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Thread: A little help :-)

  1. #1
    Regular Member Tucker6900's Avatar
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    A little help :-)

    Hey all,
    I am looking for some insight.

    There is a building in town that is owned 100% by the city. There is an organization that is leasing the building from the city. Now, with that in mind.


    Can the organization that is leasing the building make rules that overrule state law?

    Since the building is owned by the city, do the laws and ordinances of the city and state apply?

    Any and all forms of case law, legal codes welcome.

    Thanks ahead of time for the information.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker6900 View Post
    Hey all,
    I am looking for some insight.
    There is a building in town that is owned 100% by the city. There is an organization that is leasing the building from the city. Now, with that in mind.
    Can the organization that is leasing the building make rules that overrule state law?
    Since the building is owned by the city, do the laws and ordinances of the city and state apply?
    Any and all forms of case law, legal codes welcome.
    Thanks ahead of time for the information.
    Sounds like a question for a lawyer with landlord/tenant law experience to answer. There isn't anything in IC724 about that, only about preemption of local laws, so it wouldn't actually be an issue of gun rights but of rental property rights. My non-lawyer guess is that the renter could prohibit whatever they want, the same as at any other business. Any penalty for violation would be no different from anywhere else.

    Note that if the renter is the feds, or a school, you are SOL.
    Last edited by amaixner; 10-10-2011 at 01:35 PM.

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    Regular Member Tucker6900's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by amaixner View Post
    Sounds like a question for a lawyer with landlord/tenant law experience to answer. There isn't anything in IC724 about that, only about preemption of local laws, so it wouldn't actually be an issue of gun rights but of rental property rights. My non-lawyer guess is that the renter could prohibit whatever they want, the same as at any other business. Any penalty for violation would be no different from anywhere else.

    Note that if the renter is the feds, or a school, you are SOL.
    Renter is a non profit organization.

    I have scoured the tentant/landlord laws of Iowa, and it generally covers private property issues only. The building in question is 100% city owned. And the organization involved is open to the general public.

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    If the lease is to a private non-profit organization and not a political subdivision, they don't have the authority to make rules/laws. As with any private property, which is what the property would fall under if it's being leased, they can ask you to leave and have you charged with trespassing if you refuse. They couldn't make something a misdemeanor, felony or civil infraction even if they had the authority to make such rules/laws because of 724.28(Preemption). Can we get some more details about what the building is, where it is and what it is being used for?

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    Regular Member Tucker6900's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkshadow62988 View Post
    If the lease is to a private non-profit organization and not a political subdivision, they don't have the authority to make rules/laws. As with any private property, which is what the property would fall under if it's being leased, they can ask you to leave and have you charged with trespassing if you refuse. They couldn't make something a misdemeanor, felony or civil infraction even if they had the authority to make such rules/laws because of 724.28(Preemption). Can we get some more details about what the building is, where it is and what it is being used for?
    The building is the Parkside Rec. Center in Wellman. The lessee is YMCA. The building is city owned, and the Y is open to the general public.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker6900 View Post
    The building is the Parkside Rec. Center in Wellman. The lessee is YMCA. The building is city owned, and the Y is open to the general public.
    The only law that matters would be standard trespass law. Note that the trespass law does have a provision regarding public property and people who have a reason to be there (aren't just loitering). You will have to talk to a lawyer for case history on that, and to see if the fact that the publicly owned property is being leased to a private organization affects that provision. Or just conceal and it won't matter.

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    Regular Member Tucker6900's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by amaixner View Post
    The only law that matters would be standard trespass law. Note that the trespass law does have a provision regarding public property and people who have a reason to be there (aren't just loitering). You will have to talk to a lawyer for case history on that, and to see if the fact that the publicly owned property is being leased to a private organization affects that provision. Or just conceal and it won't matter.
    I dont carry there normally. This weekend was the PorkFest and I was told that firearms were not allowed in the building per YMCA policy. Im just curious if the Y's no firearm policy is enforceable.

    I have the lease. Looks like the standard lease for the most part.

    Here is the trespass law that would apply:

    716.7 TRESPASS DEFINED.
    b. Entering or remaining upon or in property without
    justification after being notified or requested to abstain from
    entering or to remove or vacate therefrom by the owner, lessee, or
    person in lawful possession, or the agent or employee of the owner,
    lessee, or person in lawful possession, or by any peace officer,
    magistrate, or public employee whose duty it is to supervise the use
    or maintenance of the property.
    So, technically, as a member, would I, if so inclined, be legally able to carry my firearm in the building for the duration of a workout?

    I know it sounds silly, its more of a what if question than when.
    Last edited by Tucker6900; 10-11-2011 at 12:50 PM.

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