, but he or she must immediately and directly depart from the premises.

Possession of contraband on the premises of a state correctional institution in the first degree is a class B felony.

RCW 9.94.049" Correctional institution" and "state correctional institution" defined.

(1) For the purposes of this chapter, the term "correctional institution" means any place designated by law for the keeping of persons held in custody under process of law, or under lawful arrest, including state prisons, county and local jails, and other facilities operated by the department of corrections or local governmental units primarily for the purposes of punishment, correction, or rehabilitation following conviction of a criminal offense.

(2) For the purposes of RCW 9.94.043 and 9.94.045, "state correctional institution" means all state correctional facilities under the supervision of the secretary of the department of corrections used solely for the purpose of confinement of convicted felons.

Agreed. Everyone read what BD has posted. It is the RCW covering the state correctional institutes. And mirrors .300 to cover citizens.

gogodawgs said:

Agreed. Everyone read what BD has posted. It is the RCW covering the state correctional institutes. And mirrors .300 to cover citizens.

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Not only covers State Correctional Institutions it covers City and County Jails as well.

The chapter is addressing correctional institutions and deadly weapons providing prohibitions and what is this "PROVIDED FURTHER, That the provisions of this section do not apply to a person licensed pursuant to RCW 9.41.070 who, upon entering the correctional institution premises, proceeds directly along an access road to the administration building and promptly checks his or her firearm(s) with the appropriate authorities. The person may reclaim his or her firearm(s) upon leaving, but he or she must immediately and directly depart from the premises.

Oh I see you cannot understand who the appropriate authorities are! How about trying to attach that meaning to the one charged with the security and operation of the institution.

Try avoid adding wording to what the law states, that is what the Anti Gun Group and Brady Bunch do.

From the Urban Dictionary:

Picking the fly sh!t out of the pepper
1. The act of being nit-picky to a ridiculous degree.
2. To meticulously analyze minutia.

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You have to be an DOC employee with a CPL or a person exempt from needing a CPL to carry onto prison grounds. You also have to keep it secured in your vehicle and out of site. In fact, they just recently allowed DOC staff to carry after the murders of 6 LEO's in 2 months.

Monroe Corrections Center (FYI, it is not the state pen, that is in Walla Walla. It has Washington State Reformatory, that probably what you mean.) has different prisons with all custody levels, some of the prisons at Monroe have crew that work outside of the facility. What they fear is an inmate on one of these outside crews could arrange with a visitor to come with their legally allowed firearm and then the inmate "steals" it and escapes.

If you bring a weapon and are just a normal guy visiting an inmate you will be banned from all DOC facilities statewide for a long time, if not forever. There is a huge chance you will be arrested and charged with a felony.

If you are going there as a volunteer, as in a preacher or minister, etc. talk to the Community Involvement Program Coordinator or Correctional Program Manager covering that area. You might be classified as staff for purposes of that policy.

Here is the link for some of the DOC policies, concentrate on the 400 and/or 500 (If you are a volunteer) series.

If you are a regular INMATE VISITOR THEN FORGET ABOUT BRINGING YOUR FIREARM, IT IS ILLEGAL. Since you are a parent that includes you.

Get a room with a safe, leave the gun in your car and take a taxi, or leave your gun at home.

LibertyDeath said:

1. You have to be an DOC employee with a CPL or a person exempt from needing a CPL to carry onto prison grounds. You also have to keep it secured in your vehicle and out of site. In fact, they just recently allowed DOC staff to carry after the murders of 6 LEO's in 2 months.
2. Monroe Corrections Center (FYI, it is not the state pen, that is in Walla Walla. It has Washington State Reformatory, that probably what you mean.) has different prisons with all custody levels, some of the prisons at Monroe have crew that work outside of the facility. What they fear is an inmate on one of these outside crews could arrange with a visitor to come with their legally allowed firearm and then the inmate "steals" it and escapes.
3. If you bring a weapon and are just a normal guy visiting an inmate you will be banned from all DOC facilities statewide for a long time, if not forever. There is a huge chance you will be arrested and charged with a felony.
4. If you are going there as a volunteer, as in a preacher or minister, etc. talk to the Community Involvement Program Coordinator or Correctional Program Manager covering that area. You might be classified as staff for purposes of that policy.

