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Gunshot Demographics. The ugly underbelly of the anti-gun-rights position - LOUNGE

M-Taliesin

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 22, 2011
Messages
1,504
Location
Aurora, Colorado
Howdy Amigo!
It would be terrific if such maps were produced for every major city in America.
I wonder if the trend would be similar in each city surveyed?

We have a problem in Denver with gangs running around, often in groups of 8, 10, 15.
They will assault and rob specific types of people; Whites and Hispanics. There is some question whether any victims of such attacks have died locally, but it is evident who these thugs are targeting. With these particular cases, the assailants fit the suspect profile. The victims do not. So it may end up skewing the results here differently than what other cities are reporting.

Regardless, thank you for posting this terrific bit of information!

Blessings,
M-Taliesin
 

hermannr

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 24, 2011
Messages
2,327
Location
Okanogan Highland
There is an old saying that goes: If we are not willing to study history, and learn from it, we are bound to repeat it.

What history? The XVIII ammendment, that is: prohibition. What did prohibition do? It made a lot of 2 bit crooks very wealthy, it brought us mass gang violence, a lot of people died, a lot went to jail...for what reason???? because some do gooder decided that because he thought alcohol was bad for people, he would save the world by banning alcohol...oh yes, and let's not forget, Prohibition also brought US the NFA 1934..... Yes, and Canada's stupid gun laws started then too.

Tell me how the "war on drugs" is any different? or the outcome will be any different. grow up America, read your history books and then tell me what good is being done by this stupid "war".

I can balance the budget tomorrow, call a cease fire on the "war", make any drug misuse a medical problem (which is what it is for the abusers) no crimminal penality. repeal all the anti-drug and anti-gun laws and send the ATF and the DEA to the unemployment line,.

And yes I know, Ron Paul is the politico that does not think I'm crazy.,
 

KBCraig

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 7, 2007
Messages
4,886
Location
Granite State of Mind
Howdy Amigo!
It would be terrific if such maps were produced for every major city in America.
I wonder if the trend would be similar in each city surveyed?

It would also be useful if they pointed out the demographics of the area. Baltimore has a vast majority of black-on-black violence, but it's also a city with a large black majority (about 64%).
 

chcknhawk

New member
Joined
Aug 5, 2011
Messages
8
Location
Central Texas
That was an awesome find and a great read. I love that here in Texas we're getting over this "guns kill people" myth. I can legally carry my gun into the State Capitol and have. Nothing happened. No one died, no one was shot, and no crimes were committed.
 

mahkagari

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 28, 2009
Messages
1,186
Location
, ,
It's interesting to note the tool notes the victims' ethnicity, not the perpetrators. Not reading into that, just that there's a limited amount of data available there.
 

rushcreek2

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 27, 2010
Messages
909
Location
Colorado Springs. CO
The Black ,male 18-24 demographic is well represented in the Colorado Springs violent crime statistics.

The video scenes of what's been going on in London the past few days is a familiar scene - Watts, Detroit, etc. What is their "excuse" in the UK - when was the last black slave emancipated there?

The fact is these punks don't need an "excuse". There is a propensity to this sort of behavior within that particular demographic culture. Call it environmental, or call it latent, cultural "tribal" reflex - the result is the same. Civilized society is fed up with this "reflex" of rioting, and looting, and assaults on the police. As long as this population continues to resort to such displays of anarchy in response to blaming everyone else but themselves for their perceived unjust circumstances - this will remain their lot.

Again - "Extremism ALWAYS brings about its OWN DESTRUCTION."
 

bomber

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 6, 2009
Messages
499
Location
, ,
There is an old saying that goes: If we are not willing to study history, and learn from it, we are bound to repeat it.

What history? The XVIII ammendment, that is: prohibition. What did prohibition do? It made a lot of 2 bit crooks very wealthy, it brought us mass gang violence, a lot of people died, a lot went to jail...for what reason???? because some do gooder decided that because he thought alcohol was bad for people, he would save the world by banning alcohol...oh yes, and let's not forget, Prohibition also brought US the NFA 1934..... Yes, and Canada's stupid gun laws started then too.

Tell me how the "war on drugs" is any different? or the outcome will be any different. grow up America, read your history books and then tell me what good is being done by this stupid "war".

I can balance the budget tomorrow, call a cease fire on the "war", make any drug misuse a medical problem (which is what it is for the abusers) no crimminal penality. repeal all the anti-drug and anti-gun laws and send the ATF and the DEA to the unemployment line,.

And yes I know, Ron Paul is the politico that does not think I'm crazy.,


word up
 

Round Engines

New member
Joined
Jul 13, 2011
Messages
4
Location
Anchorage
I am not a big fan of the war on drugs, but I don't think we can blame it for gang violence. The act of selling drugs does not make one violent, neither will decriminalizing those drugs turn a violent person into a good citizen. If all drugs were legalized and became dirt cheap overnight, the violent criminals would simply find a more profitable venture. The reason young, black men are dying is that they choose to enter a life of violent crime; the specific crime in question is moot. I agree that the drug war is a waste of time, but we should not delude ourselves into thinking that we can eliminate violent crime or save money just by legalizing drugs. If a drug dealer can no longer fund his lifestyle with drugs, he's not going to throw away his guns and go to college; he's going to take up kidnapping, bank robbing, etc. Don't send the DEA to the unemployment line; merge them into the FBI. They'll still have plenty of work to do.
 

