Page 1 of 4 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 87

Thread: My first LEO stop today.

  1. #1
    Regular Member Baked on Grease's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Sterling, Va.
    Posts
    652

    My first LEO stop today.

    As some of you may know, CWA union employees who work for Verizon went strike on Sunday Aug. 7. Today I took my turn on the picket lines... and I refuse to be out in public un-armed, so I am currently walking while OC-ing, and writing this (isn't technology awesome?)

    Some one that crossed the picket lines (management) called the local police about a man with a firearm. 3 marked squad cars and one unmarked (later found out that was the Chief of Police) came by just 20 mins ago.

    I feel good about how I handled the encouhter. They asked for ID and I refused, stating that I am not driving a vehicle so am not required to show ID. I gave the officer my name and address... She tried to intimidate me into giving ID but steadfastly refused and restated my info. She tried to claim that while I had the right to carry, she neded to verify that I was not a convicted felon, as they cannot own/carry. I agreed that they cannot carry but insisted that I was within my rights as a private citizen.

    While she ran the info, I had a lengthy conversation with the other officers about the strike. All in all they left mumbling something about not intimidating people.

    I think I did well, though my heart was all aflutter the whole time. Made sure to carry my voice recorder wi th extra batteries today... Glad I did.

    (edit: just now one of the managers came out to take my picture. Trying to say that the union will never let me do this if they knew. There are 3 union reps walking the line with me, all three already stated they might bring theirs tomorrow.)


    EDIT:
    UPDATE!!:

    CWA and Verizon have come to an agreement and I will return to work on Tuesday!

    I decided not to walk the line this week as protest against the union for not wanting me to carry while picketing. I got several calls through the week asking me why I wasn't showing and got to educate some on the responsibility of self defense.

    Now to catch up on all those troubles.. Got a lot of work ahed of me. So lets see, in Nova we get about 200 Fios troubles a day, times 16 days out thays 3200 troubles to catch up on ....yay...

    Sent using tapatalk




    Sent using tapatalk
    Last edited by Baked on Grease; 08-20-2011 at 06:03 PM.
    "A Right Un-exercised is a Right Lost"

    "According to the law, [openly carrying] in a vehicle is against the law if the weapon is concealed" -Flamethrower (think about it....)

    Carrying an XDm 9mm with Hornady Critical Defense hollowpoint. Soon to be carrying a Ruger along with it....

  2. #2
    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    13,580
    Well Done!

  3. #3
    Regular Member Contrarian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Seattle,WA, , USA
    Posts
    266

    Red face Carry during strike

    Good luck.
    When Seattle hosted the WTO meeting years ago, the center of activity was two blocks from our (AT&T) office.
    MY boss held a crew meeting to tell us to avoid the area...and specifically told me not to show up armed.

    We never had a strike while I was a CWA member, so I do not know the official attitude, but our Steward was a SASS member.

  4. #4
    Regular Member fjpro2a's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    300

    I hear this over and over again

    She tried to claim that while I had the right to carry, she neded to verify that I was not a convicted felon, as they cannot own/carry.
    This seems to be a typical response by LEO. What is the best answer to give in a situation like this?
    By the way, you did a good job although I don't believe you had to give your name and address.

  5. #5
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Southern MO
    Posts
    513
    Watch real close that no SEIU thugs visit your picket line to try and put a few knots on heads.

  6. #6
    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    13,580
    Quote Originally Posted by fjpro2a View Post
    This seems to be a typical response by LEO. What is the best answer to give in a situation like this?
    By the way, you did a good job although I don't believe you had to give your name and address.
    Do you have probable suspicion that I am a felon or otherwise prohibited from carrying a firearm?
    You can't just walk up to someone legally going about their business and demand ID because he may be doing something illegal.

  7. #7
    Founder's Club Member thebigsd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Quarryville, PA
    Posts
    3,543
    Sounds like you did great!!! Hope your labor issues get resolved to your liking.
    "When seconds count between living or dying, the police are only minutes away."

  8. #8
    Regular Member TFred's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Most historic town in, Virginia, USA
    Posts
    7,705
    I gotta say, it takes cojones to walk a picket line in a right-to-work state...

    TFred

  9. #9
    Regular Member Fallschirmjäger's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Georgia, USA
    Posts
    3,915
    All in all they left mumbling something about not intimidating people.
    I wonder ....
    Do ya suppose they were reminding themselves that they shouldn't go around trying to intimidate people, or were they complaining because it seemed they couldn't intimidate someone?

  10. #10
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    1,026
    Quote Originally Posted by fjpro2a View Post
    This seems to be a typical response by LEO. What is the best answer to give in a situation like this?
    By the way, you did a good job although I don't believe you had to give your name and address.
    I myself gave this much thought after my own encounter. I came up with (IMHO) two salient counters:

    One would be to point out someone walking by with a cell phone (or some other innocuous item)
    You: "How come you're not stopping him and asking for his ID! He's got a cellphone!"
    Officer "Having a cellphone if you're a felon isn't a crime"
    You "It is if it's stolen!"
    Officer "I have no reason to believe it's stolen"
    You "Exactly!...and you have no reason to believe that I'm a felon either, so why are you harassing me? Remember...federal courts have held that there is no firearms exception to the fourth amendment!"
    (or something like that)

    Another would be to point out that the fifth specifically protects against being required to supply testimony that would incriminate oneself, so even if I was a felon in possession of a firearm forcing me to provide that information would taint the evidence and everything that proceeded from it would be thrown out of court.