Here is the link for some of the DOC policies, concentrate on the 400 and/or 500 (If you are a volunteer) series.

If you are a regular INMATE VISITOR THEN FORGET ABOUT BRINGING YOUR FIREARM, IT IS ILLEGAL. Since you are a parent that includes you.

Get a room with a safe, leave the gun in your car and take a taxi, or leave your gun at home.

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First of all it is clear you have not read the appropriate RCW's 9.94.043/.049 nor comprehend them.

1. DOC does not allow employees with a CPL to come on to ground of State Correctional Facility, only time they are allowed is when their position while working requires it.
2. Get a clue, Washington State has several Correctional Institutions through out the State which all fall under RCW 9.94.049 "(2) For the purposes of RCW 9.94.043 and 9.94.045, "state correctional institution" means all state correctional facilities under the supervision of the secretary of the department of corrections used solely for the purpose of confinement of convicted felons." Walla Walla State Penitentiary is a Correctional Facility, how do I know? I worked for them for years.
3.This is an assumption made by you in which you have demonstrated very clearly you have no idea on this subject.
4.Volunteers and Ministers or other outside programs are restricted to carry firearms while at these facilities.
5. The DOC Policies are for DOC Staff not Citizens as would be WAC versus RCW.

Good to see you want to give up your rights that are clearly there for your protection.

NavyLCDR said:

I don't give a crap about who the appropriate authorities are or aren't. What if NOBODY at the dang correctional institution will check in my gun because they say that they are not required to?

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Then you will have to leave the facility. I assure you that nobody will check your gun because the appropriate authorities have decided that is something that they will not do. They will only do it for law enforcement officers that are transporting an inmate to or from the facility.

NavyLCDR said:

Can you PLEASE just answer the damn question asked?

I don't give a crap about who the appropriate authorities are or aren't. What if NOBODY at the dang correctional institution will check in my gun because they say that they are not required to?

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As with any other law that is violated one must pursue an avenue to have to observed.
Yet here you are supporting anti gun activities while proclaiming to being pro gun and even ignoring State Law to push an agenda of more to the liking of dislike of my post!

You know what really surprises me Navy is how much time you spend on here and how much of that time is with Government Property and Time to do so?
So many dates and times that can be correlated to times at work while on duty.

BigDave said:

First of all it is clear you have not read the appropriate RCW's 9.94.043/.049 nor comprehend them.

1. DOC does not allow employees with a CPL to come on to ground of State Correctional Facility, only time they are allowed is when their position while working requires it.
2. Get a clue, Washington State has several Correctional Institutions through out the State which all fall under RCW 9.94.049 "(2) For the purposes of RCW 9.94.043 and 9.94.045, "state correctional institution" means all state correctional facilities under the supervision of the secretary of the department of corrections used solely for the purpose of confinement of convicted felons." Walla Walla State Penitentiary is a Correctional Facility, how do I know? I worked for them for years.
3.This is an assumption made by you in which you have demonstrated very clearly you have no idea on this subject.
4.Volunteers and Ministers or other outside programs are restricted to carry firearms while at these facilities.
5. The DOC Policies are for DOC Staff not Citizens as would be WAC versus RCW.

Good to see you want to give up your rights that are clearly there for your protection.

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1. Yes, they do.
2. I have a clue. Monroe Correctional Complex has several prisons under the control of one Superintendent. Washington State Reformatory, Twin Rivers Unit, Special Offender Unit, and Minimum Security Unit. Washington State Penitentiary is in Walla Walla not called Walla Walla State Penitentiary. Since you worked there you know that though.
3. This is not an assumption. It is fact.
This is the visit guidelines part of DOC Policy regarding visits.
4. They cannot bring them inside but they may be considered staff for purposes of item 1.
5. All employees, contract staff, volunteers, and inmates have to follow policy. Visitors have to follow visit related policy if they wish to remain allowed to visit.

