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Thread: Arrested at HyVee...Need Attorney Suggestions.

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    Regular Member Reverend BCal's Avatar
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    Arrested at HyVee...Need Attorney Suggestions.

    I was openly carrying at HyVee last night and was arrested for Trespassing and Disorderly Conduct for Obstructing an Officer by Not Showing ID. This incident, while closely related to the police harassment at HyVee from several months earlier, was also video recorded (like the first) in the presence of my newborn son, my girlfriend and 7 St. Joseph Police Officers. Even though I was not charged with a weapons violation, my firearm and pocket knife were seized and will not be released until the prosecuting attorney says otherwise. I do not wish to give any further details until I have properly spoken to my attorney about the situation. I am the seeking representation from an attorney with experience in civil rights or arrest procedure law who has a positive attitude and will treat the situation with as much gravity and seriousness as I do. (preferably in the Kansas City or NW Missouri area)

    Any suggestions are appreciated. Videos will follow as soon as I possibly can. Thank You.
    "Before all else, be armed." -Nicolo Machiavelli

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    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend BCal View Post
    . (preferably in the Kansas City or NW Missouri area)

    Any suggestions are appreciated. Videos will follow as soon as I possibly can. Thank You.

    Kevin Jamison

    http://kljamisonlaw.com/

    Advocate, president MSSA, WMSA, had a HUGE role in getting CCW passed in MO.

    Good man for the job.
    John C. Eastman Associate Dean of Chapman University’s School of Law "the Second Amendment, like its sister amendments, does not confer a right but rather recognizes a natural right inherent in our humanity."

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    BTW,

    Good luck, sorry you have had this experience, and by all means, DO NOT KEEP US POSTED.

    All lawyers will tell you, shut the mouth first, speak when its over.

    I really want to hear about it, see any video etc, however, I would rather not have any of it until it is clear you have retained your freedom and are not at risk.

    Will say a prayer.

    By all means, if it starts getting expensive as hell, speak out to that issue only and we will see what we can do to raise some coin.

    FYI the family firms start at 1500 bucks for a retainer on a misdemeanor here in the St Louis area just to give you an idea of the starting point you may face.
    John C. Eastman Associate Dean of Chapman University’s School of Law "the Second Amendment, like its sister amendments, does not confer a right but rather recognizes a natural right inherent in our humanity."

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    Let's hope the prosecutor realizes he doesn't have a case and drops the charges. Good luck.

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    Campaign Veteran ComSec's Avatar
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    that suck hope you get a good settlement.

    Kevin Jamison is not pro OC I get in fights with him at gunshows all the time about it, but he is nice old guy

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    Regular Member Tony4310's Avatar
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    You are in our thoughts,brother.

    Listen to LMTD and do not share a thing till the time is right.

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    I recently won such a case, charges dismissed. Part of the Skidmark drama you may have read about in the "stories from the states / Virginia" stickies list.

    My website has a link to a PDF file I put together, scroll down below the mailbox and "save as" the file indicated by the first link, entitled, "Notes on the obligation to identify one's self to law enforcement officers in Virginia". There may be some stuff in there that will be of use to the attorney you hire, if, as I recall, Missouri's legal system is based on English common law, as is Virginia's.
    Daniel L. Hawes - 540 347 2430 - HTTP://www.VirginiaLegalDefense.com

    By the way, nothing I say on this website as "user" should be taken as either advertising for attorney services or legal advice, merely personal opinion. Everyone having a question regarding the application of law to the facts of their situation should seek the advice of an attorney competent in the subject matter of the issues presented and licensed to practice in the relevant state.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LMTD View Post
    Kevin Jamison

    http://kljamisonlaw.com/

    Advocate, president MSSA, WMSA, had a HUGE role in getting CCW passed in MO.

    Good man for the job.
    He's definitely the man in W MO, and probably E MO, for firearm related cases. He doesn't appear to be much of a fan of OC though. Since there are no firearms charges, he might not be the best choice for you. He does do general criminal defense though.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ComSec View Post
    that suck hope you get a good settlement.

    Kevin Jamison is not pro OC I get in fights with him at gunshows all the time about it, but he is nice old guy
    You are some what correct, he is not an advocate however he is not anti-oc either. He sees it as a potential impediment to furthering firearms laws in Missouri.

    Kind of a don't ask don't tell and OC is telling.

    His personal opinions and not being an advocate while having merit have nothing to do with his professional ability to represent anyone on firearms issues, not only does he know it well, he indeed drafted a great many of the firearms laws over the last 15 or so years. He was absolutely instrumental in getting CCW for Missouri.

    He may have several opinions but he has even been to counsel for the appellant in court to try and eliminate the SIS issue on the old permit to acquire.

