Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 43

Thread: BFPE stated open carry is indeed legal

  1. #1
    Regular Member KIX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    960

    BFPE stated open carry is indeed legal

    I will post audio when I get it (though Ed Peruta and I are in competition for who gets it first!).

    Essentially, not only did they tell a local issuing authority they can't revoke a permit purely because of open carry, they told them they can't charge someone with breach of peace for doing so.

    The argument we've all used before about it not being the OC'ers problem if someone feels threatened was also mentioned.

    They were, indeed, unanimous (5-0) on the issue.

    Jonathan
    www.ctpistolpermitissues.com - tracking all the local issuing authority, DPS and other insanity with permit issues
    www.ctgunsafety.com - my blog and growing list of links useful to gun owners (especially in Connecticut).

    Rich B: My favorite argument against OC being legal in CT is "I have never seen someone OC in CT".
    I have never seen a person drink tea from a coke bottle while standing on their head, that doesn't mean it is illegal.

  2. #2
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Plainville, CT, ,
    Posts
    120
    Was the media present or have they been alerted?

  3. #3
    Regular Member Rich B's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    North Branford, Connecticut, USA
    Posts
    2,910
    I am not sure how significant this is, but it couldn't hurt anything.

    The BFPE saying open carry is legal seems like it would have all the legal relevance as when they had it posted that people should conceal.

    It is comforting that we know that they will not maintain a revocation based purely on open carry though, although I think we all knew that anyway.

  4. #4
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Hartford, Connecticut, United States
    Posts
    68
    Who was the local issuing authority?

  5. #5
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    New Britain, Connecticut, USA
    Posts
    107
    Quote Originally Posted by Rich B View Post
    I am not sure how significant this is, but it couldn't hurt anything.

    The BFPE saying open carry is legal seems like it would have all the legal relevance as when they had it posted that people should conceal.

    It is comforting that we know that they will not maintain a revocation based purely on open carry though, although I think we all knew that anyway.
    I think it's good that the BFPE acknowledged that OC is fine, and that they took a position supported by state law (or lack of, in this case). Maybe 'the word' will get out to local PD's that they'll get slapped down and be made to look stupid if any of them try this 'breach of peace' s***.

  6. #6
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Connecticut USA
    Posts
    1,247

    Open Carry case out of Fairfield

    Quote Originally Posted by beanoboy7 View Post
    Who was the local issuing authority?
    FAIRFIELD PD was the arresting department.
    Audio will be posted when obtained

    We have all been waiting a long time for the right case to be heard where for the Connecticut Board of Firearms Permit Examiners to make such a ruling.

    The real shame comes from the fact that the appellant was forced to take Accelerated Rehabilitation because he didn't have the funds to continue to fight the charges in the Criminal System.

    Another reason to have a fund in place to assist innocent owners of firearms.

    When the audio is posted you will hear the appellant's reasons for taking the deal.

    Ed Peruta

  7. #7
    Centurion
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Pleasant Grove, Utah, USA
    Posts
    3,828
    Quote Originally Posted by Edward Peruta View Post
    FAIRFIELD PD was the arresting department.
    Audio will be posted when obtained

    We have all been waiting a long time for the right case to be heard where for the Connecticut Board of Firearms Permit Examiners to make such a ruling.

    The real shame comes from the fact that the appellant was forced to take Accelerated Rehabilitation because he didn't have the funds to continue to fight the charges in the Criminal System.

    Another reason to have a fund in place to assist innocent owners of firearms.

    When the audio is posted you will hear the appellant's reasons for taking the deal.

    Ed Peruta
    Is "Accelerated Rehabilitation" like defered adjudication where if one is not arrested or charged with another crime in a specific timeframe then the charges disappearl?

  8. #8
    Regular Member brk913's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Plainville, CT
    Posts
    370
    Quote Originally Posted by JoeSparky View Post
    Is "Accelerated Rehabilitation" like defered adjudication where if one is not arrested or charged with another crime in a specific timeframe then the charges disappearl?
    Yes, once successully completed no record of even the arrest.

  9. #9
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Connecticut USA
    Posts
    1,247

    Board audio of the Revocation for OPEN CARRY and the facts regarding Alnasir Sultan

    Here is the link to the audio of the full hearing. A shorter version with only the deliberations and votes will be posted later today.

    http://www.ctgunrights.com/06.Audio/...arry.Legal.MP3

    A travisty of justice took place and cost Alnasir Sultan several thousands of dollars in legal fees that eventually made him accept a deal from the courts.

    This case is a perfedct example of why we need to establish a fund to fight injustice regarding our rights to KEEP and BEAR armsin CT.

    Let this be a lesson to those who are wrongly charged with crimes for legal conduct.

    Always contact an attorney familiar with firearm laws and NEVER make a deal when your NOT GUILTY.

