lapeer20m
Regular Member
I would also like to point out that there are likely establishments licensed to sell alcohol that do not actually sell any.
Now that is new to me. What about public places, such as walking downtown, or in my case, I long-board a lot in area's that aren't so reputable. Is it legal to carry in public places as such? Also what about shopping center's such as a Meijer or a Wal-Mart, unless it's posted by sign or I am verbally asked to leave or not to carry, it is allowed in such places correct?
Seems there would be an exemption in place for the parking lot or vehicles considering if they stay locked up, It isnt an issue.
But does that mean stores that dont sell liquor are legal to carry in without permission? And what about public roads and sidewalks?
As pointed out by Lapeer20m there maybe places that don't sell booze but, have a license. The cops know these traps and are more than willing to jam up a poorly informed OCer. Good luck and carry on! :dude:
Ahh, Good to know there are other young carriers! On my visit to the police station after they had refused to answer my questions and told me they didn't have time to explain the law to me, they asked me why I was deciding to open carry. So I said to them "Because you wont let me conceal it until I'm 21." Then turned and left. Sure they weren't too happy about that.
So a store that sells liquor is off limits? While a store such as Dunhams or an Art Van or Clothing store that does not have a liquor license I do not need permission from the store owner to Carry?
Unfortuantely, it's not just the store, it's the "premises." Meaning, the buillding(s) and all other property the building is on, to include the parking lot. See 750.234d
Now that is new to me. What about public places, such as walking downtown, or in my case, I long-board a lot in area's that aren't so reputable. Is it legal to carry in public places as such? Also what about shopping center's such as a Meijer or a Wal-Mart, unless it's posted by sign or I am verbally asked to leave or not to carry, it is allowed in such places correct?
Besides state and federal law you can OC in all areas not listed in .234d. Keep in mind that businesses can ban firearms.
Except your car -- no such thing as OC in a car. Car Carry = CC in MI ...
(2) A person shall not carry a pistol concealed on or about his or her person, or, whether concealed or otherwise, in a vehicle operated or occupied by the person, except in his or her dwelling house, place of business, or on other land possessed by the person, without a license to carry the pistol as provided by law and if licensed, shall not carry the pistol in a place or manner inconsistent with any restrictions upon such license.
Thank you sir! Most of these questions I assumed the answer to. But I wanted a second opinion just to be sure. Thanks for taking the time to adequately answer =)
Hmmmm- if a bicycle could be considered a 'vehicle', what about a long board? I understand there's no case law, but, what think ye?
What about a skate board, this might apply if more and more of our responseable youth start to OC? Its powered by the person useing it same as a bike but could it be considered a vehicle like a bike. I ask this because my daughter just asked me about, she can be very astute at times, and it IMO could be concievable so I put it to you the OC experts. Leagl yes, no, maybe?
Today I made a trip to the state police station and they very rudely denied to answer my questions and sent me to this website...
My only comment here is what I have gleaned by reading the law and some Michigan court cases. As it has been said many times before, the statute in question refers to "vehicle". Since the term is not defined in the actual mcl, judges have some options. One option is to defines it using the vehicle code, which I believe would make riding OC on a bicycle or a skateboard legal without a cpl.
Lacking a definition in the MCL, the judge could decide to define it using a dictionary of his/her choosing. A vehicle implies that it is a contrivance that moves people or goods from one place to another; a definition which appears to cover bicycles and skateboards.
There was a Michigan case, which I don't have handy, that talks about a trailer being a vehicle in an issue that concerned governmental immunity. On the other hand, I have seen many cases in my research that, when charges are actually laid against a person, the charge often is cited as "carrying a pistol in a motor vehicle". Note the use of the word "motor".
So, in essence, some cases would be a point for the notion of skateboards and bicycles being a vehicle and some cases would seem to indicate carry without a cpl on a bike or skateboard would be legal. So, I guess until we have a clear court case where either it is deemed either legal or illegal, the safe thing to do would be to consider that the word "vehicle" includes skateboards and bicycles. To those here who posess a cpl, it really is a non-issue as it only affects those without a cpl.
* Before I had my cpl, I was actually stopped by the DNR while handgun hunting and riding my bike. The officer checked my license and let me go on my way. Would I use this as indication of its legality? Probably not, though I sure am happy I wasn't cited... although maybe I could have become the "testcase" for the state of Michigan. lol