Lord Sega
Regular Member
Ok, finally had time to go down for more info...
Cost of a full blown FOIA request (911 tapes, recordings/video of officer encounter, reports, etc) would have been too costly, but I did pay for the officer's incident report.
Instead of scanning it, I'm just typing it verbatim (my notes & comments in blue):
**********
Incident Report: A20112292
Summary
I seized a firearm from Russell Jackson at the Astoria Regatta Parade.
Mentioned
Jackson, Russell (personal info / address I'm redacting)
Astoria PD officer (I'm redacting name)
Action Taken
On 08/13/2011 at about 12:48 hrs. I was at the intersection of 16th and Duane. I looked across the street towards the Heritage Museum and saw a male subject, later identified as Russell Jackson wearing a holstered firearm. The firearm was easily seen and no effort to conceal it had been made. I contacted Russell and asked if he had a concealed weapons permit. Ok, so far so good. Astoria does have a unloaded OC ordinance (see below), so the officer has RAS for the stop.
Russell told me he didn't. Russell told me it was "open carry", and that Oregon, with the exception of a few cities was an open carry state. Russell is correct, unfortunately Astoria is one of those cities... oops. I asked Russell if the weapon was loaded. He told me the magazine was loaded, but there was no round chambered. Personally, that's a mistake not to have one in the chamber IMO. I asked Russell to remove the weapon from the holster and hand it to me. He did so. Whoa, personally I would allow the officer to remove the weapon, but I would not touch it myself at this point, no matter how friendly the encounter is going. I ejected the magazine and could see that it was loaded with .45 rounds. I pulled the slide back and found no rounds inside the weapon.
I explained to Russell that the City of Astoria he could not possess a firearm that was either loaded or with a loaded magazine. Yes and no, ORS 166.173 allows cities to have unloaded firearm ordinances, but ORS 166.170 preemption does not allow the Astoria "unloaded magazine" ordinance part. Russell pulled up a web site on his phone and started telling me which cities were not open carry. Mistake IMO. A website, no matter how good, can be wrong or out of date. You would have to go to the official city website (and then Russell would have seen he was in the wrong). I explained again to him that regardless of the website he was looking at, Astoria City Ordinance did not allow him to carry a firearm in the condition he was presently carrying it in. He said he wasn't going to argue the point with me. Good choice at this point. I told him I would be taking the firearm for safekeeping and he could pick it up at APD later in the day. Ok, here is where I have a question. If not arrested or cited, can Russell's handgun be legally seized?
Upon arriving to APD a couple of hours later, I removed the bullets from the magazine and placed the firearm into an evidence locker, that I thought was for temporary storage, however I found out it was not a temporary locker after I closed the door. Oops.
Russell arrived at APD to get his gun. I told him I had mistakenly put it into a permanent locker that I could not access. I provided him contact information for the evidence custodian and directed him to call on Monday to make an appointment. I will assume this was a honest mistake, but now instead of retrieving his handgun at the end of the parade/day and returning home to Hoquiam, WA, Russell will have to make a separate trip back to Astoria during the week (and missing work?) to get his property back.
Statements
See action taken
Evidence/Property
See property report attached
It was a Springfield .45
Action Recommended
Case exceptionally cleared APD clerk I got this from said there was no documentation of this going to the DA's office.
Not sure if the seizure is/was totally legal, but I guess the officer imposed penalty is better than Class C Misdemeanor punishable by up to thirty (30) days confinement and/or a fine in an amount not to exceed five hundred dollars ($500.00), especially when Russell was in the wrong.
But I would think if the officer was not going to arrest or cite Russell, why would he not just return the handgun after clearing it and informing Russell of the city ordinance and instructing him not to load until outside of the Astoria city limits?
**********
ASTORIA
5.010 Carrying Loaded Firearm Unlawful.
(A) No person shall knowingly carry a firearm, loaded or unloaded, in a park, school ground or public building.
(B) No person on a public street or in a public place shall knowingly carry a firearm upon the person, or in a vehicle under the person's control or in which the person is an occupant, unless all ammunition or missile has been removed from the chamber and from the cylinder, clip or magazine.
(C) Subsections (A) and (B) of this section shall not apply to:
...
(3) Any person having a valid permit issued to the person by lawful authority to carry or use concealed firearms;
Cost of a full blown FOIA request (911 tapes, recordings/video of officer encounter, reports, etc) would have been too costly, but I did pay for the officer's incident report.
Instead of scanning it, I'm just typing it verbatim (my notes & comments in blue):
**********
Incident Report: A20112292
Summary
I seized a firearm from Russell Jackson at the Astoria Regatta Parade.
Mentioned
Jackson, Russell (personal info / address I'm redacting)
Astoria PD officer (I'm redacting name)
Action Taken
On 08/13/2011 at about 12:48 hrs. I was at the intersection of 16th and Duane. I looked across the street towards the Heritage Museum and saw a male subject, later identified as Russell Jackson wearing a holstered firearm. The firearm was easily seen and no effort to conceal it had been made. I contacted Russell and asked if he had a concealed weapons permit. Ok, so far so good. Astoria does have a unloaded OC ordinance (see below), so the officer has RAS for the stop.
Russell told me he didn't. Russell told me it was "open carry", and that Oregon, with the exception of a few cities was an open carry state. Russell is correct, unfortunately Astoria is one of those cities... oops. I asked Russell if the weapon was loaded. He told me the magazine was loaded, but there was no round chambered. Personally, that's a mistake not to have one in the chamber IMO. I asked Russell to remove the weapon from the holster and hand it to me. He did so. Whoa, personally I would allow the officer to remove the weapon, but I would not touch it myself at this point, no matter how friendly the encounter is going. I ejected the magazine and could see that it was loaded with .45 rounds. I pulled the slide back and found no rounds inside the weapon.
I explained to Russell that the City of Astoria he could not possess a firearm that was either loaded or with a loaded magazine. Yes and no, ORS 166.173 allows cities to have unloaded firearm ordinances, but ORS 166.170 preemption does not allow the Astoria "unloaded magazine" ordinance part. Russell pulled up a web site on his phone and started telling me which cities were not open carry. Mistake IMO. A website, no matter how good, can be wrong or out of date. You would have to go to the official city website (and then Russell would have seen he was in the wrong). I explained again to him that regardless of the website he was looking at, Astoria City Ordinance did not allow him to carry a firearm in the condition he was presently carrying it in. He said he wasn't going to argue the point with me. Good choice at this point. I told him I would be taking the firearm for safekeeping and he could pick it up at APD later in the day. Ok, here is where I have a question. If not arrested or cited, can Russell's handgun be legally seized?
Upon arriving to APD a couple of hours later, I removed the bullets from the magazine and placed the firearm into an evidence locker, that I thought was for temporary storage, however I found out it was not a temporary locker after I closed the door. Oops.
Russell arrived at APD to get his gun. I told him I had mistakenly put it into a permanent locker that I could not access. I provided him contact information for the evidence custodian and directed him to call on Monday to make an appointment. I will assume this was a honest mistake, but now instead of retrieving his handgun at the end of the parade/day and returning home to Hoquiam, WA, Russell will have to make a separate trip back to Astoria during the week (and missing work?) to get his property back.
Statements
See action taken
Evidence/Property
See property report attached
It was a Springfield .45
Action Recommended
Case exceptionally cleared APD clerk I got this from said there was no documentation of this going to the DA's office.
Not sure if the seizure is/was totally legal, but I guess the officer imposed penalty is better than Class C Misdemeanor punishable by up to thirty (30) days confinement and/or a fine in an amount not to exceed five hundred dollars ($500.00), especially when Russell was in the wrong.
But I would think if the officer was not going to arrest or cite Russell, why would he not just return the handgun after clearing it and informing Russell of the city ordinance and instructing him not to load until outside of the Astoria city limits?
**********
ASTORIA
5.010 Carrying Loaded Firearm Unlawful.
(A) No person shall knowingly carry a firearm, loaded or unloaded, in a park, school ground or public building.
(B) No person on a public street or in a public place shall knowingly carry a firearm upon the person, or in a vehicle under the person's control or in which the person is an occupant, unless all ammunition or missile has been removed from the chamber and from the cylinder, clip or magazine.
(C) Subsections (A) and (B) of this section shall not apply to:
...
(3) Any person having a valid permit issued to the person by lawful authority to carry or use concealed firearms;
