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Thread: Electric Weapon Letter for Online Retailers

  1. #1
    Regular Member Resdon111's Avatar
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    Electric Weapon Letter for Online Retailers

    I figured that given the upcoming change to the electric weapon law and my own desire to purchase a stun gun, it might be a good idea to write up a generic letter for online retailers notifying them of the change. Anyone who's ever went to purchase a taser/stun gun online has seen the banned states list. Given that they likely don't keep up on all the news from every state in the union I drafted a letter for their reference.

    Let me know what you guys think of it. If you like it go ahead and use it - I left it generic so all you have to do is add your name and send it off.

    To whom it may concern,

    On July 8th, 2011, Wisconsin governor Scott Walker signed into law 2011 Wisconsin Act 35. This act is commonly known as the act making concealed carry legal with a permit in the state of Wisconsin. A part of the new law pertains to possession of electric weapons (tasers, stun guns, etc). Previously it was illegal for any person other than law enforcement, corrections officers, and military personnel acting in the line of duty to possess an electric weapon. I am writing to inform you that this law has been changed.

    Effective November 1, 2011, civilian personnel will now be able to possess electric weapons provided that the individual is either a concealed carry licensee, an out-of-state licensee, or that the individual who goes armed with an electric weapon is in his or her own dwelling or place of business or on land that he or she owns, leases, or legally occupies (Wis. Stat. § 941.295).

    Please view the following documents from the state of Wisconsin concerning this topic.

    WI Act 35
    https://docs.legis.wisconsin.gov/201...ed/acts/35.pdf

    WISCONSIN’S NEW CARRYING CONCEALED WEAPON LAW, Q&A
    Released by the Wisconsin Department of Justice
    (Pages 30 and 31)
    http://www.doj.state.wi.us/dles/cib/..._questions.pdf

    Given this change I am requesting that on or near November 1, 2011 your website begin allowing the sale of electric weapons to customers in the state of Wisconsin. Thank you for your time and I look forward to your prompt reply on this matter.

    Respectfully,

    e_weapons.doc
    If an American is to amount to anything he must rely upon himself, and not upon the State - Theodore Roosevelt

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    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    I'm sure many retailers are watching Wisconsin, but I think this is a good letter to have just in case they say no and you have the proof to show otherwise.
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

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    Campaign Veteran rcawdor57's Avatar
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    Lightbulb Looks Like We Have To Write Most Of The Online Retailers...

    I just checked Sportsmans Guide and they still do not sell electric weapons to Wisconsin residents. Neither do all the retailers I checked on Amazon. I started sending emails today to online retailers asking them to remove the restriction for Wisconsin residents.

    Time to get busy again....
    Last edited by rcawdor57; 11-08-2011 at 05:27 PM. Reason: Grammar
    “The Constitution shall never be construed... to prevent the People of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms.” -- Samuel Adams

    “Today, we need a nation of Minutemen. Citizens who are not only prepared to take arms, but citizens who regard the preservation of freedom as the basic purpose of their daily life and who are willing to consciously work and sacrifice for that freedom.”

    —John F. Kennedy

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    I updated my supplier on the new laws back in October, and I am expecting my first shipment of stun guns tomorrow.

  5. #5
    Campaign Veteran rcawdor57's Avatar
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    Exclamation Get This: We Can POSSESS Them But We Cannot BUY Them W/O A CCW License!?!

    OK...I've received a reply already and the guy who wrote me is correct in stating he cannot legally sell an electric weapon to a resident of Wisconsin who does not have a valid Wisconsin concealed carry license. How did we miss this???

    From CCW FAQ Page 30: http://www.doj.state.wi.us/dles/cib/...q-20111020.pdf


    Can I purchase an electric weapon if I do not have a CCW license or am not otherwise a person permitted to carry an electric weapon?

    The law allows a person who does not have a CCW license to possess an electric weapon in their own dwelling or place of business or on land that they own, lease, or legally occupy (Wis. Stat. § 941.295(2g)), and to transport within a carrying case (Wis. Stat. § 941.295(2r)). However, as noted below, it is unlawful for anyone to sell an electric weapon to someone who does not have a CCW license.


    Is it unlawful to sell or manufacture electric weapons in Wisconsin?