I am not giving up my rights at all, nor am I saying that I agree with it. I am saying what the facts are. If the OP still wants to visit his child at a prison he has to follow some procedures or get those procedures changed.

NavyLCDR said:

I am asking what legal recourse does a person have if the authorities at a correctional institution will not take in a firearm. And you answered, "none". Question finally answered.

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Not entirely correct.

The "recourse" is covered in the First Amendment:

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

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http://learningtogive.org/papers/paper204.html

This right grants people not only the freedom to stand up and speak out against injustices they feel are occurring, but also grants the power to help change those injustices.

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It may not provide the "instant gratification" we all seem to want, but it its an avenue available to all Citizens. If Government Agencies are not following the rules set forth by Government itself, the right to "petition" is there and one can "take it on up the line".

Dave's answer of "None" was not totally correct. More correctly stated, "there is no immediate course of action available, it will take time to receive redress".

LibertyDeath, you are so misguided and uninformed.

http://www.doc.wa.gov/facilities/default.asp

Here is just the prisons not to mention all the other facilities that are included in the definition in RCW 9.94.049 (2) For the purposes of RCW 9.94.043 and 9.94.045, "state correctional institution" means all state correctional facilities under the supervision of the secretary of the department of corrections used solely for the purpose of confinement of convicted felons.

List of Washington State Prisons

Airway Heights Corrections Center
Cedar Creek Corrections Center
Clallam Bay Corrections Center
Coyote Ridge Corrections Center
Larch Corrections Center
Mission Creek Corrections Center for Women
Monroe Correctional Complex
Olympic Corrections Center
Stafford Creek Corrections Center
Washington Corrections Center
Washington Corrections Center for Women
Washington State Penitentiary

Are they likely to receive you with open arms and a cup of coffee, not likely but that does not take away from being able to access and check your firearm at the administration building by them, as with anything else in this forum sometimes we must stand our ground for what is provided for by law, otherwise no one would be open carrying, would they?

Why are you supporting an illegal act that may or may not be purported by Monroe Correctional Complex? Do you also support being denied access to other areas you have a legal right to be by law?

Here we have had two incidents in Vancouver WA concerning open carry which we all know is legal with in the State but nothing telling us we can with in the RCW's and yet we have the wording to legally access these areas and you, with a couple of others want to give up and surrender your rights, amazing.

NavyLCDR said:

I am asking what legal recourse does a person have if the authorities at a correctional institution will not take in a firearm. And you answered, "none". Question finally answered. I don't understand why that was so hard to do. Of course, it's impossible to do without your smarta$$ comments.

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This is your typical recourse when addressing me while misquoting me!
There is legal recourse if one wants to pay the expense to push it, thus far I am awaiting a response from the Department of Corrections, oh hmm that would be a first step in any process.

NavyLCDR said:

OK. But there is NOTHING in the CURRENT statutes that REQUIRES them to accept the gun. It's not as simple as a courthouse that won't accept a gun.

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9.94.043 Deadly weapons -- Possession on premises by person not a prisoner -- Penalty.

• PROVIDED FURTHER, That the provisions of this section do not apply to a person licensed pursuant to RCW 9.41.070 who,
• upon entering the correctional institution premises (RCW9.94.049 (2) For the purposes of RCW 9.94.043 and 9.94.045, "state correctional institution" means all state correctional facilities under the supervision of the secretary of the department of corrections used solely for the purpose of confinement of convicted felons.),
• proceeds directly along an access road to the administration building and promptly checks his or her firearm(s) with the appropriate authorities.
• The person may reclaim his or her firearm(s) upon leaving, but he or she must immediately and directly depart from the premises.

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This is directing the Department of Corrections to accept and keep safe and returned to you upon departure.

Is it as descriptive as 9.41.300 for the courts, no but still direct in securing the firearms with those visiting and with a CPL.

What this comes down to is Navy you are just nic picking and wanting a confrontation.
A person of proclaimed position with in our military would be able to arrive at conclusion, our legislatures have provided this exception.

