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Florida jurisdictions scrambling to comply! Can we do it here?

FMCDH

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Not with the current Governor and legislature.

We need to elect a governor who actually posses a clue before they can clue anyone else in to preemption. I doubt Gregoire even knows what State Preemption is.
 

Lovenox

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Not with the current Governor and legislature.

We need to elect a governor who actually posses a clue before they can clue anyone else in to preemption. I doubt Gregoire even knows what State Preemption is.

Well, Mckenna just might win. In that lies our hope.
 

deanf

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Violations of RCW Title 9.41 are already a misdemeanor. That includes preemption. Theoretically stricter than Florida, which seems to only level civil penalties. The problem in Washington is one of enforcement.
 
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amlevin

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It will work like in Florida if we do like Florida did

Put a nice big fine in place for failure to comply with the law, payable by those responsible (their pocket, not the taxpayers). As it stands in Washington there is no penalty for not following the preemption law. Nothing to stop passage of these laws and subsequent arrests. Charges may well be dropped but what of the cost to the detainee?

If idiots like former Mayor Nickels and current buffoon Mike McGinn were faced with fines (again paid from their pocket) for passing laws in conflict with "preemption" they wouldn't even be thinking of them. The current attitude in many jurisdictions appears to be "Ok, it's against the State Law. So what, what are you going to do about it"?
 

amlevin

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But that's not really true. RCW 9.41.810 makes violations of RCW 9.41 a misdemeanor. Title 9.41 includes preemption, courthouse storage, etc. The problem is one of enforcement.

Misdemeanors in WA are punishable by up to 90 days in Jail and/or a $1,000 fine. I'm sure the intent of the Legislature was to make you and I subject to enforcement, not public officials passing these laws.

Yes, you're right there is no enforcement. Not much of a penalty either IMHO.

Make it a Gross Misdemeanor (1 year and $5,000) with prosecution MANDATORY. After all, these people do have a "public trust" don't they?
 
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deanf

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I think making it criminal raises it a whole level of seriousness. Mandatory prosecution? Is there any other crime that we have mandatory prosecution for? I don't think so.
 

amlevin

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I think making it criminal raises it a whole level of seriousness. Mandatory prosecution? Is there any other crime that we have mandatory prosecution for? I don't think so.

I don't disagree that raising the level of the offense makes it more serious. Consider that the "offenders" are among those that have been elected to manage our affairs in government and that should be sufficient to treat it with more seriousness. As it stands most "officials" consider themselves to be somewhat above the law in everyday affairs. Only time it seems that any public officials are prosecuted is when they blatantly steal from the taxpayers and even then way too many get a pass.
 

Lovenox

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Put a nice big fine in place for failure to comply with the law, payable by those responsible (their pocket, not the taxpayers). As it stands in Washington there is no penalty for not following the preemption law. Nothing to stop passage of these laws and subsequent arrests. Charges may well be dropped but what of the cost to the detainee?

If idiots like former Mayor Nickels and current buffoon Mike McGinn were faced with fines (again paid from their pocket) for passing laws in conflict with "preemption" they wouldn't even be thinking of them. The current attitude in many jurisdictions appears to be "Ok, it's against the State Law. So what, what are you going to do about it"?


The fact that they made it a personal fine just ups the ante for me. Its not until you hit their personal pocketbooks that they tend to notice and shape up rather quickly....
 

sudden valley gunner

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I think making it criminal raises it a whole level of seriousness. Mandatory prosecution? Is there any other crime that we have mandatory prosecution for? I don't think so.

Like you said it is a problem with enforcement.

Maybe a citizens lawyer on retainer willing to privately prosecute and the government reimburses the lawyer if he wins.
 

amlevin

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Like you said it is a problem with enforcement.

Maybe a citizens lawyer on retainer willing to privately prosecute and the government reimburses the lawyer if he wins.

When was the last successful "Private Prosecution" in the State of Washington?

Even the Williams Family was unsuccessful convincing Judges to convene a Grand Jury in the killing of John T. Williams.

While Private Prosecution might still be technically allowed it is under attack for the simple reason it opens up all kinds of avenues for appeal.

Here's a portion of a paper submitted in 1968 that covers a small portion of the problem;

http://heinonline.org/HOL/LandingPa...s&handle=hein.journals/wflr4&div=20&id=&page=

Yes, there was a successful Private Prosecution in WA, DC but in Federal Court. State Courts, specifically Washington State? Where's the "Case Law"?
 

sudden valley gunner

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You are absolutely right, but that shouldn't stop us from trying. And we have a SCOTUS decision that decided it is still our right.

Thank you for the link, this fits in very nicely what I have been preaching for years. It also supports my premise on why we and how we are supposed to have way less law enforcement.
 

Phssthpok

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What about submitting a bill applying the Florida style enforcement provisions to ALL state laws (not just 9.41.XXX)? Find some egregious examples of state officials violation OTHER (non-firearms related) laws and go on a PR field day to drum up public/popular support for an 'accountability law' the requires prosecution of public officials for violating state laws.

Once a law is passed that applies in general, then 9.41 would be included under the umbrella, and we could start to take back our freedom from the 'only one' JABBUTs.
 

Lovenox

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What about submitting a bill applying the Florida style enforcement provisions to ALL state laws (not just 9.41.XXX)? Find some egregious examples of state officials violation OTHER (non-firearms related) laws and go on a PR field day to drum up public/popular support for an 'accountability law' the requires prosecution of public officials for violating state laws.

Once a law is passed that applies in general, then 9.41 would be included under the umbrella, and we could start to take back our freedom from the 'only one' JABBUTs.


Thats a great idea.
 

amlevin

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What about submitting a bill applying the Florida style enforcement provisions to ALL state laws (not just 9.41.XXX)? Find some egregious examples of state officials violation OTHER (non-firearms related) laws and go on a PR field day to drum up public/popular support for an 'accountability law' the requires prosecution of public officials for violating state laws.

Once a law is passed that applies in general, then 9.41 would be included under the umbrella, and we could start to take back our freedom from the 'only one' JABBUTs.

Are you sure "adding another law" is the solution?

Another solution would be some recall elections charging some prosecutors with misfeasance for their failure/refusal to bring charges against those in Government who violate these laws (specifically RCW9.41.290;RCW9.41.300).

Somehow I feel that adding another law would just add to the number of those that are currently ignored and will also be ignored.
 
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