  11. #11
    Regular Member TFred's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Most historic town in, Virginia, USA
    Posts
    7,705
    Quote Originally Posted by Phssthpok View Post
    Another would be to point out that the fifth specifically protects against being required to supply testimony that would incriminate oneself, so even if I was a felon in possession of a firearm forcing me to provide that information would taint the evidence and everything that proceeded from it would be thrown out of court.
    Once you get to court, your responses become "voluntary," and therefore admissible.

    TFred

  12. #12
    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    13,580
    I'd leave the verbal judo a home. Cops are masters of argument and all the logical sparring in the world won't work....I know, I do it but....I do it to start an argument, not end one.

    Read some of User's posts about keeping quiet. Just say NO and maybe a sentence in explanation, then say the conversation is over.
    If your research takes you across my code response, don't try it. It really PO's them

  13. #13
    Founder's Club Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Lynchburg, Virginia, USA
    Posts
    2,201
    Quote Originally Posted by peter nap View Post
    I'd leave the verbal judo a home. Cops are masters of argument and all the logical sparring in the world won't work....I know, I do it but....I do it to start an argument, not end one.

    Read some of User's posts about keeping quiet. Just say NO and maybe a sentence in explanation, then say the conversation is over.
    If your research takes you across my code response, don't try it. It really PO's them
    Oh, do tell of this "code response".

  14. #14
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    1,182
    She tried to claim that while I had the right to carry, she neded to verify that I was not a convicted felon, as they cannot own/carry.
    Quote Originally Posted by fjpro2a View Post
    This seems to be a typical response by LEO. What is the best answer to give in a situation like this?
    1. Am I free to go?
    2. Why are you detaining me?
    3. Repeat.

  15. #15
    Regular Member t33j's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    King George, VA
    Posts
    1,384
    Props. Nice job.

    Quote Originally Posted by peter nap View Post
    Do you have "reasonable, articulable" suspicion that I am a felon or otherwise prohibited from carrying a firearm?
    http://www.google.com/search?sourcei...w=1920&bih=970
    Last edited by t33j; 08-09-2011 at 02:51 PM.
    Sic Semper Tyrannis

  16. #16
    Regular Member wylde007's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Va Beach, Occupied VA
    Posts
    3,037

    Cool

    Quote Originally Posted by TFred View Post
    I gotta say, it takes cojones to walk a picket line in a right-to-work state...
    That's a fact, jack!
    The quiet war has begun, with silent weapons
    And the newest slavery is to keep the people poor, and stupid
    Novos ordo seclorum ~ Mustaine

    Never argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

  17. #17
    Regular Member Badger Johnson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    1,217
    Bravo, Sir!!
    A gun in a holster is better than one drawn and dispensing bullets. Concealed forces the latter. - ixtow

    Hi, I'm hypercritical. But I mean no harm, I just like to try to look deeply at life

  18. #18
    Founder's Club Member - Moderator ed's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Loudoun County - Dulles Airport, Virginia, USA
    Posts
    4,848
    Quote Originally Posted by Baked on Grease View Post
    As some of you may know, CWA union employees who work for Verizon went strike on Sunday Aug. 7. Today I took my turn on the picket lines... and I refuse to be out in public un-armed, so I am currently walking while OC-ing, and writing this (isn't technology awesome?)
    1. Are you going to post the digital audio of the entire encounter?
    2. Where did this take place? I see you are from Sterling, but Sterling does not have a "Chief of Police"
    3. Well done so far ;-)
    Carry On.

    Ed

    VirginiaOpenCarry.Org (Coins, Shirts and Patches)
    - - - -
    For VA Open Carry Cards send a S.A.2S.E. to: Ed's OC cards, Box 16143, Wash DC 20041-6143 (they are free but some folks enclose a couple bucks too)

  19. #19
    Regular Member Baked on Grease's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Sterling, Va.
    Posts
    652
    Quote Originally Posted by ed View Post
    1. Are you going to post the digital audio of the entire encounter?
    2. Where did this take place? I see you are from Sterling, but Sterling does not have a "Chief of Police"
    3. Well done so far ;-)
    I was in Herndon at the time so it was the Herndon local police that showed up. I am not entirely sure if my state/locality requires me to identify myself at least verbally, so I did in this instance to be safe.


    As an update: both my local 2222 president and the national president of CWA called near the end of my time on the picket lines. They wanted to press upon me to leave my gun home when I showed up tomorrow and to put my firearm in the trunk of the car today until I was done picketing. I told him that as soon as I have a legal, safe place to leave my firearm I will be sure to put it there. ... I did not bother to tell him that I rode my bike to day...

    Tomorrow I plan on using my thigh rig so it's much more visible, but to use a bright orange sqiurt gun in the holster instead of my regular sidearm. Thankfully I will be picketing not 30 feet from my vehicle, so my sidearm won't be too far removed from my person.

    Any thoughts on this plan, yay or nay?
    Sent using tapatalk
    "A Right Un-exercised is a Right Lost"

    "According to the law, [openly carrying] in a vehicle is against the law if the weapon is concealed" -Flamethrower (think about it....)

    Carrying an XDm 9mm with Hornady Critical Defense hollowpoint. Soon to be carrying a Ruger along with it....

  20. #20
    Regular Member t33j's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    King George, VA
    Posts
    1,384
    Quote Originally Posted by Baked on Grease View Post
    I was in Herndon at the time so it was the Herndon local police that showed up. I am not entirely sure if my state/locality requires me to identify myself at least verbally, so I did in this instance to be safe.


    As an update: both my local 2222 president and the national president of CWA called near the end of my time on the picket lines. They wanted to press upon me to leave my gun home when I showed up tomorrow and to put my firearm in the trunk of the car today until I was done picketing. I told him that as soon as I have a legal, safe place to leave my firearm I will be sure to put it there. ... I did not bother to tell him that I rode my bike to day...

    Tomorrow I plan on using my thigh rig so it's much more visible, but to use a bright orange sqiurt gun in the holster instead of my regular sidearm. Thankfully I will be picketing not 30 feet from my vehicle, so my sidearm won't be too far removed from my person.

    Any thoughts on this plan, yay or nay?
    Sent using tapatalk
    So they think you're incapable of protesting peacefully while carrying a sidearm. Isn't being a part of that stuff done voluntarily?
    Sic Semper Tyrannis

  21. #21
    Founder's Club Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Lynchburg, Virginia, USA
    Posts
    2,201
    The people you hire to represent your interests to your employer think you are capable to make correct decisions regarding the status of your employment, including holding your job or protesting workplace issues, but they don't believe that you are capable of peacefully carrying a tool to keep yourself safe? Sheesh if they are so worried about the mental capacity of the people they represent, perhaps they'd do well to have you all leave your employer's site and they should stay away from you all before the whole of you start harming each other. However if you may be trusted to peaceably protest without killing each other and harming the property of others why are you to be considered incapable of protecting your very own life? I'd continue to carry and I'd probably look for different people to represent my interests to an employer as they clearly don't think much of their customer.

  22. #22
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    1,182
    Quote Originally Posted by Baked on Grease View Post
    Tomorrow I plan on using my thigh rig so it's much more visible, but to use a bright orange sqiurt gun in the holster instead of my regular sidearm.
    Why not just carry the real handgun but paint the tip of the barrel orange so that it looks like a toy?




    (disclaimer for those that can't 'read' sarcastic humor: Thats not a real suggestion & I'm NOT being serious)

  23. #23
    Regular Member Baked on Grease's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Sterling, Va.
    Posts
    652
    I think I have to clarify a bit, my union wants me to not carry while picketing because it might cause bad publicity for the strike... Though at this point any publicity is worthwhile...

    Sent using tapatalk
    Last edited by Baked on Grease; 08-09-2011 at 07:32 PM.
    "A Right Un-exercised is a Right Lost"

    "According to the law, [openly carrying] in a vehicle is against the law if the weapon is concealed" -Flamethrower (think about it....)

    Carrying an XDm 9mm with Hornady Critical Defense hollowpoint. Soon to be carrying a Ruger along with it....

  24. #24
    Regular Member Motofixxer's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Somewhere over the Rainbow
    Posts
    970
    So they think it might give bad publicity??? And???? What does that have to do with you and your personal actions on personal time in a public place. Where do they think their authority comes from to tell you what you can and can't do out in public? We all have opinions, but we can't go around forcing them on others against their will. I say if you feel comfortable carrying...then do it.
    Last edited by Motofixxer; 08-09-2011 at 07:41 PM.
    Click Here for New to WI Open Carry Legal References and Informational Videos--- FAQ's http://Tinyurl.com/OpenCarry-WI

    The Armed Badger A WI site dedicated to Concealed Carry in WI

    "To disarm the people... was the best and most effectual way to enslave them." -- George Mason, Speech of June 14, 1788

    http://Tinyurl.com/New-To-Guns to DL useful Info

  25. #25
    Regular Member Baked on Grease's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Sterling, Va.
    Posts
    652
    The only thing they can do about it is to remove me from the union but current circumstances (dont know if it's law or contractual with the union) makes it so that if I have the same job title as a union guy working for the.company I get all th ev same benefits as a paying union member, even to th ev point where the union has to represent me in disputes. They just lose out on my 2% dues is all.

    Sent using tapatalk
    "A Right Un-exercised is a Right Lost"

    "According to the law, [openly carrying] in a vehicle is against the law if the weapon is concealed" -Flamethrower (think about it....)

    Carrying an XDm 9mm with Hornady Critical Defense hollowpoint. Soon to be carrying a Ruger along with it....

Page 1 of 4 123 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •