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Free doughnuts anyone?
- Thread starter jsanchez
- Start date
Dave_pro2a
Regular Member
Are they doing that for John Williams too?
How about Chris Harris?
Yeah, I'll pass on the Irony donuts but thanks for posting the info.
joeroket
Regular Member
Harris didn't even have anything to do with SPD. If your going to slam something then get your damned facts straight or shut up.
Dave_pro2a
Regular Member
So Corporations should only deify dead cops with free donuts, not innocent civilians permanently disabled or killed by cops?
Why?
Is it just because they sell donuts and cops love donuts?
It's a lame PR move by the cops and the company. A [strike]jelly[/strike] irony filled, feel good, civil employee worship fest.
Oh, and the obligatory "what does this thread/topic have to do with open carry?" Unless the OP was implying people should OC when getting their free donuts.
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wow man, ur logic is twisted. officers are their to protect the community. a dead cop is like a smack in the face to the entire community, thats why it is so tragic when one is killed, and thats why a big deal is made over it. and i cant eat doughnuts, i have crohns disease and cant eat wheat. thanks for the stereotype though
joeroket
Regular Member
So Corporations should only deify dead cops with free donuts, not innocent civilians permanently disabled or killed by cops?
Why?
Is it just because they sell donuts and cops love donuts?
It's a lame PR move by the cops and the company. A [strike]jelly[/strike] irony filled, feel good, civil employee worship fest.
Oh, and the obligatory "what does this thread/topic have to do with open carry?" Unless the OP was implying people should OC when getting their free donuts.
Again get your facts straight before you post or shut up.
It is not a PR move. It is put on in memory of Joselito. Today marks the 5th anniversary of his death. It is being put on by his friends and family not SPD. The donations that people give are for a scholarship fund.
Dave_pro2a
Regular Member
Don't get your panties in a bunch about me: bitch to the guy who made the OP.
If the OP is wrong, then post link to a press release, website or news article that corrects the misinformation contained in the OP. Personally I care so little about this issue I will not fact check the original post.
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Dave_pro2a
Regular Member
wow man, ur logic is twisted. officers are their to protect the community. a dead cop is like a smack in the face to the entire community, thats why it is so tragic when one is killed, and thats why a big deal is made over it. and i cant eat doughnuts, i have crohns disease and cant eat wheat. thanks for the stereotype though
It's job. They do it for the paycheck. It is not even an especially dangerous job. Any risk they face they do so with full knowledge and compensation.
Police are no more 'valuable' in regards to serving the community than PUD workers, or Municipal Water workers. PUD line work is FAR more dangerous than LEO work: far more dangerous.
Yet when a line worker dies they don't close city streets for a funeral procession, give away free time in the Tacoma dome, rack up thousand and thousands in paid overtime for staffing the event with LEO for 'security,' put it on the news for a month straight, etc.
Arguably, PUD and water workers are MORE valuable to the community. I need water and power every day, I've never needed a police officer. Same goes with the vast majority of people.
IMHO a lot of this is social engineering, pure and simple. And a lot of it is union BS.
My logic might be twisted in your opinion, but it's still logical.
BTW, sincere sympathy for the Crohns. That is a harsh condition to live with. And the typical treatments are no fun at all. Are you doing steroids?
joeroket
Regular Member
Here.
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2015903580_barber14m.html
That took me all of 2 seconds. I didn't need a link anyway I already knew about it.
I bet you fact check when you think you can prove someone wrong but you apparently don't feel the need when it benefits your anti-leo sentiments.
if u think police officers are un-necessary go on a ride along one day and watch the bs they have to put up with. there are way more dangerous jobs out there, but by far, police are required to keep society under control. i went on a call the other day at an apartment complex where there was a domestic dispute over cheese...yes, cheese. the wife was threatening her partner with a knife because she ate all the cheese and she wouldnt go get more. i cant imagine what would had happened if we didnt show up.haha. and yeah, im on prednisone and a plethora of other crap. thanks
ManInBlack
Regular Member
Guess who else has to put of with B.S.? Bus drivers, pizza delivery boys, entrepreneurs, owners of small businesses, and everyday joes like me. So what? Life is tough; big freaking deal. They don't have to put up with the B.S. they see; they are perfectly free to switch to another profession and put up with the B.S. of their choice.