    A person may manufacture and sell electric weapons to authorized persons which includes a peace officer, armed forces or national guard personnel while on official duty or a person with a Wisconsin CCW license or out-of-state CCW licensee. In other words, electric weapons cannot be sold to persons in Wisconsin who are not law enforcement, armed forces on official duty or persons without a recognized out-of-state CCW license or a Wisconsin CCW license. Wis. Stat. § 941.295(2)(d). A violation of this statute is a felony. Wis. Stat. § 941.295(1m).

    So we cannot buy one online unless we prove we have a valid license for Wisconsin nor can we buy one from any retail outlet without a license in the state of Wisconsin.

    I guess I'll drive across the border and pick one up and then legally transport it back to Wisconsin. This is absurd!
    “The Constitution shall never be construed... to prevent the People of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms.” -- Samuel Adams

    “Today, we need a nation of Minutemen. Citizens who are not only prepared to take arms, but citizens who regard the preservation of freedom as the basic purpose of their daily life and who are willing to consciously work and sacrifice for that freedom.”

    —John F. Kennedy

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    Regular Member Motofixxer's Avatar
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    Or buy one from a "friend" that can buy them
    Click Here for New to WI Open Carry Legal References and Informational Videos--- FAQ's http://Tinyurl.com/OpenCarry-WI

    The Armed Badger A WI site dedicated to Concealed Carry in WI

    "To disarm the people... was the best and most effectual way to enslave them." -- George Mason, Speech of June 14, 1788

    http://Tinyurl.com/New-To-Guns to DL useful Info

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    The FAQ is Wrong

    The FAQ States:

    Is it unlawful to sell or manufacture electric weapons in Wisconsin?
    A person may manufacture and sell electric weapons to authorized persons which includes a peace officer, armed forces or national guard personnel while on official duty or a person with a Wisconsin CCW license or out-of-state CCW licensee. In other words, electric weapons cannot be sold to persons in Wisconsin who are not law enforcement, armed forces on official duty or persons without a recognized out-of-state CCW license or a Wisconsin CCW license. Wis. Stat. § 941.295(2)(d). A violation of this statute is a felony. Wis. Stat. § 941.295(1m).

    However the law as amended by Act 35 states:

    941.295 (2) (d) (intro.) Any manufacturer or seller
    whose of electric weapons are used in this state solely by
    persons, unless the manufacturer or seller engages in the
    conduct described in sub. (1m) with the intent to provide
    an electric weapon to someone other than one of the following:
    1. A person specified in pars. (a) to (c), a licensee, or
    an out−of−state licensee.
    SECTION 69. 941.295 (2) (d) 2. of the statutes is
    created to read:
    941.295 (2) (d) 2. A person for use in his or her dwelling
    or place of business or on land that he or she owns,
    leases, or legally occupies.

  8. #8
    Campaign Veteran rcawdor57's Avatar
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    Exclamation Yes, It Is Wrong! Government....Geez.

    Quote Originally Posted by apjonas View Post
    The FAQ States:

    Is it unlawful to sell or manufacture electric weapons in Wisconsin?
    A person may manufacture and sell electric weapons to authorized persons which includes a peace officer, armed forces or national guard personnel while on official duty or a person with a Wisconsin CCW license or out-of-state CCW licensee. In other words, electric weapons cannot be sold to persons in Wisconsin who are not law enforcement, armed forces on official duty or persons without a recognized out-of-state CCW license or a Wisconsin CCW license. Wis. Stat. § 941.295(2)(d). A violation of this statute is a felony. Wis. Stat. § 941.295(1m).

    However the law as amended by Act 35 states:

    941.295 (2) (d) (intro.) Any manufacturer or seller
    whose of electric weapons are used in this state solely by
    persons, unless the manufacturer or seller engages in the
    conduct described in sub. (1m) with the intent to provide
    an electric weapon to someone other than one of the following:
    1. A person specified in pars. (a) to (c), a licensee, or
    an out−of−state licensee.
    SECTION 69. 941.295 (2) (d) 2. of the statutes is
    created to read:
    941.295 (2) (d) 2. A person for use in his or her dwelling
    or place of business or on land that he or she owns,
    leases, or legally occupies.
    OK. Now I am sending more emails to those that already wrote me back stating they could NOT sell to Wisconsin residents without a concealed carry license. Let's hope they are better than I am for perusing the new laws on the books and start selling to Wisconsin residents.
    “The Constitution shall never be construed... to prevent the People of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms.” -- Samuel Adams

    “Today, we need a nation of Minutemen. Citizens who are not only prepared to take arms, but citizens who regard the preservation of freedom as the basic purpose of their daily life and who are willing to consciously work and sacrifice for that freedom.”