    Ed Peruta

  10. #10
    Regular Member Rich B's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    North Branford, Connecticut, USA
    Posts
    2,910
    Good strong language used there about departments not knowing the laws.

    It would sure be nice if the members of the board would petition the Attorney General for a declaratory ruling to the same effect so that it could be handed to every police department in the state. They admit that police departments don't know the laws and they have the proof that police officers are purposely twisting those laws to suit their beliefs. It is in the interest of the board, the PDs and the state to get clear language out to the PDs to stop wasting time and money.

    The problem in the past has been that no matter what you show a local PD, they say "the DPS has no jurisdiction over us" and "that is fine, we will let the courts and BFPE decide". They know how much it costs to defend yourself and they know how long it takes to get a permit back. And it costs them nothing (so far).

    In this case, I don't even see how this guy needed a permit. He was on his own property. And the same police who have been arguing so far are going to continue their arrogance and say "that is because he was in his home, not in a [starbucks|mall|movie theater|university|etc]".

    Hats off to the BFPE for their hard work and speaking the truth, but I am skeptical that this is going to change the minds of anyone just yet. If Mr. Sultan had not taken his plea deal, I would say he has a slam dunk case now with teaching the Fairfield PD a lesson. But unfortunately, I doubt that is going to happen now.

    What a shame. I wish him luck in future endeavors and I am glad the board ruled in his favor.

    Good work on capturing this audio guys.

  11. #11
    Regular Member KIX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    960
    What made this great is the "chill" in the room when the board members not only brought it up, but voted unanimously.

    Ed and I looked at each other and I think we were giggling like school children. Finally, to have it said with a few issuing authorities in the room. There is a benefit here that I haven't heard mentioned.

    These are the officers that have to defend their local department on a revocation (usually the same officer from each town). So, now that a few have gotten the idea, it "may" make it less likely that they will just drive across state to defend something that, in the end, will end up getting dropped.

    As far as the accelerated rehabilitation goes, I think there is one sad caveat. As a firearms owner, Mr. Sultan will not get the same chance in the future if he ever needs it for anything. As I understand it, you only get one bite at that apple and then it's gone.

    Jonathan
    www.ctpistolpermitissues.com - tracking all the local issuing authority, DPS and other insanity with permit issues
    www.ctgunsafety.com - my blog and growing list of links useful to gun owners (especially in Connecticut).

    Rich B: My favorite argument against OC being legal in CT is "I have never seen someone OC in CT".
    I have never seen a person drink tea from a coke bottle while standing on their head, that doesn't mean it is illegal.

  12. #12
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Shelton
    Posts
    138
    yeah I wish I could have seen the look on their faces when the board told them that NO crime had been committed and that they are ashamed that they even prosecuted those charges. I Love it.

  13. #13
    Centurion
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Pleasant Grove, Utah, USA
    Posts
    3,828
    Quote Originally Posted by Shawn Mitola View Post
    yeah I wish I could have seen the look on their faces when the board told them that NO crime had been committed and that they are ashamed that they even prosecuted those charges. I Love it.
    It is a TERRIBLE shame that the victim of the UNWARRANTED PROSECUTION has to deal with the AR on this also.... and the associated implications! If the prosecutor was one of strong ethics he should petition the court for this victim to be completely ABSOLVED of this event and made whole as if the prosecution NEVER HAPPENED!

  14. #14
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Naugatuck CT
    Posts
    90
    I like the statement just because a gun makes someone uneasy that is there own problem.

  15. #15
    Regular Member Rich B's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    North Branford, Connecticut, USA
    Posts
    2,910
    Quote Originally Posted by customcreationllc View Post
    I like the statement just because a gun makes someone uneasy that is there own problem.
    Heh. I say this all the time and people just look at me funny. I have even had forum members on another forum say that it means that I am pushing gun rights back because I don't think that my rights are subject to the whims and phobias of others.

    *sigh*

  16. #16
    Regular Member KIX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    960
    The best 25 seconds of the hearing:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9geV7WMxPw

    Jonathan
    www.ctpistolpermitissues.com - tracking all the local issuing authority, DPS and other insanity with permit issues
    www.ctgunsafety.com - my blog and growing list of links useful to gun owners (especially in Connecticut).

    Rich B: My favorite argument against OC being legal in CT is "I have never seen someone OC in CT".
    I have never seen a person drink tea from a coke bottle while standing on their head, that doesn't mean it is illegal.

  17. #17
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Branford, Connecticut, USA
    Posts
    101

    I stood up and cheered.

    I was listening to this on headphones at work and got a few stares for my outburst. Outbursts are not that uncommon here but still :-).

