Biddeford PD shoots and kills pitbull

wrightme said:

SNIP ... it also remains to be seen which version will prevail in the justice system.

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Wanna place any bets? All police should wear collar cams for their (legal) safety.

§3951. Killing for assault permitted

Any person may lawfully kill a dog if necessary to protect that person, another person or a domesticated animal during the course of a sudden, unprovoked assault. [1997, c. 690, §34 (AMD).]

HankT said:

Tweeeeet!!!

The referee pulls out the yellow card, holding it up for all to see. The infraction is excessive use of strawman arguments--in combination with irrelevant thesis and genetic fallacy enhancements. Unnecessary roughness to logic.

Off to the penalty box goes SM. The Red team will have to play one striker short now . . .

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I get a yellow card and boyscout339 does not get one from you as well? Or are you allowing my penalty flag to stand?

And as for calling my argument a strawman -- well, let's just say you seem to be watching a different reality. But I do realize this is the famous HankT who is all-knowing and all-wise, which is why I better not get involved in an internet debate (poo-flinging contest) with him. For the record, that is not a personal attack but a recitation of facts.

@MaineCWPTraining -- the law says a person may, not that they must.

stay safe.

skidmark said:

I get a yellow card and boyscout339 does not get one from you as well? Or are you allowing my penalty flag to stand?

And as for calling my argument a strawman -- well, let's just say you seem to be watching a different reality. But I do realize this is the famous HankT who is all-knowing and all-wise, which is why I better not get involved in an internet debate (poo-flinging contest) with him. For the record, that is not a personal attack but a recitation of facts.

@MaineCWPTraining -- the law says a person may, not that they must.

stay safe.

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I don't understand how you seem to have all knowing insight into what this officer's choices were from half a country away. The story does not give enough information to criticize the officer at this point.

I agree with DWCook on this one. There really isn't enough information to make a complete determination either way. Obviously the dog bit the officer, to me that's enough to shoot the dog. I see Skid's point as well, that perhaps the officer could have retreated. And now the homeowners are challenging the officers story. I'm actually leaning towards the officer on this one.

thebigsd said:

I agree with DWCook on this one. There really isn't enough information to make a complete determination either way. Obviously the dog bit the officer, to me that's enough to shoot the dog. I see Skid's point as well, that perhaps the officer could have retreated. And now the homeowners are challenging the officers story. I'm actually leaning towards the officer on this one.

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Not exactly. IF the officer was at the location where the bite happened lawfully, possibly. But, as example, he entered the property of someone without permission, and without notification, the dog may have been doing 'his job.'

A badge does NOT give a "blanket free-trespass" to all property.

Retreating would have left the general public at risk. The neighbors have been complaining about this dog for quite sometime.

Maine CWP Training said:

Retreating would have left the general public at risk. The neighbors have been complaining about this dog for quite sometime.

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Huh? How would retreating have left the gp at risk?


And, complaints? What kind of complaints?

wrightme said:

Not exactly. IF the officer was at the location where the bite happened lawfully, possibly. But, as example, he entered the property of someone without permission, and without notification, the dog may have been doing 'his job.'

A badge does NOT give a "blanket free-trespass" to all property.

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My understanding was that the officer was bit getting out of his car, or is that inaccurate.

thebigsd said:

My understanding was that the officer was bit getting out of his car, or is that inaccurate.

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That is what the news story says the officer says. Sort of. The dog owners say differently
I tend to disbelieve the actual portrayal that news stories present. They tend to sensationalize and leave out an accurate chronology, for the sake of getting emotions of their readership or viewing audience into a frenzy.



Just as a facetious example, the LE might have gotten bit as soon as he opened the car door (which is about how the news portrays it), or he could have exited the vehicle, closed his door, and walked across someone else's lawn, back, across another lawn, and got confronted by the dog after all of that, and the news might still portray it as "getting out of his car."

No, I am not saying that is what happened. Just that it is not clear what happened.
.


That is the thing on this one. Right now, conflicting stories leave reality to a cointoss. Video of the event would put the disjoin to bed. But, unless the cop was wired for vid, it probably isn't to be had.



Oh, and according to the article: "and when the officer exited his vehicle", not "as the officer was getting out of his vehicle." Yes, that is a niggle, but right now, we have the article to go on, and the video of the owner's comments.

There are some people here that if the cop was giving out hot chocolate on a cold day, They would have something bad to say.

Emotional people who don't want to admit, that "Thier Doggy' is agressive and bit some one. If the cop was bit, while he was answering a call, TS. To all of you that like to second guess, KMA.

I will not defend bad behavior from any one including cops.

Some people don't understand that turning and running from a dog, may cause the dog to be more agressive.

Rattrapper said:

There are some people here that if the cop was giving out hot chocolate on a cold day, They would have something bad to say.

Emotional people who don't want to admit, that "Thier Doggy' is agressive and bit some one. If the cop was bit, while he was answering a call, TS. To all of you that like to second guess, KMA.

I will not defend bad behavior from any one including cops.

Some people don't understand that turning and running from a dog, may cause the dog to be more agressive.

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You cover a lot of ground here.

LE may be in the right, or in the wrong.

If the cop was bit while he was answering a call, he may very well have been justified in killing the dog. Or, he could have not needed to encounter the dog. Or, the owner might be at fault for not keeping the dog in check. The simple facts are that we do NOT know enough to tell which is accurate.

Some people freely blame the cop without getting facts.
Some people freely blame the dog breed without getting facts.
And, some people freely blame the dog owner without getting facts.

skidmark said:

I thought I'd drop out after mentioning that there was a (somewhat) respectful disagreement of options and priorities going on underneath a news article with little information to support either side.

But then we have a real cop-basher enter the fray to oppose the cop-liker. It's time to throw the yellow flag and cite



I'm not going to press the little triangle-shaped button yet. But I'm thinking about it.

stay safe.

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Let me enlighten you. "Cop bashing" is the generic. Disliking the actions of a "single" cop is not 'cop bashing." If it flies and quacks, it's a duck. That doesn't mean everything that flies is one. If someone 'bashes' Hitler does that mean they are 'bashing' all Germans--or Austrians, to be precise?

Rattrapper said:

There are some people here that if the cop was giving out hot chocolate on a cold day, They would have something bad to say.

Emotional people who don't want to admit, that "Thier Doggy' is agressive and bit some one. If the cop was bit, while he was answering a call, TS. To all of you that like to second guess, KMA.

I will not defend bad behavior from any one including cops.

Some people don't understand that turning and running from a dog, may cause the dog to be more agressive.

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If the cop was bitten, where in the story does it mention the treatment for the bite the hero cop received? What hospital tended to his wounds? Was the animal taken to be examined for rabies? That he was bitten is not substantiated in the story. That he gunned down a family's pet is.

Maine CWP Training said:

Retreating would have left the general public at risk. >>>>>The neighbors have been complaining about this dog for quite sometime.>>>>

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Cite?

Fisk said Rowe and her dog had been involved in several incidents:

• A police report from March 19, 2010, says that Rowe's tan pit bull bit her 11-year-old daughter on the left arm, said Fisk, who added she believes that was the same dog that was killed Friday.

• In March of this year, Rowe was given a warning that her dog was running at large and chasing people, Fisk said.

• On Wednesday, an officer issued a warning about Rowe's dog after neighbors complained earlier in the week that the dog was running loose, defecating on their

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source

Cop "believes it was the same dog..." 'Chasing people,' but evidently didn't bite anyone. Thanks for the cite.
Pepper spray works on dogs, so I'll stand by my original opinion. Why did the cop get out of his car if an 'aggressive dog' was standing there? Why didn't he use pepper spray? Witnesses contradict his story. He was not there due to the dog, but a completely unrelated call. The dog could have felt it was protecting the children in its family. I guess we'll never know, unless the family sues, which I hope they do.

wrightme said:

Some people freely blame the cop without getting facts.
Some people freely blame the dog breed without getting facts.
And, some people freely blame the dog owner without getting facts.

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Exactly.

And each of these groups doesn't realize their analyses and opinions are so biased.
And almost worthless.

weighing in a bit late on this one, but If you read further into the laws regarding dangerous animals and dog attacks, where maine CPW training had cited:

B. Order the dog to be euthanized if it has killed, maimed or inflicted serious bodily injury upon a person or has a history of a prior assault.

From reading the above comments, I'd like to point out a few things.


I've been bitten by dogs in the past, one of which was ordered to be put down from a prior incident.

1, I do know what it is like to try to retreat from a biting dog. Once they know you're scared, they tend to get MUCH more aggressive. Also, who wants to have their back turned to a snarling mouth full of teeth?


2, Remember last month when there was a 911 call for a DV incident in Winslow (i believe) and the husband shot and killed his wife with a handgun while chasing her down the street, because the 911 dispatchers misunderstood the address?

I stand with the cop on this one. The only thing i might have done differently might be grab the dog and attempt to restrain it by hand, which i have done before (they don't act so tough when you beat them at their own game).

Neighbors had feared pit bull killed by police
Thursday, July 21, 2011

BIDDEFORD – Biddeford police say neighbors feared and complained about a pit bill that was shot and killed by a police officer on Friday morning at an apartment building on Pool Street.

Deputy Chief JoAnne Fisk said the officer, who was not identified, was responding to a complaint at about 11:15 a.m. on July 15, when he was charged in an “aggressive manner” by an average-size pit bull.

SOURCE