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Thread: And so it starts, Where will it end, and how far will it go?

  1. #1
    Regular Member amzbrady's Avatar
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    And so it starts, Where will it end, and how far will it go?

    I wonder how long it will take for them to step in handguns and ammo. Doesnt look like the NRA is able to do much even with all their supporters who send them money.
    http://www.washingtonpost.com/politi...I9H_story.html
    If you voted for Obama to prove you are not a racist...
    what will you do now to prove you are not stupid?

    "The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism. But, under the name of "liberalism," they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program, until one day America will be a socialist nation, without knowing how it happened." - Norman Thomas

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    Regular Member amzbrady's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLCDR View Post
    Gun dealers already must, by law, report multiple sales of handguns (more than 1 in a five working day period) in all 50 states.
    but they must get rid of them after 2 years. I just wonder how long till the ammo registration starts?
    If you voted for Obama to prove you are not a racist...
    what will you do now to prove you are not stupid?

    "The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism. But, under the name of "liberalism," they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program, until one day America will be a socialist nation, without knowing how it happened." - Norman Thomas

    "They who can who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve niether liberty nor safety." - Ben Franklin

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    Campaign Veteran Bookman's Avatar
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    You and i both know that this is BS legislation designed to draw attention away from the F&F fiasco where the un dealers VOLUNTARILY reported multiple and suspected straw sales to the ATF and were told "Don't worry, we've got it". Look where that got them.

    What they need is a law saying that US Government agencies can't run guns.
    "All that is required for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke


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    Regular Member Difdi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bookman View Post
    What they need is a law saying that US Government agencies can't run guns.
    Such a law already exists. The laws against gun smuggling don't have a law enforcement exemption.

    But when it's the people charged with enforcing the smuggling laws, who also happen to be in charge of investigating violations, and choosing whether or not to prosecute violators being the ones who are violating the law, it's not terribly surprising that nobody ends up in jail for it.

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    Regular Member Dave_pro2a's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLCDR View Post
    Gun dealers already must, by law, report multiple sales of handguns (more than 1 in a five working day period) in all 50 states.
    Well, that makes it ok then.

    [/sarcasm]

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    Founder's Club Member thebigsd's Avatar
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    As Bookman already stated this is just an attempt to make the American populace believe that all of the problems in Mexico stem from gun stores in just FOUR states. C'mon, are people really going to fall for that. The ATF is expecting 18,000 reports, wonder what they pulled that number out of....
    "When seconds count between living or dying, the police are only minutes away."

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    Regular Member amlevin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thebigsd View Post
    The ATF is expecting 18,000 reports, wonder what they pulled that number out of....
    It's referred to in some circles by the Latin term "Extractimus ex wazoo".
    "If I shoot all the ammo I am carrying I either won't need anymore or more won't help"

    "If you refuse to stand up for others now, who will stand up for you when your time comes?"

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    Campaign Veteran Right Wing Wacko's Avatar
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    It requires about 8,500 dealers operating in the border states of California, Arizona, New Mexico and Texas to alert authorities when a person buys within five days two or more semiautomatic rifles greater than .22-caliber with detachable magazines.

    Ahh... so AR-15's are exempt!
    Last edited by Right Wing Wacko; 07-12-2011 at 11:18 PM.

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    Founder's Club Member thebigsd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Right Wing Wacko View Post
    It requires about 8,500 dealers operating in the border states of California, Arizona, New Mexico and Texas to alert authorities when a person buys within five days two or more semiautomatic rifles greater than .22-caliber with detachable magazines.

    Ahh... so AR-15's are exempt!
    How so?
    "When seconds count between living or dying, the police are only minutes away."

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    Campaign Veteran Right Wing Wacko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thebigsd View Post
    How so?
    .223 Remington is 22 caliper

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    Founder's Club Member thebigsd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Right Wing Wacko View Post
    .223 Remington is 22 caliper
    I follow, but somehow I don't think you'll win that argument with the ATF...lol
    "When seconds count between living or dying, the police are only minutes away."

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    Campaign Veteran Right Wing Wacko's Avatar
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    Dispite what the ATF Says, federal LAW says:

    (g)(1)(A) Each licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, and licensed dealer shall maintain such records of importation, production, shipment, receipt, sale, or other disposition of firearms at his place of business for such period, and in such form, as the Attorney General may by regulations prescribe. Such importers, manufacturers, and dealers shall not be required to submit to the Attorney General reports and information with respect to such records and the contents thereof, except as expressly required by this section.