No, Thomas Hobbes was wrong. We are not merely animals held in check only by fear of the state's lethal violence, and I resent the attempt of any other man to keep me "under control." That is called "slavery." If the police went away tomorrow, 99.99% of people wouldn't descend into barbarism. The other 0.01% do that anyway, and I would rather take my chances with them then be forced to pay for a protection racket that is under no legal obligation to provide protection to anyone, and in fact, seems to pose an imminent threat to the life, liberty and property of people who have done nothing wrong.
Probably nothing. Most threats are empty, especially when issued by the lowest common denominator of humanity. Even if some domestic violence did transpire between the two of them, I really doubt that it would have escalated to the destruction of civilization as we know it.
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Dave_pro2a
Regular Member
ManinBlack is dead on. He seems educated, articulate, and understands the philosophy upon which the country was founded.
Life, in a state of nature, is not 'nasty brutish and short.' Humans will always naturally, in general, cooperate because we are rational and reasonable beings by nature (ala Locke). Even the night-watchman model of classical liberalism goes too far on the pessimistic side, and on the Rights infringing side.
If you don't understand this kind of political philosophy, then for God's sake DO NOT VOTE. You do not understand what it is to be an American.
Here's a hint, if you are for lower taxes and limited government, then you ought to be against the State's monopoly on the use of force. It abdicates people of their personal responsibility, and people will always live DOWN to the minimum requirement or expectation -- making for a nation that does require police, because they started having police to rely on. It's a vicious cycle imho, that can be blamed on the fact we have police. This is exactly like the welfare issue, having welfare breeds the need for more welfare because welfare negatively impacts the individual's desire/motive to be productive (modern welfare is far different than an orphan's fund)
And things haven't gotten better because we have police, in fact police have made the problem worse -- as evidenced by the fact they are now a full paramilitary organization with assault teams, armored tanks, etc. They didn't start that way, things escelated to that extreme.
Also evidenced by the fact incarceration rates have skyrocketed since militarizing police, not declined. If the modern police state was effective, then they would not be increasing arms, the warfare mentality, and incarceration rates. It's about profit, oppression and control, plain and simple.
As to that DV call, that does not effect society. Those two people can stab themselves silly, so what. That's no different than mutually agreed upon combat. Eventually either the wife or husband should rub two brain cells together and file for divorce.
And besides, police generally don't prevent crime, instead they investigate after it has occurred. Cops also have zero duty to protect individual people. They can sit there and watch you die, get raped, stabbed, or whatever, with no repercussions. The only have a legal obligation to preserve the peace in a general sense -- and they fail miserable at that as proven by Katrina and the Seattle Fat Tues incident.
Prednisone suck. A good case of the treatment being nearly as bad as the disease, but then there's not many treatment options unless you want to break Federal law and use MMJ (which in theory treats Crohns by slightly suppressing the immune response and slowing down intestinal track muscle activity/contractions). On the upside, wheat/gluten free products are everywhere these days, even some tasty desserts.
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Dave_pro2a
Regular Member
Worst case scenario: http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2015904215_homicide14m.html
Police did not prevent that.
Police cannot prevent that sort of act.
Police have no legal duty to prevent that sort of act.
That act does not negatively impact society as a whole, to any significant degree.
That kind of act is isolated, and would be isolated even if we had no police. Because most people are rational, with a natural ability (and proclivity) toward being compassionate.
And to use these sorts of incidents as justification to eradicate people's inalienable Rights makes this society a hypocritical farce (i.e. Lautenberg).
