Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 28

Thread: Hip holster, angled or no and why?

  1. #1
    Regular Member Baked on Grease's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Sterling, Va.
    Posts
    652

    Hip holster, angled or no and why?

    Just bought a Blackhawk level 2 SERPA-lock holster, I must say I am pleased with it. I see that is is VERY adjustable as to the angle I can put the gun at, and I see others with their gun at varying degrees. I am right handed strong side draw, and have tried multiple angles from straight up to extreme both directions, with some in between, and so far no angle at all seems the most smooth to draw and re-holster for me.

    My question is what angle do you have yours at for hip carrying and why? I'd like to educate myself on the difference of experience and practice in this regard...
    "A Right Un-exercised is a Right Lost"

    "According to the law, [openly carrying] in a vehicle is against the law if the weapon is concealed" -Flamethrower (think about it....)

    Carrying an XDm 9mm with Hornady Critical Defense hollowpoint. Soon to be carrying a Ruger along with it....

  2. #2
    Regular Member Big River Leather's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Pierce County, WI
    Posts
    81
    A couple of reasons for forward cant -

    - For concealment, especially with longer gripped semi autos, the bottom of the grip will print when beneath a shirt. This can be amplified by bending or sitting depending on the ride height of the holster/gun. When you bring the gun to a forward cant it will reduce the amount of printing. To much forward cant makes for a un-natural draw, leaves the muzzle poking out behind. this is how I originally got into making holsters. I thought I wanted a severe cant for my P220. So, I made one and it sucked for me. Revolvers are not as bad, depending on the grip.

    - The other reason would be what feels right on the draw from the position the holster is carried at on the waist i.e. 3:00 on the, 4:00 just back, 5:00 further back etc.

    Your Serpa is not much for concealment unless it is winter and it is under a coat. However, you have the options for adjusting the cant for any of the above reasons. Duty holsters that are not adjustable are typically a straight drop or close to it in my experience. YMMV.
    Big River Leather
    Handcrafted Gun Leather and Accessories
    http://www.bigriverleather.com

  3. #3
    Founder's Club Member thebigsd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Quarryville, PA
    Posts
    3,543
    I carry mine straight up. This allows me to draw as I have been taught. Also it's pretty tough for somebody to take your gun without you getting in the way. Also most of my leather holsters do not have a cant so I like to keep it consistent.
    "When seconds count between living or dying, the police are only minutes away."

  4. #4
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Warren, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    228
    14 or 15 degree forward cant. it just feels right.

  5. #5
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    North Chesterfield VA
    Posts
    10,682
    Discussing the cant of a holster is like throwing gasoline on the 9mm vs 45acp debate while declaring that either toe-may-toe or toe-mah-toe is the only acceptable pronounciation.

    Having said that, I'm a straight up and down guy. Part of it is because that's the way my M-1940 holster was built (the "if it was good enough for __ it ought to be good enough for you" argument), and mostly because I have enough trouble pulling a handgun up around my tactical self-contained bullet-absorbing accessory (spare tire) without needing to pull forwards or backwards at the same time. (Hey! I just recently got walking and breathing at the same time down pat. Don't rush me!)

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
    ----Allahpundit

  6. #6
    Regular Member SFCRetired's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Montgomery, Alabama, USA
    Posts
    1,770
    All of my holsters have a forward cant. One of them is adjustable and I've tried it several different ways and the forward cant just feels right for me.

    Bottom line: What is right for me may not be right or comfortable for someone else. This is one of those areas where you have to try different ways and settle on what works for you.

  7. #7
    Regular Member sraacke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Saint Gabriel, Louisiana, USA
    Posts
    1,222
    I've tried the forward or back cants at different angles but straight up and down is the best for me.
    President/ Founding Member
    Louisiana Open Carry Awareness League
    www.laopencarry.org

  8. #8
    Regular Member GuidoZ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Skagit County, WA
    Posts
    192
    As has been said, whatever feels right for you is the right way. I realize you said nothing felt better than anything else, so that answer might not work for you. I think the best advice I read (and agree with) is it depends where you carry. If around the 3:00 position, up and down may be natural. If closer to the 4:00 (like me), then a bit of forward cant feels better, as you're not contorting your arm to pull it out. (You're reaching for it a bit from the front, so having it sit facing the front a bit makes sense.) The further behind you go, the more you may appreciate some forward cant.