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    Regular Member Whitney's Avatar
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    The Feds will do what they want

    Quote Originally Posted by Right Wing Wacko View Post
    Dispite what the ATF Says, federal LAW says:

    (g)(1)(A) Each licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, and licensed dealer shall maintain such records of importation, production, shipment, receipt, sale, or other disposition of firearms at his place of business for such period, and in such form, as the Attorney General may by regulations prescribe. Such importers, manufacturers, and dealers shall not be required to submit to the Attorney General reports and information with respect to such records and the contents thereof, except as expressly required by this section.
    Title 18 Chapter 44 Section 923 (g 5A and 5B). Firearms Licensing

    (5) (A) Each licensee shall, when required by letter issued by the Attorney General, and until notified to the contrary in writing by the Attorney General, submit on a form specified by the Attorney General, for periods and at the times specified in such letter, all record information required to be kept by this chapter or such lesser record information as the Attorney General in such letter may specify.


    (B) The Attorney General may authorize such record information to be submitted in a manner other than that prescribed in subparagraph (A) of this paragraph when it is shown by a licensee that an alternate method of reporting is reasonably necessary and will not unduly hinder the effective administration of this chapter. A licensee may use an alternate method of reporting if the licensee describes the proposed alternate method of reporting and the need therefor in a letter application submitted to the Attorney General, and the Attorney General approves such alternate method of reporting.

    So... lets contort this BS some more. Since the statement of Deputy Attorney General James Cole does not specify "rim fire" 22 caliber weapons what is the real intent of this? Now the DOJ has to send each and every "FFL Dealer" notice of the new "requirement". FFL Dealers must comply or face penalties and continue reporting until notified to the contrary. Section 924 covers penalties.

    ~Whitney
    The problem with America is stupidity.
    I'm not saying there should be capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?

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    Regular Member Difdi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Right Wing Wacko View Post
    .223 Remington is 22 caliper
    Well, technically, .223 is larger than .22, given the extra .003 of diameter. It's not much bigger, but it is indeed bigger.

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    Regular Member amlevin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Difdi View Post
    Well, technically, .223 is larger than .22, given the extra .003 of diameter. It's not much bigger, but it is indeed bigger.
    ACTUALLY, the .223 is a "Name" not a diameter of the bullet. a .22LR bullet and .223 bullets are .224" in diameter.



    Caliber "Name" doesn't indicate the bullet diameter. .45's are .452" to .454"; .38 Spl=.357"; and the .380 is only .355" in diameter.
    "If I shoot all the ammo I am carrying I either won't need anymore or more won't help"

    "If you refuse to stand up for others now, who will stand up for you when your time comes?"

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    Regular Member Difdi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by amlevin View Post
    ACTUALLY, the .223 is a "Name" not a diameter of the bullet. a .22LR bullet and .223 bullets are .224" in diameter.



    Caliber "Name" doesn't indicate the bullet diameter. .45's are .452" to .454"; .38 Spl=.357"; and the .380 is only .355" in diameter.
    I stand corrected. But that's actually worse than the point I raised. If .22 ammo is actually larger than .22, wouldn't that mean that all such .22 ammo is subject to the reporting requirement?

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    Campaign Veteran MSG Laigaie's Avatar
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    If .22 ammo is actually larger than .22, wouldn't that mean that all such .22 ammo is subject to the reporting requirement?
    Now look what you have done! This will force batf to think. Imagine the paperwork.

  18. #18
    Regular Member Freedom First's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Difdi View Post
    ...But when it's the people charged with enforcing the smuggling laws, who also happen to be in charge of investigating violations, and choosing whether or not to prosecute violators being the ones who are violating the law, it's not terribly surprising that nobody ends up in jail for it.
    Damn fine writing. Great job of exposing an ignored fact to an oblivious world. Thank you and keep posting!
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  19. #19
    Regular Member amlevin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Difdi View Post
    I stand corrected. But that's actually worse than the point I raised. If .22 ammo is actually larger than .22, wouldn't that mean that all such .22 ammo is subject to the reporting requirement?
    Quote Originally Posted by MSG Laigaie View Post
    Now look what you have done! This will force batf to think. Imagine the paperwork.
    Not really, they just go by "Caliber", not "Caliper"
    "If I shoot all the ammo I am carrying I either won't need anymore or more won't help"

    "If you refuse to stand up for others now, who will stand up for you when your time comes?"

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    Update

    Good news for a start check this link




    www.nraila.org/Legislation/Read.aspx?ID=6989

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