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Metalhead47
Regular Member
I'm curious here... since you seem to imply society ought to exist with NO police of any sort, how exactly do you think it would "work?" Say you come home to find a family member brutally murdered. Can't call 911, whom do you call? How is a suspect to be identified, apprehended, and handed over to the courts?
exactly metalhead. and when i said that police have to put up with bs...its not the bs that u deal with. just because ur an officer doesnt mean u have no touch with the reality that goes on around you. i know about small business and let me ask....who do u call when u come to work in the morning to find that your shop has been broken in to? who do u call when u have been robbed? and dont say..."well he would be a corpse on the floor if he robbed me!", because most of the time it is a surprise and u would be shocked to find out just how difficult it is to think straight when u are being held at gunpoint.
when does a pizza boy, bus driver, entrepreneur, small business owner, or average joe, have to chase down a suspect who may or may not pull out a gun or knife and kill u when u find him just because he is on parole violation and doesnt want to go to jail? and when u consider the domestic violence dispute was between a woman and her mentally deranged partner who has been arrested before for actually stabing someone.....i cant imagine as to what would have happened.
Metalhead47
Regular Member
I'm not quite jumping to your defense bro. I believe that police are necessary, but should serve a GREATLY reduced role in society. Sudden Valley Gunner says it best when he rants against "pro-active" policing. The police CANNOT protect anyone, and they are under no obligation to do so. What they CAN do, and what they've proven to be very very good at, is examining the evidence of a crime scene, tracking down and apprehending the suspect after the fact, and turning him over to the courts. THAT should be their primary role in society. And enforcing traffic laws. The individual is responsible for their own protection, among other things. I don't jive with alot of what Dave_pro2a has to say, as he's most definitely anti-cop, however he does make a great point about the DV couple. Harsh as it is to day, they can stab the crap out of each other and it really doesn't effect society as a whole. But the police DO have a certain role to play if one of them grows half a brain cell and calls the police out to "pacify" the situation, allow the one to leave, and/or prevent an assault.
Speaking AS a bus driver, I have to worry every day about some nutjob assaulting me over $1.75. Difference is, #1 under company policy I have absolutely zero authority to do ANYTHING, and must call for assistance in any given situation, and #2, I am specifically prohibited from carrying any device for self protection. No, I don't have to chase a suspect down... they come right to me, and at least when you finally meet the perp, you've got a gun/taser/mace/buddies for protection.
The woman in that situation deserves a certain amount of blame herself for REMAINING in such a bad situation when she should have left long ago.
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amzbrady
Regular Member
I believe society should have law enforcement officers. I also believe law enforcement officers should be held accountable for their actions, and not be held above the law. I believe law enforcement officers should enforce ALL laws, no matter what the law, or how big or little, but I also believe that all the laws need to be reviewed and some either deleted, downgraded, or changed to fit society. I believe police should have to know the law AND what the publics rights are. I dont think there should be ANY paid leave if an officer is accused of a crime or is under investigation. I believe we should stop trying to rehabilitate criminals, and start punishing them. I believe there should be no "getting off on good behavior". You start off, "off on good behavior". Criminals should do the time they have been sentenced. We as tax payers should not have to support prisoners who get life sentences and are sentenced guilty beyond a reasonable doubt, with multiple witnesses seeing the crime happen, esp those who are sentenced double life terms, they should be executed. Prisoners who have been cleared of charges by DNA should be let out of prison and the judge and prosecuting attorney should have to serve the same sentence they unjustly sent the prisoner to prison for. Prisoners should not get TV, visits, internet, reading material, medical, and cigarettes. They should get just enough food to sustain them until they have finished serving their time. All cells should be solitary confinement, they will not want to go back under those conditions. Twould be nice to see some honesty, responsibility, and politeness in this country.
But....Thats just what I believe. I believe it is now time, for those who dont believe the same way I do to chime in...
i beg to differ with u metalhead. cops can protect people. when a cop drives up to a fight in a patrol car, what happens? most of the time people scatter. what would happen if there wasnt an officer on duty? well ill tell u... a person could be beaten to death. who is there to stop hippy protests(nothing against hippies) that easy get out of control fast? cops(with the exception of a few bad ones) want nothing more than to go home to their families every night(our main job). cops jobs are also to protect and serve? most of the time, people are happy to see the police arrive on scene before things get out of control. if everyone was responsible with a weapon and was prepared to use it, cops would be a little more un-necesarry. but what is more realistic? a police department or expecting citizens to behave and protect their own?
i couldnt agree more