    --
    Peace. ~G
    Carry weapon: SA XDm .40 SC + 11rd Ranger SXT 180gr

  9. #9
    Activist Member N605TW's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Columbus, Ohio
    Posts
    118
    I too have the SERPA, and I love it. I carry at 3 o'clock and have it set with a forward cant. I started to carry with it straight up and down but the butt of the gun would hit the back of my car seat and was uncomfortable for me. My best advise would be to try it different ways and see what works best for you.

  10. #10
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Salt Lake City, UT
    Posts
    333
    I'm not a fan of the Serpa (I do have one and tried for a day or so).

    That said, I use leather concealment IWB with muzzle back rake. I find that it holds closer to the body and doesn't stand out so much. I like the straight draw holsters, but for every day carry a high ride muzzle back rake works better for me.
    FWIW leather is quieter than the plastic holsters.
    Steve


    "Life is hard, its even harder when you are stupid!"

  11. #11
    Activist Member DoubleAgentMan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    LA County, CA
    Posts
    64
    I own a SERPA CQC level 2 holster with the quick disconnect system. I was using it straight up before, but with the QD system it was pushing the angle forward a bit. I was able to get it to stay slightly back after adjusting the position however. The nice thing about the QD system is that I can move it forward when I am in the car, then back to the position I like when I get out. It also never leaves the holster, and I do not have to worry about having to remove the attachment from my belt. It works on any SERPA platform as well. The only downside is that it prints badly when CC, but hey this is an OC site!

    http://www.blackhawk.com/product/SER...le,1239,82.htm

  12. #12
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Nevada
    Posts
    17
    I've tried and used Blackhawk Serpa holsters and they are good but I found the Israeli Tactical Retention holsters much more adjustable for cant (they go 360 degrees adjusted with an included allen wrench so you could use it upside down if you wanted, same with the mag holder). Also the ITR holsters have a much more snug fit, more ergonomic release button and less "rattle" than the Serpa. Also the price is much less!

    I still use a Serpa for my S&W 645 (its designed for a Sig P226 but fits) because I couldn't find an ITR to fit it.

  13. #13
    Regular Member Baked on Grease's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Sterling, Va.
    Posts
    652
    Quote Originally Posted by disneyr View Post
    I've tried and used Blackhawk Serpa holsters and they are good but I found the Israeli Tactical Retention holsters much more adjustable for cant (they go 360 degrees adjusted with an included allen wrench so you could use it upside down if you wanted, same with the mag holder). Also the ITR holsters have a much more snug fit, more ergonomic release button and less "rattle" than the Serpa. Also the price is much less!

    I still use a Serpa for my S&W 645 (its designed for a Sig P226 but fits) because I couldn't find an ITR to fit it.

    I find that my Serpa for XDM has no rattle at all. Granted I have the retention screw well screwed, but it's as quiet as can be. The release button is "just" reachable with my extended trigger finger, if I curl it I won't be able to release the weapon well, so this helps promote proper draw for me. I don't know about other serpa's but for the XDM it's well done. imo at least. My only remorse is that it's an eariler CQC model, and it does not cover the entire slide like other Blackhawk models I see, but Blackhawk doesn't seem to have an upgraded model for XDM. I am awaiting reply from customer service to see about it.
    "A Right Un-exercised is a Right Lost"

    "According to the law, [openly carrying] in a vehicle is against the law if the weapon is concealed" -Flamethrower (think about it....)

    Carrying an XDm 9mm with Hornady Critical Defense hollowpoint. Soon to be carrying a Ruger along with it....

  14. #14
    Regular Member Malcolm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Cleveland Ohio
    Posts
    89

    I use the Blackhawk plastic thing as well.

    Straight up and down strong side is how I've been carrying and it works just fine. Nice, fast draw. Today though I threw it on the paddle to see how it would go crossdraw with a full angled cant. I haven't worn it outside the house yet. (A few more days practice inside.) we'll see how it goes. It fits pretty comfy and is not that interfering. I know some people are haters on the cross draw. Me, I'm neutral, besides it never hurts to practice something thats outside of your comfort zone.
    T.V. brings on a whole new meaning to thinking inside the box.