    Kevin might well recommend everyone be totally compliant and immediately hand over ID to an officer as his PERSONAL opinion, but I can assure you, THIS IS THE GUY I WOULD WANT for ANY firearms related case in the state of MO.

    I guess what I am saying is simply that while there are folks who are not FOR our cause, that does not mean they OPPOSE it.
    John C. Eastman Associate Dean of Chapman University’s School of Law "the Second Amendment, like its sister amendments, does not confer a right but rather recognizes a natural right inherent in our humanity."

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    Campaign Veteran ComSec's Avatar
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    Well said ...

  11. #11
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    I wonder why cops think it's okay to charge someone with a crime for not showing ID... What are they going to do if you do not have your ID on you? Sometimes I leave my wallet in the car because I am only running in the store for a few things and intend on paying with cash.

    The trespassing charge will most likely be thrown out unless an employee in HyVee asked you to leave and you refused. It seems like disorderly conduct is one of those "catch-all" charges that LEOs pull when you aren't giving in to them or behaving in a certain way.

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    MO Stop & ID law already discussed

    here: http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...-Identify-Laws

    No, I did not read the 3 pages of discussion. Thus, I have no idea how the laws mesh with the OP's arrest.

    But since the issue seems to be whether or not the charge was valid to begin with, I tgought a trip back to the law and its interpretation by the courts might help everyone understand how the OP and the cops ended up where they did.

    On a personal note - this is not a gun rights or civil rights issue. It's a criminal charge and needs to be addressed as such. Knowing the gun laws may or may not help. It all depends on how the Stop & ID laws play into the presence of a gun or not. I'm glad my attorney knows the gun laws, but I didn't hire him for that reason. I hired him because he's a good criminal defense attorney.

    Best of luck to the OP. We'll read the full story after your trial. Till then let your attorney be the one to release any info.

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
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    Yesh, we could have been in the same boat. I hadn't been to HyVee in awhile and about a week ago my wife and I went in, but I was unarmed (as my dog had somehow gotten a hold of my holster and decided to chew it up), noticing that they have an officer there at night almost every time. If I had been open carrying the same thing might have happened.

    It does make me sick however. But that's St. Joe police for you, they have to throw bogus charges at you to try and scare people off while their own get to walk free after committing murder.

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    Regular Member Richieg150's Avatar
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    Thats one of the main problems with LEO's in this country. They throw a bunch of different bogus charges on you hoping something will stick or you run out of money trying to fight the charges. The only way this kind of treatment will stop, is LEO's being held accountable for such conduct and being terminated for such conduct, and the city reimbursing you for money spent defending bogus charges. Maybe going to a ST. Joe town hall meeting, or monthly city hall meeting and bringing up the subject could do some good.
    Psalm 144:1 Blessed be the LORD my strength, which teacheth my hands to war, and my fingers to fight:
    Psalm 144:2 My goodness, and my fortress; my high tower, and my deliverer; my shield, and he in whom I trust; who subdueth my people under me. Pro 14:15 The simple believeth every word: but the prudent man looketh well to his going.

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    Going to a city hall council meeting wont help in St. Joe becuz the city administrators leave the Police department alone except when it comes time to mess with the budget. Cops have free roam of this city and have nothing to fear so they continue to do what they wish and nothing will stick to them cuz all the judges are on their side.

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    Regular Member Richieg150's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    Cops have free roam of this city and have nothing to fear so they continue to do what they wish and nothing will stick to them cuz all the judges are on their side.
    Thats the problem....they forget their power was given to them by the people.....That they serve the people, not the other way around. Those corrupt, (those who cant seem to follow laws as they are written and intended and enforce and sentence based upon their own ideas and opinions), judges and cops need to be fired or voted out....
    Psalm 144:1 Blessed be the LORD my strength, which teacheth my hands to war, and my fingers to fight:
    Psalm 144:2 My goodness, and my fortress; my high tower, and my deliverer; my shield, and he in whom I trust; who subdueth my people under me. Pro 14:15 The simple believeth every word: but the prudent man looketh well to his going.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Richieg150 View Post
    Thats the problem....they forget their power was given to them by the people.....That they serve the people, not the other way around. Those corrupt, (those who cant seem to follow laws as they are written and intended and enforce and sentence based upon their own ideas and opinions), judges and cops need to be fired or voted out....
    If I may rephrase that just a little.

    The people have FAILED at LIMITING the POWER of those they put into office and as power corrupts, those in power indeed abuse it to their maximum ability and the PEOPLE continue to fail to LIMIT it.
    John C. Eastman Associate Dean of Chapman University’s School of Law "the Second Amendment, like its sister amendments, does not confer a right but rather recognizes a natural right inherent in our humanity."

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    Quote Originally Posted by LMTD View Post
    If I may rephrase that just a little.

    The people have FAILED at LIMITING the POWER of those they put into office and as power corrupts, those in power indeed abuse it to their maximum ability and the PEOPLE continue to fail to LIMIT it.
    Agreed. Unfortunately, there are 3 basic ways to do this.
    1. Ballot (includes all political action)
    2. Drastic personal life changes
    2. Bullet

    If anyone truly believes that out government has overstepped it's authority, it is now incumbent on you to remove your children and their children from the public education system which is designed to raise slaves to the corporate-government machine. Otherwise, you may as well discard your hope of a free America for your children. We must remove the influence of the socialist pan-Leninists on the next generation or consider yourselves hypocrites. I know many will claim that it is "hard" and "expensive" to educate them yourself. True, having a single income is not easy. And staying home to train children is alot less fun than going to a job (sometimes). This was one of the great goals of the women's movement, to transfer the training of children from their mothers to the state in the name of "liberation". Sorry if I am stepping on your toes, but someone needs to point out that the Emporer is naked.

    It is fine and good to strap a gun to your hip and cry foul at the government. It is another to do something with lasting consequences which can change the course of history. Do you think that our forefathers would not have preferred to live out their lives comfortable in their wealth (yes, most were wealthy and most lost much of their wealth or lives). They risked everything to make a better life for the next generation. Are we too comfortable to risk what we have for the sake of liberty for our children?

    And back to the point of LMTD's post, the corruption filters down to your children if you allow the state to decide the content of your children's education. Please get your head out of the sand before it is too late. The Lord of the flies environment they are subjected to does little to improve their character.
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    Quote Originally Posted by peterarthur View Post
    If anyone truly believes that out government has overstepped it's authority, it is now incumbent on you to remove your children and their children from the public education system which is designed to raise slaves to the corporate-government machine.


    And back to the point of LMTD's post, the corruption filters down to your children if you allow the state to decide the content of your children's education.

    Education begins at home....

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    Regular Member Reverend BCal's Avatar
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    Kevin Jamison =$2500 retainer. Apparently freedom costs more than a buck o' nine...
    "Before all else, be armed." -Nicolo Machiavelli

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    Regular Member Tony4310's Avatar
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    Home schooling is fine if one of the parents can afford to stay home. Even then you have to meet state requirements.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blk97F150 View Post
    Education begins at home....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tony4310 View Post
    Home schooling is fine if one of the parents can afford to stay home. Even then you have to meet state requirements.
    We look at it another way.... when it comes to our children, we can't afford to NOT raise and care for them in a manner that we believe to be the best for them. We will not put our children in a 'learning environment' that we feel is inadequate because of 'money'.

    And yes, states have minimum education requirements that need to be met, but for most states it’s not all that difficult to meet them… and many homeschoolers consistently exceed them.

    If this is getting too far off topic, feel free to PM instead....

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    Regular Member Richieg150's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend BCal View Post
    Kevin Jamison =$2500 retainer. Apparently freedom costs more than a buck o' nine...
    I was told by my CCW instructor, If you wanted Kevin Jamison to represent you, you would need to have a 50 gallon drum of 100 dollar bills.....for starters.I guess he is good at what he does, and you pay for it!
    Psalm 144:1 Blessed be the LORD my strength, which teacheth my hands to war, and my fingers to fight:
    Psalm 144:2 My goodness, and my fortress; my high tower, and my deliverer; my shield, and he in whom I trust; who subdueth my people under me. Pro 14:15 The simple believeth every word: but the prudent man looketh well to his going.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend BCal View Post
    Kevin Jamison =$2500 retainer. Apparently freedom costs more than a buck o' nine...
    You stated you caught two charges, as indicated, the firm would be 1500 each aka 3,000 to start so his pricing does not seem too high really. If it heads for trial, that is when the big bucks start getting billed. Trial time can be 400 an hour which is real tough real fast.
    John C. Eastman Associate Dean of Chapman University’s School of Law "the Second Amendment, like its sister amendments, does not confer a right but rather recognizes a natural right inherent in our humanity."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Richieg150 View Post
    I was told by my CCW instructor, If you wanted Kevin Jamison to represent you, you would need to have a 50 gallon drum of 100 dollar bills.....for starters.I guess he is good at what he does, and you pay for it!
    IIRC, that's actually a quote from his book, where he explains what he wants if you want to be a "test case" in Missouri. But, he definitely charges for 2A work. I don't know if he's more reasonable with non-2A work. I would think go, given what he says about most of his clients. It doesn't seem like they'd be able to pony up those types of funds.

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