Brass Magnet

Founder's Club Member
Joined
Apr 23, 2009
Messages
2,818
Location
Right Behind You!, Wisconsin, USA
I am not a big fan of the war on drugs, but I don't think we can blame it for gang violence. The act of selling drugs does not make one violent, neither will decriminalizing those drugs turn a violent person into a good citizen. If all drugs were legalized and became dirt cheap overnight, the violent criminals would simply find a more profitable venture. The reason young, black men are dying is that they choose to enter a life of violent crime; the specific crime in question is moot. I agree that the drug war is a waste of time, but we should not delude ourselves into thinking that we can eliminate violent crime or save money just by legalizing drugs. If a drug dealer can no longer fund his lifestyle with drugs, he's not going to throw away his guns and go to college; he's going to take up kidnapping, bank robbing, etc. Don't send the DEA to the unemployment line; merge them into the FBI. They'll still have plenty of work to do.

I disagree. We can't blame the "war on drugs" for all gang violence but we can blame it for most of it. A quote attributed to the ancient chinese philosopher Lǎo zǐ may have said it best: "The greater the number of laws and enactments, the more thieves and robbers there will be." Just as prohibition of alcohol caused a huge increase in violent crime, the "war on drugs" caused an even bigger one. If we legalize freedom there won't be a heck of a lot left for organized crime to do besides cons and extortion. Sure some of them will try to rob banks, as they do now, but that's much easier and cheaper to prevent and easier for law enforcement to bring them to justice.

The problem with prohibition, be it drugs or alcohol, is that it makes trafficking them much more lucrative than if they are legal. Just like in stocks, you have a greater potential profit when you take more risk. Get rid of this potential and I'll bet the bank that we will see violent deaths fall by at least 50% in this country and most likely nearly 75% in Mexico. Isn't that alone is worth giving it a try?

It's actually easier for young people to get drugs than it is for them to get alcohol. I remember having the darndest time trying to get someone to buy me some beer but I knew 3 people to pick up some pot from had I wanted to. Treating drugs the same way we now treat alcohol will actually help keep it out of the hands of young people and treating drug addiction like alcoholism is much better than the alternative of keeping 594,000 non-violent criminals in jail. It's also way cheaper and morally right. It's been proven also that many of these people who are non-violent going into prison come out violent criminals.

Most importantly to this board, as another poster eluded to, gun control and prohibition are inexorably linked. Even then, the source of the problem was prohibition itself and not the firearms.
 

bomber

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 6, 2009
Messages
499
Location
, ,
I disagree. We can't blame the "war on drugs" for all gang violence but we can blame it for most of it. A quote attributed to the ancient chinese philosopher Lǎo zǐ may have said it best: "The greater the number of laws and enactments, the more thieves and robbers there will be." Just as prohibition of alcohol caused a huge increase in violent crime, the "war on drugs" caused an even bigger one. If we legalize freedom there won't be a heck of a lot left for organized crime to do besides cons and extortion. Sure some of them will try to rob banks, as they do now, but that's much easier and cheaper to prevent and easier for law enforcement to bring them to justice.

The problem with prohibition, be it drugs or alcohol, is that it makes trafficking them much more lucrative than if they are legal. Just like in stocks, you have a greater potential profit when you take more risk. Get rid of this potential and I'll bet the bank that we will see violent deaths fall by at least 50% in this country and most likely nearly 75% in Mexico. Isn't that alone is worth giving it a try?

It's actually easier for young people to get drugs than it is for them to get alcohol. I remember having the darndest time trying to get someone to buy me some beer but I knew 3 people to pick up some pot from had I wanted to. Treating drugs the same way we now treat alcohol will actually help keep it out of the hands of young people and treating drug addiction like alcoholism is much better than the alternative of keeping 594,000 non-violent criminals in jail. It's also way cheaper and morally right. It's been proven also that many of these people who are non-violent going into prison come out violent criminals.

Most importantly to this board, as another poster eluded to, gun control and prohibition are inexorably linked. Even then, the source of the problem was prohibition itself and not the firearms.

well it appears that there are at least a few intelligent people on this board
 

hermannr

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 24, 2011
Messages
2,327
Location
Okanogan Highland
the gang problem is a money problem. Most of the individuals involved do not want to work, but want everything that money can purchase.

If you give them an easy way to make money without working (say the war of drugs, or a disproportionately high tax on anything) those looking for an easy buck head for it.

If you take the money away, the problem will disappear. Ontario had a problem with smuggled cigarettes from New York. They spent millions trying to interdict the untaxed (by Ontario) smokes. Ontario lowered their tax on smokes and now New York has a smuggled cigarette problem. Ontario now has lower enforcement costs, and more tax revenue.
 

Dreamer

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 23, 2009
Messages
5,360
Location
Grennsboro NC
It would also be useful if they pointed out the demographics of the area. Baltimore has a vast majority of black-on-black violence, but it's also a city with a large black majority (about 64%).

And a high percentage of them make up the City Government and police force. Its no wonder that the young people in Baltimore have such a high crime rate--look at their "role models"...

http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/news/crime/blog/2011/02/baltimore_officers_arrested_in.html

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=120330775

http://www.lawofficer.com/video/news/baltimore-city-officers-charge

http://charmcitycurrent.com/glover/2010/04/29/tgr-corruption-at-baltimore-city-hall-…-again/
 
Last edited:

KBCraig

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 7, 2007
Messages
4,886
Location
Granite State of Mind
And a high percentage of them make up the City Government and police force. Its no wonder that the young people in Baltimore have such a high crime rate--look at their "role models"...
It's been suggested that "The Wire" should win an award... for Best Documentary.
 
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