    —John F. Kennedy

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    There are a few mistakes, omissions in the Oct. 20, 2011 DOJ Concealed Weapons Laws FAQ. In particular it tries to cover laws regarding CCW licenses, and does not make much effort to cover other areas, such as Open Carrying, and activity that does not involve CCW licenses.

    Do not treat this FAQ as law, it most certainly is NOT.

    The DOJ disclaimer on page - vii - makes that clear:

    DISCLAIMER: This document broadly discusses—in question-and-answer format—the laws and procedures governing licenses to carry concealed weapons in Wisconsin. Every effort has been made to be as accurate as possible. However, this document does not constitute either an informal or formal opinion of the Wisconsin Attorney General, does not constitute legal advice or guidance and does not create an attorney-client relationship. And it creates no rights beyond those established under the constitutions, statutes, regulations and administrative rules of the United States and the State of Wisconsin. Nor does it attempt to provide answers to every question that may arise regarding carrying concealed weapons. Many factors may affect your decision whether to apply for a license to carry concealed weapons in Wisconsin. You should review the statutes governing CCW and consult a private attorney for specific information and advice. This document also only reflects the law as of the date of its publication and may be superseded or affected by other versions or changes in the law.
    Wis. CCL #5x Springfield XDM 3.8 Compact .40 S&W, Utah CFP

  10. #10
    Regular Member Resdon111's Avatar
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    I've fired off the letter to a few different retailers. The only one I heard back from was an eBay dealer who agreed to ship to WI. I went ahead and purchased one of his 6.8Mil volt guns, $9.95 w/free shipping!
    If an American is to amount to anything he must rely upon himself, and not upon the State - Theodore Roosevelt

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    Wisconsin Carry Member

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    Campaign Veteran rcawdor57's Avatar
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    Exclamation Both Online Retailers I Contacted Will NOT Sell To Wisconsin Residents...

    Why? Because of the D.O.J. F.A.Q. website. Sportsmansguide wrote me twice and their final email is they will not sell because they do not have the ability to check every purchaser in Wisconsin to be sure they have a Wisconsin concealed carry license. Another online retailer on Amazon said he will not sell to Wisconsin because of the "Catch 22" ...I.E. you can possess one but you can't buy one without a license....He too quoted the D.O.J. F.A.Q. page.

    I wrote to both retailers with a link to the actual law and the 941.295 portion quoted showing that a Wisconsin resident can buy without a license but no go. They won't budge as long as the D.O.J. F.A.Q. page states what it does about electric weapons.

    I'm going to have my son buy one for me and mail it to me. Simple as that.
    “The Constitution shall never be construed... to prevent the People of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms.” -- Samuel Adams

    “Today, we need a nation of Minutemen. Citizens who are not only prepared to take arms, but citizens who regard the preservation of freedom as the basic purpose of their daily life and who are willing to consciously work and sacrifice for that freedom.”

    —John F. Kennedy

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    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rcawdor57 View Post
    Why? Because of the D.O.J. F.A.Q. website. Sportsmansguide wrote me twice and their final email is they will not sell because they do not have the ability to check every purchaser in Wisconsin to be sure they have a Wisconsin concealed carry license. Another online retailer on Amazon said he will not sell to Wisconsin because of the "Catch 22" ...I.E. you can possess one but you can't buy one without a license....He too quoted the D.O.J. F.A.Q. page.

    I wrote to both retailers with a link to the actual law and the 941.295 portion quoted showing that a Wisconsin resident can buy without a license but no go. They won't budge as long as the D.O.J. F.A.Q. page states what it does about electric weapons.

    I'm going to have my son buy one for me and mail it to me. Simple as that.
    Looks like the retailer who sells first is going to be making the most money in this instance. I know there will be a lot of people who choose less than lethal force over lethal force.
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

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    I have an email off to the my Consumer Sales Manager at Taser. They too state on their dealers page that we can not sell to someone in WI without a license and the responsibility is on us to make sure they do as it could be a felony. They cite the DOJ FAQ as the source.

    I will post any response I get for you.

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    My supplier doesn't have any problem sending them to me. I just got my first shipment today. I didn't get a lot,
    or any of the really pricey ones, but the order went through just fine. I'm expecting another small shipment tomorrow.
    I do need a volunteer to test them out, my wife and kids said no!

    ETA: I can get Taser brand...
    Last edited by Serpent; 11-10-2011 at 10:29 PM.

  15. #15
    Regular Member davegran's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Resdon111 View Post
    I've fired off the letter to a few different retailers. The only one I heard back from was an eBay dealer who agreed to ship to WI. I went ahead and purchased one of his 6.8Mil volt guns, $9.95 w/free shipping!
    Name the dealer for the rest of us, please.
    Dave
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    Fight for "Stand Your Ground " legislation!

    WI DA Gerald R. Fox:
    "These so-called 'public safety' laws only put decent law-abiding citizens at a dangerous disadvantage when it comes to their personal safety, and I for one am glad that this decades-long era of defective thinking on gun issues is over..."

    Remember: Don't make old People mad. We don't like being old in the first place, so it doesn't take much to piss us off.

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    All They Need

    to do is include an affirmation statement for non-licensees.:

    I do solemnly swear or affirm that I am purchasing (insert name of item) for use in my dwelling or place of business or on land that I own, lease, or legally occupy.

    A seller could be in trouble if a non-licensee was buying for car carry or otherwise. It is just simpler to limit sales to licensees since the documentation is easy to do. I understand their point of view.

    Has somebody contacted DoJ to point out the mistake?
    Last edited by apjonas; 11-10-2011 at 11:12 PM. Reason: add

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    Quote Originally Posted by davegran View Post
    Name the dealer for the rest of us, please.
    I will be in Cassville for a class Dec. 11th if you want something TASER I can get something and bring it to you if you wish.

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    Regular Member Resdon111's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davegran View Post
    Name the dealer for the rest of us, please.
    The one that I bought
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/PHX-800-6-8-...item4842c58f3a

    He has higher voltage ones on his seller page
    http://stores.ebay.com/vipdeals

    Incidentally it just came in the mail today. I haven't had the nerve to test it out on myself yet, but it seems to be a well built device. Positive controls, quality switches, seems solid.
    Last edited by Resdon111; 11-10-2011 at 11:22 PM.
    If an American is to amount to anything he must rely upon himself, and not upon the State - Theodore Roosevelt

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    Quote Originally Posted by Resdon111 View Post
    The one that I bought
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/PHX-800-6-8-...item4842c58f3a

    He has higher voltage ones on his seller page
    http://stores.ebay.com/vipdeals

    Incidentally it just came in the mail today. I haven't had the nerve to test it out on myself yet, but it seems to be a well built device. Positive controls, quality switches, seems solid.
    if you get the nerve, you better film it for us.

  20. #20
    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Resdon111 View Post
    The one that I bought
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/PHX-800-6-8-...item4842c58f3a

    He has higher voltage ones on his seller page
    http://stores.ebay.com/vipdeals

    Incidentally it just came in the mail today. I haven't had the nerve to test it out on myself yet, but it seems to be a well built device. Positive controls, quality switches, seems solid.
    I'll help! No, not on me. You said you wanted to test on yourself.
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

  21. #21
    Campaign Veteran rcawdor57's Avatar
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    Lightbulb Ebay Online Retailer Needs To Update Their Information....

    Quote Originally Posted by Resdon111 View Post
    The one that I bought
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/PHX-800-6-8-...item4842c58f3a

    He has higher voltage ones on his seller page
    http://stores.ebay.com/vipdeals

    Incidentally it just came in the mail today. I haven't had the nerve to test it out on myself yet, but it seems to be a well built device. Positive controls, quality switches, seems solid.
    This retailer you bought from still has this on their page:

    "*IMPORTANT* PLEASE READ:

    Stun Guns are legal in most U.S. states for individuals of legal age (18 and up) with the following known restrictions. We do not ship stun guns to the following areas:

    The following states consider stun guns illegal: Hawaii, Illinois, Massachusetts, Michigan, New Jersey, New York, Rhode Island, Wisconsin

    The following cities/counties consider stun guns illegal: Annapolis, MD; Baltimore, MD; Crawford County, IA; District Of Columbia; Philadelphia, PA

    No Sales Or Shipments Outside the United States."
    “The Constitution shall never be construed... to prevent the People of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms.” -- Samuel Adams

    “Today, we need a nation of Minutemen. Citizens who are not only prepared to take arms, but citizens who regard the preservation of freedom as the basic purpose of their daily life and who are willing to consciously work and sacrifice for that freedom.”

    —John F. Kennedy

  22. #22
    Regular Member davegran's Avatar
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    Cool Are you grounded?

    Quote Originally Posted by rcawdor57 View Post
    This retailer you bought from still has this on their page:

    "*IMPORTANT* PLEASE READ:

    Stun Guns are legal in most U.S. states for individuals of legal age (18 and up) with the following known restrictions. We do not ship stun guns to the following areas:

    The following states consider stun guns illegal: Hawaii, Illinois, Massachusetts, Michigan, New Jersey, New York, Rhode Island, Wisconsin

    The following cities/counties consider stun guns illegal: Annapolis, MD; Baltimore, MD; Crawford County, IA; District Of Columbia; Philadelphia, PA

    No Sales Or Shipments Outside the United States."
    After reading Resdon111's posts, I sent this question to several eBay retailers of stun guns:
    As of Nov 1, Act 35 went into effect in Wisconsin, legalizing stun guns in the home for anybody or out in public for concealed carry permit holders which I am. See Act 35 at http://legis.wisconsin.gov/2011/data/acts/11Act35.pdf The section covering stun guns(called "electric weapons") reads,

    "941.295 (2g) The prohibition in sub. (1m) on pos-
    sessing or going armed with an electric weapon does not
    apply to any of the following:
    (a) A licensee or an out−of−state licensee.
    (b) An individual who goes armed with an electric
    weapon in his or her own dwelling or place of business
    or on land that he or she owns, leases, or legally occupies."

    Will you ship to me in Wisconsin now?
    And they all answered that they would ship to Wisconsin now. I ordered mine last night but I sure as HELL am not going to try it on myself!
    Dave
    45ACP-For when you care enough to send the very best-
    Fight for "Stand Your Ground " legislation!

    WI DA Gerald R. Fox:
    "These so-called 'public safety' laws only put decent law-abiding citizens at a dangerous disadvantage when it comes to their personal safety, and I for one am glad that this decades-long era of defective thinking on gun issues is over..."

    Remember: Don't make old People mad. We don't like being old in the first place, so it doesn't take much to piss us off.

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    Quote Originally Posted by davegran View Post
    I ordered mine last night but I sure as HELL am not going to try it on myself!
    What did you order?
    You can speak softy and carry a big stick, but I'll stick to my guns.

    Member - Wisconsin Carry, Inc. http://ww.wisconsincarry.org
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  24. #24
    Regular Member davegran's Avatar
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    "Fall down and lose control of your bowels"

    Quote Originally Posted by TaurusToter View Post
    What did you order?
    I got this little guy. 6.8 MILLION volts of "Leave me alone or fall down and lose control of your bowels".... Deactivated if someone grabs it away.
    Dave
    45ACP-For when you care enough to send the very best-
    Fight for "Stand Your Ground " legislation!

    WI DA Gerald R. Fox:
    "These so-called 'public safety' laws only put decent law-abiding citizens at a dangerous disadvantage when it comes to their personal safety, and I for one am glad that this decades-long era of defective thinking on gun issues is over..."

    Remember: Don't make old People mad. We don't like being old in the first place, so it doesn't take much to piss us off.

  25. #25
    Regular Member Resdon111's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rcawdor57 View Post
    This retailer you bought from still has this on their page:

    "*IMPORTANT* PLEASE READ:

    Stun Guns are legal in most U.S. states for individuals of legal age (18 and up) with the following known restrictions. We do not ship stun guns to the following areas:

    The following states consider stun guns illegal: Hawaii, Illinois, Massachusetts, Michigan, New Jersey, New York, Rhode Island, Wisconsin

    The following cities/counties consider stun guns illegal: Annapolis, MD; Baltimore, MD; Crawford County, IA; District Of Columbia; Philadelphia, PA

    No Sales Or Shipments Outside the United States."
    The responded to me via PM that they would ship here, and they now have.
    If an American is to amount to anything he must rely upon himself, and not upon the State - Theodore Roosevelt

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