BigDave said:

This is directing the Department of Corrections to accept and keep safe and returned to you upon departure.

Is it as descriptive as 9.41.300 for the courts, no but still direct in securing the firearms with those visiting and with a CPL.

What this comes down to is Navy you are just nic picking and wanting a confrontation.
A person of proclaimed position with in our military would be able to arrive at conclusion, our legislatures have provided this exception.

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I am in concurrence with BigDave on this Navy. I would think a phone call to the prison informing them of what you will be doing and the statute that you will be following would solve the issue. Excellent job BigDave.

Thank you Gogo it is appreciated, I have approached Yakima County to correct this as well.
Yakima County Jail has a Custody and a Public side to their jail and in their downstairs of the Public side houses 3 court rooms and one must pass through the lobby of the Public Side, through metal detectors but refuse to secure a citizen firearm, even though RCW's 9.41.300; 9.94.043/049. They also apply this at their video visiting site which was a minimum security jail miles away but houses Home Detention Staff and their stance is as some try to propagate as they are not required to in RCW 9.41.300 which they are not, but have not yet answered to RCW 9.94.043/049 (which is in the works) but want to quote RCW 9.41.300 and RCW 9.94.045 which is picking and choosing as most anti gun groups like to do.
I have had success with the other ordinances being repealed in Yakima County and we will see if I am successful on this as well.

Note the City of Yakima are in compliance as their justice center houses, courts, jail, police department and 911 dispatch.

This is not my first rodeo :lol:

As far as 9.94 goes that law merely allows correctional facilities to check firearms of CPL holders, it does not require it. At least that is what I have been told and what policy dictates. I am not about to lose my job because I check a firearm in violation of policy. If the OP brings a firearm to MCC sure he might not be prosecuted but his visit rights will most likely be revoked, even if he follows the letter of the law and tries to check his weapon. Not saying that it is right but that is how it is.

LibertyDeath said:

As far as 9.94 goes that law merely allows correctional facilities to check firearms of CPL holders, it does not require it. At least that is what I have been told and what policy dictates. I am not about to lose my job because I check a firearm in violation of policy. If the OP brings a firearm to MCC sure he might not be prosecuted but his visit rights will most likely be revoked, even if he follows the letter of the law and tries to check his weapon. Not saying that it is right but that is how it is.

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That is how you think it is, and what is surprising here is you are of the same caliber as Officers on the streets violating the law and rights of citizens!
Liberty Death does not really fit your position, does it?

LOL Allows for correctional facilities to check firearms, where does it say can, may or might, it doesn't but it does give steps and directions to accomplish the task.

RCW 9.94.043 (edited for emphasis)
A person, other than a person serving a sentence in a penal institution of this state, is guilty of possession of contraband on the premises of a state correctional institution in the first degree if, without authorization to do so, the person knowingly possesses or has under his or her control a deadly weapon on or in the buildings or adjacent grounds subject to the care, control, or supervision of a state correctional institution. Deadly weapon is used as defined in RCW 9A.04.110:
PROVIDED, That such correctional buildings, grounds, or property are properly posted pursuant to RCW 9.94.047, and such person has knowingly entered thereon:
PROVIDED FURTHER, That the provisions of this section do not apply to a person licensed pursuant to RCW 9.41.070 who,

• upon entering the correctional institution premises,
• proceeds directly along an access road to the administration building and promptly checks his or her firearm(s) with the appropriate authorities.
• The person may reclaim his or her firearm(s) upon leaving, but he or she must immediately and directly depart from the premises.

Why would there be a provision to pick up your firearm upon leaving? because they are to secure the firearm while at the institution.

As to your concept that visiting is a privilege, visiting can be revoked for a legal cause not for any whim, try telling that to a judge.

NavyLCDR said:

If visitation a right or a privilege? That would make a huge difference in the success or failure of a lawsuit, I would think.

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Don't kid yourself, inmates have easy access to the courts and will use it to fit their need, go ahead cancel that visit for someone coming to visit is exercising their right to bear arms and provided for in State Law. And the cost, non existent as most inmates are usually with our funds and they must have access to the courts.