    -M

  15. #15
    Regular Member dmatting's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Durham, NC
    Posts
    443
    I also have the Serpa Level 2. I actually prefer the cant to be one click to the back - the way my hand is angled when it grasps the gun is so much more natural at that angle. The problem with the rearward cant, however, is that the butt of the gun and my car seat don't get along. I also tried the forward cant - the seated position is the car is great, but removing the gun from the holster is more than awkward for me. I had to compromise and I have settled on straight up and down. It is workable while seated in the car and I can still do a fairly natural and quick draw of the weapon.

    I will probably get the QD system and play around with cants again once I get it. I really like the idea of removing the holster with the gun in it.

  16. #16
    Regular Member Fallschirmjäger's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Georgia, USA
    Posts
    3,915
    Open carrying, I have my firearms angled as far back as possible in a SERPA. Of course, with my build the belt makes things angle forward so it all winds up being a vertical draw anyway. I'm happy with that as it seems to work quite naturally for me.
    Concealed carry is just a tad further back on my hip and usually with the butt tipped forward.
    Last edited by Fallschirmjäger; 09-01-2011 at 06:42 PM.

  17. #17
    Regular Member Baked on Grease's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Sterling, Va.
    Posts
    652
    Quote Originally Posted by dmatting View Post
    I also have the Serpa Level 2. I actually prefer the cant to be one click to the back - the way my hand is angled when it grasps the gun is so much more natural at that angle. The problem with the rearward cant, however, is that the butt of the gun and my car seat don't get along. I also tried the forward cant - the seated position is the car is great, but removing the gun from the holster is more than awkward for me. I had to compromise and I have settled on straight up and down. It is workable while seated in the car and I can still do a fairly natural and quick draw of the weapon.

    I will probably get the QD system and play around with cants again once I get it. I really like the idea of removing the holster with the gun in it.
    I've seen one problem with the QD sysytem, that it makes the gun protrude awkwardly away from the holster. (adds extra 1/2-3/4 inch) Though I have not used I myself, go you tube it before you.buy it to see what others say.

    Sent using tapatalk
    "A Right Un-exercised is a Right Lost"

    "According to the law, [openly carrying] in a vehicle is against the law if the weapon is concealed" -Flamethrower (think about it....)

    Carrying an XDm 9mm with Hornady Critical Defense hollowpoint. Soon to be carrying a Ruger along with it....

  18. #18
    Regular Member dmatting's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Durham, NC
    Posts
    443
    Quote Originally Posted by Baked on Grease View Post
    I've seen one problem with the QD sysytem, that it makes the gun protrude awkwardly away from the holster. (adds extra 1/2-3/4 inch) Though I have not used I myself, go you tube it before you.buy it to see what others say.

    Sent using tapatalk
    Yes, the QD system is rather thick - looks like it adds about 1/2" or so. I would like to see it and handle it before purchasing.

  19. #19
    Regular Member Baked on Grease's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Sterling, Va.
    Posts
    652
    Quote Originally Posted by dmatting View Post
    Yes, the QD system is rather thick - looks like it adds about 1/2" or so. I would like to see it and handle it before purchasing.
    Well, ask people in your area, ask gun shops if you could.see one in action.. etc.

    Or wait.till a gun show swings buy, I usually see at least one table with blackhawk merchandise there.


    Sent using tapatalk
    "A Right Un-exercised is a Right Lost"

    "According to the law, [openly carrying] in a vehicle is against the law if the weapon is concealed" -Flamethrower (think about it....)

    Carrying an XDm 9mm with Hornady Critical Defense hollowpoint. Soon to be carrying a Ruger along with it....

  20. #20
    Regular Member SGB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Tallahassee, Florida, USA
    Posts
    50
    I prefer a 3 O'clock carry with no cant.

    "It's easier to avoid conflict than it is to survive it" - SGB

  21. #21
    Regular Member Baked on Grease's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Sterling, Va.
    Posts
    652
    Quote Originally Posted by SGB View Post
    I prefer a 3 O'clock carry with no cant.

    That's how I carry now myself, but I find it not so comfortable in the car... I may get a second holster to strap under the dash or something to make it more accesible and more comfortable

    Sent using tapatalk
    "A Right Un-exercised is a Right Lost"

    "According to the law, [openly carrying] in a vehicle is against the law if the weapon is concealed" -Flamethrower (think about it....)

