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anyone going to the selfridge airshow tomorrow

TheQ

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Freedom of speech -- etc.

I stand during the National Anthem but I don't believe I would be willing to fight and die for what this Country is becoming. Liberty -- now that I'd fight and die for.
 

smellslikemichigan

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Jun 16, 2008
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Troy, Michigan, USA
You are absolutely disgusting!! If you don't like it here, I will gladly pay for your passport and a one way ticket!!

as a former marine, i actually don't take offense to statements like that. when a govt oversteps in the way ours has, some form of protest is warranted. some vets choose to disrespect their uniforms and awards.
i did, however, stand at attention during the national anthem. they actually made an announcement that congress says it's ok for veterans in civilian clothing with or without a cover to render hand salute to the colors... i refrained and continued to stand at attention... i'm sure you marines would feel uncomfortable saluting in civvies, or without a cover. we'll leave that to the army.
 

smellslikemichigan

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yes, he sure did. very sad. i was there saturday and i witnessed him miss his transfer from plane to helicopter 3 or 4 times. then something told me to record so i got out my phone and recorded his last successful stunt. i was not at all surprised to hear of his death as i fully expected him to die saturday.
 
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Jared

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Jul 8, 2006
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The reason I would say something like that, is out of respect for the country, the flag, and those who fight to protect it.

This is interesting because the Pledge issue does get people wound up and emotional. I would advise for anyone who has a strong opinion either way on the issue to look up Francis Bellamy as his history is not what many people would think.

The constitution was about ideas of liberty. The "flag" and the "republic" are offsprings of the constitution.

The intersting question is what would happen if the "flag" and the "republic" one day represented a government similar to that of the United Kingdom? How many would still have strong views in favor of it if one day the United States looked more like Europe because setting the 2nd amendment aside, the United States is looking more and more like Europe every day?

In my view, someone saying the pledge who has no respect for the Bill of Rights should be held in a lower regard than someone who pushes for liberty (MOC activism, FIJA etc) and doesn't say the pledge.

Personally, I do say the pledge if I'm at a sporting event or somewhere where it is a custom; however, at the same time, it doesn't define me, I have no strong views on it either way, I understand the history of it, I realize that the United States survived for 116 years without it, and I accept that the author of it was a devout socialist who had little respect for the Constitution or liberty in general.
 

HKcarrier

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Mar 9, 2011
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michigan
yes, he sure did. very sad. i was there saturday and i witnessed him miss his transfer from plane to helicopter 3 or 4 times. then something told me to record so i got out my phone and recorded his last successful stunt. i was not at all surprised to hear of his death as i fully expected him to die saturday.


I saw a vid of it on youtube... looked like he just lost his footing... didn't look like an unsuccessful transfer... Can't believe he wouldn't have had some sort of back up plan...cable...chute... SOMETHING. Sheesh.
 

TheQ

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I saw a vid of it on youtube... looked like he just lost his footing... didn't look like an unsuccessful transfer... Can't believe he wouldn't have had some sort of back up plan...cable...chute... SOMETHING. Sheesh.

Parachute may not have time to open at that height -- let alone pull the rip chord.

Cable may be feasible -- buy where to hook it? Maybe the chopper's feet? -- assuming you can touch it. If the cable is attached to the plane, how do you disconnect it after the transfer?
 

HKcarrier

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michigan
Well I understand there wouldn't be enough time for a soft landing, but a chute may have been able to slow his descent enough to have saved his life... while maybe still breaking many bones, etc...


I was thinking a cable to the bottom of the plane would leave him dangling below the plane, but as slow as that thing flies, they could run a vehilcle down the runway, catch him, and clip the cable... could have been a stunt in its own.


Regardless... sucks he was killed and sucks everyone had to watch.
 

Michigander

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Mulligan's Valley
definitely no time for a chute at that height.

As I recall the Rhodesian Army did jumps from 500 feet, maybe even a tad less. Seems like even if you don't get slowed down all the way, it might be kind of like a bad motorcycle accident where the armor might save your life and leave you paralyzed, as opposed to dead with no protection. But then I've never gone skydiving, so please correct me if I'm wrong.
 

Michigander

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Aug 24, 2007
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Mulligan's Valley
Why celebrate freedom unarmed? Seems a bit hollow to me.

I can't really associate the modern airforce even slightly with freedom. They're an offensive force which lately fights offensive wars without them even being declared as required by our constitution. But it's still fun to go. There is nothing quite like A10 Warthogs, and Selfridge luckily has tons of them. And WWII planes! My God how cool!
 
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