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Thread: CCW and Knives

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    Regular Member phleye's Avatar
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    CCW and Knives

    So with the CCW bill passed, it says a "weapon" is a knife that is not a switchblade (I know there is more, but I'm just wondering about the knife part).

    Does this mean we can carry knives concealed too?
    Is there a size limit?
    Folding or fixed blade?

    Thanks!!
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    First of All

    Quote Originally Posted by phleye View Post
    So with the CCW bill passed, it says a "weapon" is a knife that is not a switchblade (I know there is more, but I'm just wondering about the knife part).

    Does this mean we can carry knives concealed too?
    Is there a size limit?
    Folding or fixed blade?

    Thanks!!
    Why don't you take a stab (pun intended) at answering your own questions? It will be good practice in research and you will get more satisfaction than being spoon-fed by somebody whose knowledge is unknown to you.

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    Regular Member Outdoorsman1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phleye View Post
    So with the CCW bill passed, it says a "weapon" is a knife that is not a switchblade (I know there is more, but I'm just wondering about the knife part).

    Does this mean we can carry knives concealed too?
    Is there a size limit?
    Folding or fixed blade?

    Thanks!!
    I have basically asked the same question in other threads....

    Yes it means we can carry knives concealed....

    There is no mention of size limit... So I am thinking if it is concealed, then no limt based on STATE statutes, but I was told that local municipalities (cities, counties, etc.) have differnt local ordanences on blade length...so it coud vary based on location....

    Folding or fixed blades are also not disussed, so I am thinking either woudl be legal if concealed. As you already mentioned, the only "blade" specifically discussed as NOT legal is the "switchblade"....

    Anybody..... Please correct me if I am wrong... as I am also interested in this subject....

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    Regular Member Outdoorsman1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glock34 View Post
    A - COLD STEEL...Kukri is calling me
    Ahhhhhh ... excellent choice ... Hans Solo would be proud....

    With that "weapon" the Force will most certainly be with you....as you are already a fighter against the Dark Side....

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    Regular Member oliverclotheshoff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Outdoorsman1 View Post
    I have basically asked the same question in other threads....

    Yes it means we can carry knives concealed....

    There is no mention of size limit... So I am thinking if it is concealed, then no limt based on STATE statutes, but I was told that local municipalities (cities, counties, etc.) have differnt local ordanences on blade length...so it coud vary based on location....
    Folding or fixed blades are also not disussed, so I am thinking either woudl be legal if concealed. As you already mentioned, the only "blade" specifically discussed as NOT legal is the "switchblade"....

    Anybody..... Please correct me if I am wrong... as I am also interested in this subject....

    Outdoorsman1
    i did not think local could have a more strict law than the state level
    Last edited by oliverclotheshoff; 07-12-2011 at 12:00 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by oliverclotheshoff View Post
    i did not think local could have a more strict law than the state level
    Does a knife go bang and eject a bullet?

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    Founder's Club Member Brass Magnet's Avatar
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    66.0409 Doesn't preempt ordinances dealing with knives, only guns. SB93, from what I've read, doesn't change that. So, localities can ban knives by ordinance.
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    Regular Member phleye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by apjonas View Post
    Why don't you take a stab (pun intended) at answering your own questions? It will be good practice in research and you will get more satisfaction than being spoon-fed by somebody whose knowledge is unknown to you.
    You could have that response for every question anyone asks on any forum on the Internet, so why single me out?????

    I did look myself and I'm so sorry to bother you. I just couldn't find any size restriction but thanks for your input that didn't help at all. I also love reading posts that don't address the topic /sarcasm/
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    Regular Member phleye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Outdoorsman1 View Post
    I have basically asked the same question in other threads....

    Yes it means we can carry knives concealed....

    There is no mention of size limit... So I am thinking if it is concealed, then no limt based on STATE statutes, but I was told that local municipalities (cities, counties, etc.) have differnt local ordanences on blade length...so it coud vary based on location....

    Folding or fixed blades are also not disussed, so I am thinking either woudl be legal if concealed. As you already mentioned, the only "blade" specifically discussed as NOT legal is the "switchblade"....

    Anybody..... Please correct me if I am wrong... as I am also interested in this subject....

    Outdoorsman1

    Do you know where the other threads are? I'd like to read them and if I had known about them I certainly wouldn't have started this one. Thanks Outdoorsman 1.
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    Regular Member Outdoorsman1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phleye View Post
    Do you know where the other threads are? I'd like to read them and if I had known about them I certainly wouldn't have started this one. Thanks Outdoorsman 1.
    Here.....

    http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...website-but...

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    Quote Originally Posted by oliverclotheshoff View Post
    i did not think local could have a more strict law than the state level
    Thats only for firearms... For instance, a town just down the road from "home", cant sell ANY alcohol, (including beer) after 9pm. Have to go outside city limits to do so... (Other side of the interstate... By Rudig Jensens... Catch my drift?)
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    The trouble is Wis never really had a definition what a conceal weapon is or was. Some one could be arrested for CCW for just about any thing. They had hidden on their person.

    I heard that in Milw county that you would get arrested for any knife that had a blade length of over 3 inchs. That length is not any place in state law.

    Other places larger knifes are working tools and would not get you arrested unless you use them as a weapon.

    Other states have had this same trouble with knifes and have adopted knife preemtion. That would be a good thing for Wis to do and to do away with the stuiped switchblade law.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Firearms Iinstuctor View Post
    The trouble is Wis never really had a definition what a conceal weapon is or was. Some one could be arrested for CCW for just about any thing. They had hidden on their person.

    I heard that in Milw county that you would get arrested for any knife that had a blade length of over 3 inchs. That length is not any place in state law.

    Other places larger knifes are working tools and would not get you arrested unless you use them as a weapon.

    Other states have had this same trouble with knifes and have adopted knife preemtion. That would be a good thing for Wis to do and to do away with the stuiped switchblade law.
    Read 941.23... Here is a link...
    https://docs.legis.wisconsin.gov/sta...tes/941/III/23
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    Regular Member oliverclotheshoff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mlutz View Post
    Thats only for firearms... For instance, a town just down the road from "home", cant sell ANY alcohol, (including beer) after 9pm. Have to go outside city limits to do so... (Other side of the interstate... By Rudig Jensens... Catch my drift?)
    that keeps everyone in the bar drinking including the cops lol

    i know exactly the town you speak of i did some growing up there

    i did not know some towns still had that ordinance in effect i thought that was left at the wayside like a used rubber
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    Let's Not Get Emotional

    Quote Originally Posted by phleye View Post
    You could have that response for every question anyone asks on any forum on the Internet, so why single me out?????

    I did look myself and I'm so sorry to bother you. I just couldn't find any size restriction but thanks for your input that didn't help at all. I also love reading posts that don't address the topic /sarcasm/
    If my response was too harsh, I apologize. You are not the first person to elicit this type of response from me and probably won't be the last. That is why I irritate a lot of people even though I think my comment is fair. But to your question -- I respond like this to people that I think (I will concede that I may be wrong in your case) believe themselves to be so important that they can't spare the minimal amount of time and effort to find the answer to a question. Even worse is the person who gives the answer as he asks the question. You did say:

    So with the CCW bill passed, it says a "weapon" is a knife that is not a switchblade (I know there is more, but I'm just wondering about the knife part).

    Does this mean we can carry knives concealed too?
    Is there a size limit?
    Folding or fixed blade?
    The first question is like asking "SB93 says to obtain a license a background check is required. Does this mean applicants must undergo a background check?"

    Now your other questions may reasonable to the extent that Act 35 does not provide specifics about the knife other than no switchblades permitted. As many here shout from time to time - if it isn't stated as being illegal - it's legal. That is the default condition is legality. Are you asking about the new law? If so, you can surely read it to see if length or type of blade is addressed elsewhere. It is certainly possible that there is another statute or local ordinance that relates to this subject. If you are a knife aficionado, I would expect you to be familiar with these laws. But if you gained interest in carrying a knife solely because of the new law and you don't feel competent to determine what the answers might be, there is nothing wrong with requesting assistance from people who might be more expert in the area. I would still caution you to verify anything you are told. Only you know your motivation for asking and I will give you the benefit of any doubt. I still think the first question is a little dopey but you might have been in a hurry. So don't let yourself be impacted by anything I said. I'm not that important. I have my set of pet peeves/irritants as does anybody else. It is not a good idea to always express them (regardless of their merit). I am getting better at that but sometimes I falter.
    Last edited by apjonas; 07-13-2011 at 08:00 AM. Reason: grammar

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    Mlutz those statues talk about what a peace officer is and what a dangerous weapon is I find no definition what a concealed weapon is or could be.

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    Quote Originally Posted by apjonas View Post
    If my response was too harsh, I apologize. You are not the first person to elicit this type of response from me and probably won't be the last. That is why I irritate a lot of people even though I think my comment is fair. But to your question -- I respond like this to people that I think (I will concede that I may be wrong in your case) believe themselves to be so important that they can't spare the minimal amount of time and effort to find the answer to a question. Even worse is the person who gives the answer as he asks the question. You did say:



    The first question is like asking "SB93 says to obtain a license a background check is required. Does this mean applicants must undergo a background check?"