    Carrying an XDm 9mm with Hornady Critical Defense hollowpoint. Soon to be carrying a Ruger along with it....

  22. #22
    Regular Member MiaStar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Raleigh-Durham, NC
    Posts
    23

    Lightbulb

    My current holster is straight up, and I keep hitting my elbow on the butt of my 1911 which really hurts. So I slide it around to in front of my right thigh (right-handed, strong side draw) and that way I avoid an elbow hit, and someone would have to be directly in front of me or coming from a 2:00 angle to get at my gun. It is secured with a locking clip and strap.

    I really am in the market for a holster that cants. I have a large pistol with a 5" barrel, and I'm petite (5ft, 2in--120lb);without a canting holster it is very difficult to avoid hitting my elbow on the gun.

    With a canting holster, I prefer to wear my pistol directly at 12:00 on my right hip, canted slightly forward by about 15 degrees to lower the butt, but still allow for positive draw/engagement.

    Looking at getting a Serpa holster myself. The leather ones are beautiful but I need one that cants like I need the pistol itself.
    Last edited by MiaStar; 09-05-2011 at 01:14 AM.

  23. #23
    Campaign Veteran deepdiver's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Southeast, Missouri, USA
    Posts
    5,974
    I prefer a forward cant as well for a few reasons. I'm up and down in my desk chair through out the day and some days in and out of my car just as much. With something around an "FBI cant" when seated the pistol is about parallel with my torso (not scarring the car seat or leather desk chair). As for a standing draw, well, many years ago, long before I had ever heard of the "interview position" I got in the habit of standing that way in stress situations with my weight slightly forward ... well, from that position, the natural draw action involves bringing your hand back towards the firearm. As such, a mild to moderate forward cant leaves the gun positioned perfectly at hand, especially if moving into a slightly bladed stance during the draw. Furthermore, moving from an "interview stance" to draw, if you are CC with an open front cover garment such as a sports coat or jacket, sweeping the garment back out of the way becomes a natural part of the entire transition to and actual draw stroke.

    When I first started carrying I thought I would prefer a vertical holster for various reasons. Several years of daily carry has shifted my preference firmly to a slight forward cant IWB or OWB.

  24. #24
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Ky
    Posts
    27
    My BH SERPA level 2 is slightly forward.
    I set it over a month ago, I messed with it from vertical, foward and backwards until I found what I liked.

    It draws well, and I got used to moving my finger to the release, the way I draw and use my TD puts my finger on the release as I draw naturally.

    I did some testing with it one day, I set a target in rough country side on a tree.
    Walked X feet from it, turned, pulled and fired.

    I never once had a problem releasing the gun from the holster.

    Just find what works for you.

  25. #25
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Spfld, Mo.
    Posts
    430
    Ok, I've kicked this around for a few days now. I tend to like a slight forward cant (FBI cant) with my OWB holster. I'm not exactly sure why, but I'd attribute it to comfort at this point.

    However, given that I've witnessed imporper training with the Serpa holster resulting in a ND that required my administration of first aid, I'm not so sure I like the forward cant as much. So hopefully everyone won't mind if I illustrate why.

    It's all about muzzle control. With the forward cant the muzzle is pointed rearward, just slightly. When drawing with a forward cant the hand tries to rock the muzzle forward while moving upward. That easily results in the muzzle pointing even more rearward when clearing the Kydex. Since you cannot see behind you, can you answer the safety question of if that muzzle is pointed at someone/something you are not prepared to destroy and can you control where the round will wind up? The answer is NO.

    The situation I dealt with had this exact problem and it's a good thing it was a frangible round because it broke up when it hit the ground after passing through the buttock. Had it been a FMJ round it very well could have ricocheted and hurt someone else. It was the direct result of improperly training with the Serpa.

    The Serpa is designed to force you to index your finger by using the pad of your finger to activate the release. However it can easily be done with the pad of the finger and that is where the problem lies. If you use the pad of your finger, it is very likely your finger is slightly curled. If you finger is slightly curled the sympathetic grip in your hand takes over as you squeeze the grip during a draw which can result in the finger going straight to the trigger and result in a ND.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •