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Thread: Newest from the DNR Aug. 4, 2011

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    Newest from the DNR Aug. 4, 2011

    How do the new CCW law changes effect me as a hunter, trapper, recreational vehicle operator or user of DNR lands?
    1. Transportation of Firearms
    Is it true that firearms no longer have to be unloaded or in a case if a vehicle?

    All long guns, such as rifles, shotguns and muzzleloaders must still be unloaded and completely enclosed within a case before they may be placed, possessed or transported in or on a vehicle (including trailers, wagons, snowmobiles or All-Terrain vehicles). Long guns must still be unloaded before they may be placed, possessed or transported in a motor boat with the motor running. However, the new change made under to concealed carry legislation was the elimination of the requirement to unload or case a handgun before it is placed, possessed or transported in or on a vehicle, boat, snowmobile or ATV. This change for handguns does not take effect until Nov. 1, 2011.

    2. Shining Deer or Other Wildlife
    If I have a concealed carry license or I am a qualified former law enforcement officer who is authorized to carry a concealed handgun, can I now possess this handgun while shining deer or other wild animals for viewing purposes?

    No. The legislation involving carrying concealed weapons, as well as the transportation of handguns, did not make any changes to the shining restrictions. It continues to be illegal to shine for wild animals while in possession of a any bow, crossbow or firearm, even if the firearm is a handgun possessed by a person who has a concealed carry license, or is a firearm possessed by a retired or former law enforcement officer. It also continues to be illegal to shining between the hours of 10pm and the following 7am from September 15th through December 31st, even if a person does not possess any firearm, bow or crossbow. Additional local county restrictions may also apply.

    3. Possession of Firearms in State Wildlife Refuge Areas
    If I have a license to carry a concealed weapon, or I am a qualified former law enforcement officer, can I now carry a loaded and uncased firearm in a wildlife refuge where firearms are normally required to be unloaded and encased ?

    Beginning on Nov. 1, 2011, a person with a concealed carry license will be allowed to possess a handgun which is loaded and uncased (concealed or unconcealed), and a qualified former law enforcement officer may possess the type of firearm they qualified with and which is indicated on their certification card, loaded and uncased (concealed or unconcealed) in a wildlife refuge. This exemption however does not allow such persons to hunt or discharge their firearm in the refuge.

    4. Possession of Firearms in State Parks & State Fish Hatcheries

    If I have a license to carry a concealed weapon, or I am a qualified former law enforcement officer, can I now carry a loaded and uncased firearm in a Wisconsin State Park or State Fish Hatchery where firearms are normally required to be unloaded and encased ?

    Beginning on Nov. 1, 2011, a person with a concealed carry license will be allowed to possess a handgun which is loaded and uncased (concealed or unconcealed), and a qualified former law enforcement officer may possess the type of firearm they qualified with and which is indicated on their certification card, loaded and uncased (concealed or unconcealed) in a Wisconsin State Park or State Fish Hatchery. This exemption however does not allow such persons to hunt or discharge their firearm in the Wisconsin State Park or State Fish Hatchery, nor does it allow bringing the firearm inside state owned buildings on these properties which are posted with signs that provide notice that firearms are not allowed in the building.

    5. Age for Possession or Hunting with a Handgun

    Did the concealed carry legislation change the age of persons who may go armed with a handgun, hunt with a handgun or the species which may be hunted with a handgun?

    No. A person must still be at least age 21 to purchase a firearm which is a handgun, and age 18 to possess or hunt with a firearm which is a handgun. The species which may be hunted with handgun and the caliber and barrel length minimums have not change.

    6. Carrying a Concealed Firearm while Hunting
    If I am at least 18 years old and can legally hunt with a handgun, can I also carry that handgun concealed under my jacket or in a backpack while I am hunting?

    Generally speaking, the answer is no. A person must be at least age 21 to obtain a license to carry a concealed weapon. However, beginning on Nov. 1, 2011, a person who owns, leases, or is the legal occupant of land and who is age 18 or older, can possess a concealed handgun on that land without the need for a concealed carry license. This would mean a person meeting these conditions who is age 18 or older, even without a concealed carry license could possess a concealed handgun, and hunt using a concealed handgun which is a legal size and caliber for the species being hunted. But only on their land, and only with a handgun. It continues to be illegal to possess concealed long guns.

    7. Possession of Firearms on DNR lands in the 17 Restricted Counties
    Have the restrictions on possessing a loaded or uncased firearm on DNR owned lands changed in those counties were it is not legal to possess a loaded uncased firearm when not engaged in lawful hunting unless at a designated range or engaged in a permitted dog trial or training?

    The answer is yes if the firearm is a handgun if possessed by a person with a concealed carry license, but no for a qualified former law enforcement officer unless they also possess a concealed carry license. On DNR lands which are not state parks, state fish hatcheries or wildlife refuges, such as normal public hunting grounds, and which are located in Dane, Dodge, Fond du lac, Jefferson, Juneau, Kenosha, LaCrosse, Milwaukee, Outagamie, Ozaukee, Racine, Sauk, Sheboygan, Walworth, Washington, Waukesha, Winnebago counties or on state forest lands in the Kettle Moraine or Point Beach state forests or state recreational areas, it continues to be illegal to possess or control a loaded or uncased firearm unless engaged in lawful hunting or at a designated range or engaged in a dog trial or training activity under a permit.

    8. Where do I apply for a Concealed Carry License

    Applications for a license to carry a concealed weapon must be obtain from and submit to the Wisconsin Department of Justice (DOJ), and not the DNR. Licenses will not be available until November 1, 2011 when the new laws and license take effect. For more information about laws related to carrying a concealed weapon, or about getting and submitting an application for a CCW License, we recommend you check out the DOJ web site at: http://www.doj.state.wi.us/dles/cib/Con ... dCarry.asp

    9. How do I obtain a Duplicate Hunter Education Certificate?
    Should your safety education certificate become lost or destroyed, you may obtain a duplicate by following the steps below:

    You can purchase and print a duplicate safety education certificate from home. Go to Wisconsin's Online Licensing Center. OR
    Locate a DNR Service Center or a DNR License Sales Agent nearest you to purchase and receive a duplicate safety education certificate over the counter.
    FEE: There is a $2.75 charge for a duplicate safety education certificate.

    http://dnr.wi.gov/org/es/enforcement/safety/duplic.htm

    10. Will the DNR be Changing the Curriculum of the Hunter Education Classes to include Laws on Carrying Concealed Weapons ?
    No. The DNR's hunter education course will remain the same. The Department of Natural Resources is not required, nor do we have any plans to modify our current hunter education course of instruction to include any new material or training specific to handguns or carrying a concealed weapon. The only correlation that the hunter education program has to the licenses to carry a concealed weapon is that it simply happens to be one of the types of training that the legislature has considered acceptable to qualify for a person to apply for a carry concealed weapon (CCW) license, along with needing to be at least age 21, a Wisconsin resident and not prohibited from possessing a firearm. A person has many other options to obtain firearms training to qualify for a CCW license.
    Last Revised: Wednesday August 03 2011
    Last edited by phred; 08-04-2011 at 03:40 PM.

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    Regular Member jpm84092's Avatar
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    Thanks for posing this Pfred.
    My cats support the Second Amendment. NRA Life Member, NRA Instructor: Pistol, Rifle, & Personal Protection - NRA Certified Range Safety Officer, Utah BCI Certified Concealed Firearm Permit Instructor.
    "Permission Slips" from Utah, Pennsylvania, Nevada, Arizona, and Florida. _ Verily, thou shalt not fiddle with thine firearm whilst in the bathroom stall, lest thine spouse seek condolences from thine friends.

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    7. Possession of Firearms on DNR lands in the 17 Restricted Counties
    Have the restrictions on possessing a loaded or uncased firearm on DNR owned lands changed in those counties were it is not legal to possess a loaded uncased firearm when not engaged in lawful hunting unless at a designated range or engaged in a permitted dog trial or training?

    The answer is yes if the firearm is a handgun if possessed by a person with a concealed carry license, but no for a qualified former law enforcement officer unless they also possess a concealed carry license. On DNR lands which are not state parks, state fish hatcheries or wildlife refuges, such as normal public hunting grounds, and which are located in Dane, Dodge, Fond du lac, Jefferson, Juneau, Kenosha, LaCrosse, Milwaukee, Outagamie, Ozaukee, Racine, Sauk, Sheboygan, Walworth, Washington, Waukesha, Winnebago counties or on state forest lands in the Kettle Moraine or Point Beach state forests or state recreational areas, it continues to be illegal to possess or control a loaded or uncased firearm unless engaged in lawful hunting or at a designated range or engaged in a dog trial or training activity under a permit.
    Can someone explain this to me? In the first part I bolded, it says I can have a loaded handgun if I have permit.
    In the second part I bolded, it says a loaded and uncased firearm is illegal. Am I not reading something correctly?

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    Regular Member Interceptor_Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phred View Post
    Can someone explain this to me? In the first part I bolded, it says I can have a loaded handgun if I have permit.
    In the second part I bolded, it says a loaded and uncased firearm is illegal. Am I not reading something correctly?
    It refers to firearms which are not handguns. Handgun with permit is OK but long guns including SBR/SBS are still prohibited.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Interceptor_Knight View Post
    It refers to firearms which are not handguns. Handgun with permit is OK but long guns including SBR/SBS are still prohibited.
    Thank you. Leave it to government bureaucracy to make something unclear. Maybe you should work for the govt and straighten them out.

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    Regular Member Big Dipper's Avatar
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    Apparently they don't think that a BUG should be allowed though!

    ... allowed to possess a handgun ...
    You are limited to carrying only one handgun, per the Department of Neverending Reuglations.
    Last edited by Big Dipper; 08-04-2011 at 06:30 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Dipper View Post
    Apparently they don't think that a BUG should be allowed though!



    You are limited to carrying only one handgun, per the Department of Neverending Reuglations.
    This is A handgun on my hip. This is A handgun in my pocket. This is A handgun on my ankle. This is A handgun .... One can never have too many handguns.

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    Founder's Club Member thebigsd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phred View Post
    This is A handgun on my hip. This is A handgun in my pocket. This is A handgun on my ankle. This is A handgun .... One can never have too many handguns.
    Well played. I don't think you should try your luck though...lol
    "When seconds count between living or dying, the police are only minutes away."

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    Regular Member Big Dipper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phred View Post
    This is A handgun on my hip. This is A handgun in my pocket. This is A handgun on my ankle. This is A handgun .... One can never have too many handguns.
    Hey phred, if that works maybe you can also use that with the other DNR possession limits...

    This is A fish. This is A fish. This is A fish. ...

    This is A deer. This is A deer. This is A deer. ...

    Best of luck with the DNR and such reasoning.
    Last edited by Big Dipper; 08-04-2011 at 09:28 PM.

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    Come on now, you can't be serious.

    If I go muzzleloader hunting for deer, I am not limited to one muzzleloader. If I want to stack up three muzzleloaders in my deer blind, there is nothing stopping me.

    When the DNR says I can possess a handgun in a State Park if I have a permit, they mean that I can have a firearm that IS a handgun. If I could only possess one handgun, they would have said "the handgun" or "one handgun".

    This is not like telling a little kid "you can have a cup cake" in which you mean one and only one cupcake.

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    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phred View Post
    Thank you. Leave it to government bureaucracy to make something unclear. Maybe you should work for the govt and straighten them out.
    I sure wish we could keep loaded rifles in our cars. That is one of many laws that need to be fixed.

    Quote Originally Posted by phred View Post
    Come on now, you can't be serious.

    If I go muzzleloader hunting for deer, I am not limited to one muzzleloader. If I want to stack up three muzzleloaders in my deer blind, there is nothing stopping me.

    When the DNR says I can possess a handgun in a State Park if I have a permit, they mean that I can have a firearm that IS a handgun. If I could only possess one handgun, they would have said "the handgun" or "one handgun".

    This is not like telling a little kid "you can have a cup cake" in which you mean one and only one cupcake.
    Exactly. I mean you can hunt with a handgun, why should long guns be any different?
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

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    Regular Member BROKENSPROKET's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phred View Post
    Come on now, you can't be serious.

    If I go muzzleloader hunting for deer, I am not limited to one muzzleloader. If I want to stack up three muzzleloaders in my deer blind, there is nothing stopping me.

    When the DNR says I can possess a handgun in a State Park if I have a permit, they mean that I can have a firearm that IS a handgun. If I could only possess one handgun, they would have said "the handgun" or "one handgun".

    This is not like telling a little kid "you can have a cup cake" in which you mean one and only one cupcake.
    Thank you, that is basically what I wanted to say.

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    Regular Member MKEgal's Avatar
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    As an aside, I found lots of typos in this memo. Hope they revise it soon!

    Quote Originally Posted by DNR
    1. Transportation of Firearms
    Is it true that firearms no longer have to be unloaded or in a case if in a vehicle?
    All long guns... must still be unloaded and completely enclosed within a case before they may be placed, possessed or transported in or on a vehicle...
    They neglected to mention that the case has to be locked if driving through a school zone.
    That change is gonna tick off a bunch of hunters.

    Quote Originally Posted by DNR
    2. Shining Deer or Other Wildlife
    If I have a concealed carry license... can I now possess this handgun while shining deer or other wild animals for viewing purposes?

    No. It continues to be illegal to shine for wild animals while in possession of any bow, crossbow or firearm
    So it's legal if the person using the light isn't armed, while the accompanying people are?

    Quote Originally Posted by DNR
    nor does it allow bringing the firearm inside state owned buildings on these properties which are posted with signs that provide notice that firearms are not allowed in the building.
    And you can just bet they're going to post.
    So go with a friend who can stand on the porch holding your pistol while you go in to get directions or use the bathroom or whatever.

    Quote Originally Posted by DNR
    5. Age for Possession or Hunting with a Handgun
    A person must still be at least age 21 to purchase a firearm which is a handgun, and age 18 to possess or hunt with a firearm which is a handgun.
    I thought there were rules about minors possessing handguns (& long guns, for that matter) while in the presence / supervision of an adult?

    Quote Originally Posted by phred
    One can never have too many handguns.
    Except in the case of that ever-popular Tragic Boating Accident [TM], in which case they would (almost) all have to be jettisened (sp?) in order to swim. Of course, if you're wearing a life jacket like you should be, you can save not only your firearms but yourself.

    Quote Originally Posted by phred
    Can someone explain this to me? In the first part I bolded, it says I can have a loaded handgun if I have permit.
    In the second part I bolded, it says a loaded and uncased firearm is illegal. Am I not reading something correctly?
    Quote Originally Posted by DNR
    7. Possession of Firearms on DNR lands in the 17 Restricted Counties
    The answer is yes if the firearm is a handgun if possessed by a person with a concealed carry license...
    On DNR lands which are not state parks, state fish hatcheries or wildlife refuges, such as normal public hunting grounds,
    and which are located in Dane, Dodge, Fond du lac, Jefferson, Juneau, Kenosha, LaCrosse, Milwaukee, Outagamie, Ozaukee, Racine, Sauk, Sheboygan, Walworth, Washington, Waukesha, Winnebago counties
    or
    on state forest lands in the Kettle Moraine or Point Beach state forests or state recreational areas,
    it continues to be illegal to possess or control a loaded or uncased firearm unless engaged in lawful hunting or at a designated range or engaged in a dog trial or training activity under a permit.
    The problem is in wading through all the ands & ors.

    IF you have a permit
    or
    IF you're a LEO carrying on your special permit (only carrying what you qualified with),
    THEN you can carry in a state park, state fish hatchery or wildlife refuge.

    IF you're in one of those counties,
    AND on DNR lands that are not state parks, state fish hatcheries or wildlife refuges,
    or
    you are in the two listed state forests / rec areas,
    THEN firearms must be unloaded & encased unless doing one of the 4 listed activities.

    I'd have to wade through the actual law to see if what they're saying about being restricted from state forests, rec areas, or non-state park (etc.) lands is true.
    Last edited by MKEgal; 08-04-2011 at 11:25 PM.

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    Regular Member BROKENSPROKET's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MKEgal View Post
    They neglected to mention that the case has to be locked if driving through a school zone.
    That change is gonna tick off a bunch of hunters.
    This has been discussed abit and I still don't get it. If that is true, was not also true before Act 35? What made it different?


    Quote Originally Posted by MKEgal View Post
    So it's legal if the person using the light isn't armed, while the accompanying people are?

    167.31 was created to deter poaching. Night poaching, one shines the light on the animal and another shoots it. So, absolutely no firearms, bows of crossbows in the vehicle while shining.

    ETA: There is an exception for the shining and night hunting of coyotes and racoon, but you cannot do it from a vehicle.
    Last edited by BROKENSPROKET; 08-05-2011 at 04:21 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by protias View Post
    I sure wish we could keep loaded rifles in our cars. That is one of many laws that need to be fixed.

    Exactly. I mean you can hunt with a handgun, why should long guns be any different?


    Because you cannot hunt with most handguns. Handguns primary function is self defense, not hunting.

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    Regular Member paul@paul-fisher.com's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phred View Post
    This is A handgun on my hip. This is A handgun in my pocket. This is A handgun on my ankle. This is A handgun .... One can never have too many handguns.
    Very good!

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    Well protias you can hunt and carry a loaded uncased Thompson Center Encore or Contender in your vehicle. Both have nmany combinations of calibers and barrel length. Up to and including 14 inch barreled 30-06. By definition they are both handguns. The operative word in the statute is "a" not "most". There are others out there also. The Remington XP100 and the Savage Striker and more. In fact the Taurus Judge, which is a very popular self defense gun is becomming a popular hunting handgun when loaded with .45 long colt. As long as it measures 5 1/2 inches from the end of the barrel to the firing pin it is a legal hunting handgun for Wisconsin big game.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Nemo View Post
    Well protias you can hunt and carry a loaded uncased Thompson Center Encore or Contender in your vehicle. Both have nmany combinations of calibers and barrel length. Up to and including 14 inch barreled 30-06. By definition they are both handguns. The operative word in the statute is "a" not "most". There are others out there also. The Remington XP100 and the Savage Striker and more. In fact the Taurus Judge, which is a very popular self defense gun is becomming a popular hunting handgun when loaded with .45 long colt. As long as it measures 5 1/2 inches from the end of the barrel to the firing pin it is a legal hunting handgun for Wisconsin big game.
    With a CWL, you can carry it loaded and uncased in a vehicle AND you can hunt with it, but you cannot hunt from the vehicle with it. I know that is not what you were saying, but your sentence structure may confuse the easily confused, and we don't want that to happen. I get confused enough already.
    Last edited by BROKENSPROKET; 08-06-2011 at 01:44 PM.

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    Regular Member Interceptor_Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Nemo View Post
    Well protias you can hunt and carry a loaded uncased Thompson Center Encore or Contender in your vehicle.
    So long as it was originally configured as a "pistol"... or was originally part of a rifle/pistol kit. If it was originally configured as a rifle only then it may never have a short barrel without a NFA stamp. By definition a handgun may still have a barrel 16" or longer. There are no length limits on handguns. To be safe all you have to do is stay under the total length minimum for a rifle with a handgun receiver and nobody can claim that you have a rifle which is not encased.
    Last edited by Interceptor_Knight; 08-06-2011 at 02:00 PM.

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    Regular Member Interceptor_Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Dipper View Post
    You are limited to carrying only one handgun, per the Department of Neverending Reuglations.
    There is no State Statute nor any DNR Administrative Code which limits you to a single handgun. People need to stop reading into FAQs. A FAQ is simply a summary of Statutes and Admin Code. A FAQ is not legally enforceable nor binding.

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    Regular Member Interceptor_Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Dipper View Post
    Hey phred, if that works maybe you can also use that with the other DNR possession limits...

    This is A fish. This is A fish. This is A fish. ...

    This is A deer. This is A deer. This is A deer. ...

    Best of luck with the DNR and such reasoning.
    There is Admin Code which gives you specific fish and game possession limits. (NR20.18 and NR20.20) No such limit exists for bows or firearms.
    Last edited by Interceptor_Knight; 08-06-2011 at 02:06 PM.

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    Thank you 'sprocket. I did mean to say ---you can legally hunt with a Thompson Center Encore or Contender and carry either loaded and uncased in a vehicle-------. I most certainly did not intend to imply that hunting with either from a vehicle is legal. Miss McGuilicutty would be embarassed with me.

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    175.60 License to carry a concealed weapon. (1)
    DEFINITIONS. In this section:

    (bm) “Handgun” means any weapon designed or
    redesigned, or made or remade, and intended to be fired
    while held in one hand and to use the energy of an explosive
    to expel a projectile through a smooth or rifled bore.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Nemo View Post
    175.60 License to carry a concealed weapon. (1)
    DEFINITIONS. In this section:

    (bm) “Handgun” means any weapon designed or
    redesigned, or made or remade, and intended to be fired
    while held in one hand and to use the energy of an explosive
    to expel a projectile through a smooth or rifled bore.
    Yep... I can cc my Mossberg 500 J.I.C... WOO!!! Lol.
    "I don't really care for "cream cheese"..."

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    Regular Member Interceptor_Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mlutz View Post
    Yep... I can cc my Mossberg 500 J.I.C... WOO!!! Lol.
    I hope the LOL means that you are just kidding....

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