    I do want to ask however, if the witness for the town (I forget the officers name) will take any of the boards CLEARLY POSITIVE statements back to headquarters with him and explain to his brethren why their appeal failed? That would be the lesson learned if any.
    “The Constitution shall never be construed... to prevent the people of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms.” —Samuel Adams

    "Here sir, the people govern." -- Alexander Hamilton (speech in the New York ratifying convention, 17 June 1788) Reference: The Debates of the Several State..., Elliot, vol. 2 (348)

    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniencies attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." -- Thomas Jefferson

  18. #18
    Regular Member Joeygee23's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    East Hartford
    Posts
    35

    Media Silence

    It would be nice if this appeared in the print/tv news, thereby "educating" the masses.

  19. #19
    Regular Member KIX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    960
    I talk to the media from time to time with the 2A work I do and now..... at least I have a recording and a quote I can issue on the topic.

    Either way, it is a win (even if it isn't a huge one).

    Jonathan
    www.ctpistolpermitissues.com - tracking all the local issuing authority, DPS and other insanity with permit issues
    www.ctgunsafety.com - my blog and growing list of links useful to gun owners (especially in Connecticut).

    Rich B: My favorite argument against OC being legal in CT is "I have never seen someone OC in CT".
    I have never seen a person drink tea from a coke bottle while standing on their head, that doesn't mean it is illegal.

  20. #20
    Regular Member Rich B's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    North Branford, Connecticut, USA
    Posts
    2,910
    Quote Originally Posted by Joeygee23 View Post
    It would be nice if this appeared in the print/tv news, thereby "educating" the masses.
    I have been spreading it out there pretty thick already.

    That and the attention my case is starting to get (working with at least one reporter right now) should further assist in getting the word out.

    Lets not forget though, the word has been 'out there' for a long time now. There are departments and officers that will not listen to anyone and will not follow the law until they start seeing penalties for not following the law.

    We all need to get behind the numerous cases that Ed Peruta and Attorneys Baird and Hall are working on right now and get these cases to show the police that there will be penalties for ignoring the law.

  21. #21
    Regular Member Joeygee23's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    East Hartford
    Posts
    35

    a victory nontheless...........

    An "offical" board making an "official" statement is GREAT NEWS!!!

  22. #22
    Regular Member Rich B's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    North Branford, Connecticut, USA
    Posts
    2,910
    Expect national radio attention on the issue of open carry in CT next week. Details to come.

  23. #23
    Regular Member Rich B's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    North Branford, Connecticut, USA
    Posts
    2,910
    http://www.ctguntalk.com/smf/conceal...0072/#msg40072

    That's interesting esp given the ruling... they decided that merely oc img isn't bop but that's not what happened. Id say going back into the house and returning with a gun (open or concealed) is problematic if not illegal. Given that the gun was in a shoulder holster id guess he normally cc. Think of it this way... if the repo man was in fact a bg and ended up shot in self defense the homeowner would have had some serious legal trouble again not for oc ing but for getting a gun and returning.

    Sent from my DROID2 GLOBAL using Tapatalk
    Yes I see it as a gray area since he opens the door first unarmed, then closes it and arms himself then reopens the door. He was apparently on his own property the whole time though. I may not be remembering this right but I think there was talk during the audio of the repo guy calling the police to get the police to arrest the guy so he could proceed with his repoing of the car. Not the best case in the world to hang ones hat on but in the end BPFE has now stated that breach of peace is not a valid reason to revoke or confiscate ones pistol permit so that's good news.

    Being armed in your own home is now being declared 'problematic' and 'gray area'.

    I couldn't make this kind of stuff up if I tried.

    Edit:

    Simply amazing...

    Ed yes we realize he was in his own home. The reps guy was outside. There is no castle doctrine in ct. Even in your own home you may not confront a threat. If he had answered his door with his gun the first time there is no problem. His mistake was going back for the gun

    Sent from my DROID2 GLOBAL using Tapatalk
    No prosecution, the BFPE reinstates his permit, the police admit (through interrogation by the BFPE) there was nothing illegal about the incident. And yet we have people who still want to hang the guy for doing nothing wrong.
    Last edited by Rich B; 08-03-2011 at 03:44 PM.

  24. #24
    Regular Member Joeygee23's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    East Hartford
    Posts
    35
    Quote Originally Posted by Rich B View Post
    Expect national radio attention on the issue of open carry in CT next week. Details to come.
    Eagerly waitng here!

  25. #25
    Regular Member KIX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    960
    Quote Originally Posted by Rich B View Post
    http://www.ctguntalk.com/smf/conceal...0072/#msg40072

    Being armed in your own home is now being declared 'problematic' and 'gray area'.

    I couldn't make this kind of stuff up if I tried.
    Not a member.... can't read it.

    Seems like there are some nutters over there.....

    Jonathan
    www.ctpistolpermitissues.com - tracking all the local issuing authority, DPS and other insanity with permit issues
    www.ctgunsafety.com - my blog and growing list of links useful to gun owners (especially in Connecticut).

    Rich B: My favorite argument against OC being legal in CT is "I have never seen someone OC in CT".
    I have never seen a person drink tea from a coke bottle while standing on their head, that doesn't mean it is illegal.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •