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Cop makes $1 million bail....

sudden valley gunner

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Dec 13, 2008
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Whatcom County
He is just as guilty, even if we take the "serve and protect" out of the picture since they have no obligation to serve and protect. He willingly stood by and and showed his support for others who murdered and broke several other laws. Ah but they were his brothers in law enforcement, so I guess it was ok. :rolleyes:.
 

skidmark

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Valhalla
And everybody is missing the point about bail - it is used to ensure the charged person's appearance in court. It should never be used as a means of punishment. Quite frankly, based on the very little I know about the charged persons I do not see any real indicators of flight risk or liklihood that they would refuse tro appear when the court asks them to. As such, $1Million seems excessive bail.

Nothing above should be construed as a statement of any sort regarding how I view the probable guilt or innocence of the charged individual.

stay safe.
 

Badger Johnson

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And everybody is missing the point about bail - it is used to ensure the charged person's appearance in court. It should never be used as a means of punishment. Quite frankly, based on the very little I know about the charged persons I do not see any real indicators of flight risk or liklihood that they would refuse tro appear when the court asks them to. As such, $1Million seems excessive bail.

Nothing above should be construed as a statement of any sort regarding how I view the probable guilt or innocence of the charged individual.

stay safe.

Sometimes I think Skidmark is one of the few level-headed, informed persons here. Not only does he have a good acquaintance with the law, he is also FAIR-MINDED and is guided by the principles. It would behoove us to follow his example, and eschew the blood-lust talk (that, while understandable, not helpful to anyone). It's hard not to run and light the pitch-forks and wield the torches, but in doing so we become part of the 'mob' justice we are trying to denounce.

It is those who are -accused- of the most heinous crimes that must have the most equal protection (lest we make a mistake among other things). I think even Judges miss his point above (or do so in catering to over-zealous prosecutors).

$.02
 
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Jack House

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I80, USA
Sometimes I think Skidmark is one of the few level-headed, informed persons here. Not only does he have a good acquaintance with the law, he is also FAIR-MINDED and is guided by the principles. It would behoove us to follow his example, and eschew the blood-lust talk (that, while understandable, not helpful to anyone). It's hard not to run and light the pitch-forks and wield the torches, but in doing so we become part of the 'mob' justice we are trying to denounce.

It is those who are -accused- of the most heinous crimes that must have the most equal protection (lest we make a mistake among other things). I think even Judges miss his point above (or do so in catering to over-zealous prosecutors).

$.02
Light the pitchforks, huh? ;)
 

skidmark

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Light the pitchforks, huh? ;)

Yup! Then we sharpen the torches and kick the tires.:lol:

Seriously, we need to follow proper procedure or all we'll have in anarchy and chaos. What? They're both here already? OK, nevermind.

stay safe.
 

Badger Johnson

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I quite agree with your kind remarks about skidmark.

A person with the qualities you enumerated is an asset to this forum, and to his community.

We do need posters like him to keep us grounded in reality.

NOW, who wants to go kill something(*)? Woo-hoo. :dude:


(*) how about a rare hamburge, lol.
 

sudden valley gunner

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2008
Messages
16,674
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Whatcom County
And everybody is missing the point about bail - it is used to ensure the charged person's appearance in court. It should never be used as a means of punishment. Quite frankly, based on the very little I know about the charged persons I do not see any real indicators of flight risk or liklihood that they would refuse tro appear when the court asks them to. As such, $1Million seems excessive bail.

Nothing above should be construed as a statement of any sort regarding how I view the probable guilt or innocence of the charged individual.

stay safe.


Excellent point Skidmark. Not only in the case of this officer but in all cases. Many people spend time in jail or are penalized for a crime before "due process" can take place.
 

HandyHamlet

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Nov 17, 2010
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Terra, Sol
And everybody is missing the point...


No. We are not.

He is a cop who *allegedly* beat an innocent and very helpless man to death without hesitation in front of the entire world.

$100,000 and he is out of jail to walk the streets. To feel the sun on his face. To get paid to not work. He had absolutely no problem coming up with the cash to get out...



So how exactly is the bail excessive or a punishment again?
 
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tcmech

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No. We are not.

He is a cop who beat an innocent and very helpless man to death without hesitation in front of the entire world.

$100,000 and he is out of jail to walk the streets. To feel the sun on his face. To get paid to not work. He had absolutely no problem coming up with the cash to get out...



So how exactly is the bail excessive or a punishment again?

Allegedly beat an innocent and very helpless man to death is the proper statement.

I will not go into the disgust I feel with the events that happened here or the fact that the accused is walking the streets freely, but with that being said under our justice system we are all innocent till proven guilty in a court of law. I know that may not always seem the case, especially to those who are wrongly accused.
 

HandyHamlet

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Corrected.


[video=youtube;kYJi3lgXLBU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kYJi3lgXLBU&feature=related[/video]
 
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skidmark

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I was pretty sure that I made a statement that my comment above about bail was NOT to be considered related to whether the cop was guilty or innocent, but I went back to make sure. Yep, there it was:
Nothing above should be construed as a statement of any sort regarding how I view the probable guilt or innocence of the charged individual.

And sure as the sun rises most days, folks come around sharing their determination that the cop is in fact guilty as sin of one of the most evil, sinful acts he ever committed and thus his walking around in the sunlight while the guy they are sure he caused to be dead never gets to walk around even in the rain is an even bigger sin than what the cop committed. And a sub-group is all butt-hurt that the cop apparently was able to raise the funds necessary to get a bond so he could get out of jail while he waits for his trial.

For those that already got the point, this is the time to go get a snack or finish mowing the lawn or whatever you want to do instead of sloggng through me repeating my rant. For the rest of you, please pay attention because repeating myself is repetitious.

Folks need to be held in jail if there is reason to believe they a) are more likely than not to not bother showing up when their scheduled trial starts, or b) that they are more likely than not to continue committing the crime they are charged with, or in the case of something like killing people that they will more likely than not go and kill other people while we are all waiting for the first day of their trial.

There is nothing that allows folks to be held pre-trial as a form of punishment. The 8th Amendment settled that a few hundred years ago. For those that really do not inderstand the concept, that is why all the time spent in pre-trial confinement counts towards fulfilling any sentence of confinement handed down at sentencing, and why some criminals are let go right after their sentencing - they were held long enough pre-trial to have actually satisfied whatever sentence was handed down.

I'm not absolutely certain that some amongst you would not lynch this cop if given the smallest opportunity. I am fairly convinced that a few among you would lynch him even if it meant risking some physical harm to you.

And that scares me.

stay safe.
 

HandyHamlet

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Butt hurt?

You made a statement. Your opinion. I don't agree. My opinion.

If bail was so excessive how could he be walking around? Just making a point. Isn't bail set by a judge based on each individual circumstance? In this case circumstances backed up by multiple videos?
 

skidmark

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Valhalla
Butt hurt?

You made a statement. Your opinion. I don't agree. My opinion.

If bail was so excessive how could he be walking around? Just making a point. Isn't bail set by a judge based on each individual circumstance? In this case circumstances backed up by multiple videos?

1) If the phrase "butt-hurt" bothers you, think about why. I'll do the same and consider if it might have been inappropriate.

2) Do you still not understand the purpose of bail? Show me how much of a flight risk this guy is. Or why there is good reason to believe he will not otherwise show up for trial. Or explain how you believe he will commit other similar crimes as the one he is charged with.

Yes, bail is set based on each individual's circumstances. Circumstances related to whether or not they will show up for trial or continue their criminal action. There is a history of not allowing bail for first degree murder, based on the thought that if you have intentionally murdered once you might intentionally murder again. But this guy is not charged with first degree murder.
A Fullerton, California, police officer charged with second-degree murder

http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/cgi-bin/displaycode?section=pen&group=00001-01000&file=187-199

189. All murder which is perpetrated by means of a destructive
device or explosive, a weapon of mass destruction, knowing use of
ammunition designed primarily to penetrate metal or armor, poison,
lying in wait, torture, or by any other kind of willful, deliberate,
and premeditated killing, or which is committed in the perpetration
of, or attempt to perpetrate, arson, rape, carjacking, robbery,
burglary, mayhem, kidnapping, train wrecking, or any act punishable
under Section 206, 286, 288, 288a, or 289, or any murder which is
perpetrated by means of discharging a firearm from a motor vehicle,
intentionally at another person outside of the vehicle with the
intent to inflict death, is murder of the first degree. All other
kinds of murders are of the second degree.

If he's not likely to be a no-show, or to continue to commit the crime (not possible since he's charged with killing somebody) or commit another similar crime (not likely as he's been stripped of his LEO status so won't be beating someone for resisting arrest) then the imposition of $1 Million bail seems to be political posturing and theater. You explain to me why it is not.

stay safe.
 

sudden valley gunner

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2008
Messages
16,674
Location
Whatcom County
I personally agree with what you are saying Skidmark. I think what bothers many is that if they as private individuals were arrested and held on a million dollar bail they know they would unfairly languish in jail were some how this individual as a cop was able to come up with the cash.

I think it is wrong to hold people before a trial, also very wrong to freeze assets, before a trial too. This often denies people the ability to provide for a stronger defense.

The video is pretty damning evidence though I also wonder how they are going to choose an impartial jury.

On a side note though, rights belong to the people not to government and their minions and people who choose to work for the government should be held to a higher standard.
 
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