    Now your other questions may reasonable to the extent that Act 35 does not provide specifics about the knife other than no switchblades permitted. As many here shout from time to time - if it isn't stated as being illegal - it's legal. That is the default condition is legality. Are you asking about the new law? If so, you can surely read it to see if length or type of blade is addressed elsewhere. It is certainly possible that there is another statute or local ordinance that relates to this subject. If you are a knife aficionado, I would expect you to be familiar with these laws. But if you gained interest in carrying a knife solely because of the new law and you don't feel competent to determine what the answers might be, there is nothing wrong with requesting assistance from people who might be more expert in the area. I would still caution you to verify anything you are told. Only you know your motivation for asking and I will give you the benefit of any doubt. I still think the first question is a little dopey but you might have been in a hurry. So don't let yourself be impacted by anything I said. I'm not that important. I have my set of pet peeves/irritants as does anybody else. It is not a good idea to always express them (regardless of their merit). I am getting better at that but sometimes I falter.
    apjonas, if YOU re-read this post in it's entirety, you will find (look really close) you will find areas that YOU contradict yourself! I find it repulsive that an "expert" (my opinion) as yourself should slam a relatively new person coming here to pose a question to cover their arse! Instead of jumping in their arse w/both feet might I suggest you help them instead of being so self righteous and indignant.
    You too were new to this, it may or may not have come easily, so cut those that seek out the knowledge some slack. Is individuals specifically like you and how you responded turn people away, if you choose to alienate in your personal life that's on you! Keep it where it belongs, your own AO and not here.
    That being said, I wish you luck in your search to better yourself.

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    Regular Member CalicoJack10's Avatar
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    My study for this says that there is no state restriction aside from switchblades. That is after some time of cross refrencing the statutes that are listed in SB93. But I am not a lawyer, I am just an instructor. So I need to know what it says, even if I am not the one that can teach others how to interperit it.
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    Founder's Club Member bnhcomputing's Avatar
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    NO you CANNOT carry a knife, club, or taser

    Quote Originally Posted by phleye View Post
    So with the CCW bill passed, it says a "weapon" is a knife that is not a switchblade (I know there is more, but I'm just wondering about the knife part).

    Does this mean we can carry knives concealed too?
    Is there a size limit?
    Folding or fixed blade?

    Thanks!!
    I had this discussion with the legislature and they didn't listen.

    66.0409 (WI preemption statute) specifically says firearm. Almost every local municipality in the state has a "No Dangerous Weapons" ordinance. While firearms are preempted, all other weapons are not. Carry a knife, that is a local ordinance violation. Carry a taser... local ordinance violation. The only weapon you can carry without fear of local citation is a firearm.

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    Not to Worry

    Quote Originally Posted by bnhcomputing View Post
    I had this discussion with the legislature and they didn't listen.

    66.0409 (WI preemption statute) specifically says firearm. Almost every local municipality in the state has a "No Dangerous Weapons" ordinance. While firearms are preempted, all other weapons are not. Carry a knife, that is a local ordinance violation. Carry a taser... local ordinance violation. The only weapon you can carry without fear of local citation is a firearm.
    Part of the new statute says:

    175.60(2g) CARRYING A CONCEALED WEAPON; POSSESSION AND DISPLAY OF LICENSE DOCUMENT OR AUTHORIZATION.
    (a) A licensee or an out−of−state licensee may carry a concealed weapon anywhere in this state except as provided under subs. (15m) and (16) and ss. 943.13 (1m) (c)and 948.605 (2) (b) 1r.

    This is implicit de jure preemption for licensees. There was no need to expand preemption generally because that was not wanted. There are other sections that address issues for non-licensees. There is no constitutional requirement that the legislature specifically enact a preemption law. It suffices that the subject be of statewide concern to demand uniformity. This can be implied. The reason that there was a specific firearm preemption passed was because there is no general state law on the ownership or carrying of firearms and that provided a loophole for cities and villages to run through. In Act 35, the legislature has spoken clearly and unambiguously. I can't guarantee that the City of Milwaukee or some renegade judge won't try and say otherwise but it's a loser for them.
    Last edited by apjonas; 07-13-2011 at 11:00 AM. Reason: add

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    True about local ordinance but lacking one they have to fall back on state law.

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    Founder's Club Member bnhcomputing's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by apjonas View Post
    Part of the new statute says:

    175.60(2g) CARRYING A CONCEALED WEAPON; POSSESSION AND DISPLAY OF LICENSE DOCUMENT OR AUTHORIZATION.
    (a) A licensee or an out−of−state licensee may carry a concealed weapon anywhere in this state except as provided under subs. (15m) and (16) and ss. 943.13 (1m) (c)and 948.605 (2) (b) 1r.

    This is implicit de jure preemption for licensees.
    It also explicitly says "concealed." So I can open carry a firearm, but not a knife or taser? As always, just trying to learn.

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    Regular Member Outdoorsman1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bnhcomputing View Post
    It also explicitly says "concealed." So I can open carry a firearm, but not a knife or taser? As always, just trying to learn.
    That is the way I see it....

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    But Remember

    Quote Originally Posted by CalicoJack10 View Post
    My study for this says that there is no state restriction aside from switchblades. That is after some time of cross refrencing the statutes that are listed in SB93. But I am not a lawyer, I am just an instructor. So I need to know what it says, even if I am not the one that can teach others how to interperit it.
    The "protections" of Act 35, except where otherwise stated, are for licensees. If there are no state statutes addressing the carrying of knives, localities are pretty much free to enact any restrictions they care to. So if Fond du Lac has (or enacts) an ordinance that no knife longer than 3" or any knife with a fixed blade may be carried that prohibition might be effective against non-licensees. It won't against licensees but an ordinance against switchblades would be. You might consider bringing in an attorney to deal with these issues.

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