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Thread: OC at a protest?

  1. #1
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    OC at a protest?

    i was thinking about going downtown tomorrow to see and maybe join the Occupy Wall Street flint protest would i have any legality problems OCing (other that U of M flint campus is right next to where the protest is taking place)? also where would i be able to find what property Uof M flint owns as to avoid jamming myself up?

  2. #2
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    I dont know where you would get that info, but otherwise, if you're on city property then there isnt anything they can do to you.

    Do you have a recorder? Just a tip, if you keep it in a cell phone case or something similar, put it in upside down, it helps keep the wind off the mic. I just thought as I was typing, that if you put it inside of a baby sock, it would likely dampen the wind noise as well.

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    Regular Member dougwg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RenkaiWulf View Post
    i was thinking about going downtown tomorrow to see and maybe join the Occupy Wall Street flint protest would i have any legality problems OCing (other that U of M flint campus is right next to where the protest is taking place)? also where would i be able to find what property Uof M flint owns as to avoid jamming myself up?
    Are you going in opposition to the morons of the Occupy Wall Street flint protest?

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    I think it would be more fun, and much safer to blend in rather than openly carrying while surrounded by a mob of anti's. However, i do respect your right to carry as you see fit.

    i do not want to OC at an OWS protest, but i have been thinking it would be fun to throw in an element of satire and make a sign that is pro-capitalism, but clever enough that most of the protesters don't get it.

    or maybe i could make one about people making under $40/yr paying their fair share! Since on average, people who make under $40K get more money back in credits than they pay in federal payroll tax.

    Maybe this sign....

    Last edited by lapeer20m; 10-16-2011 at 04:04 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by dougwg View Post
    Are you going in opposition to the morons of the Occupy Wall Street flint protest?
    LOL Nice
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    Regular Member NHCGRPR45's Avatar
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    Isn't there one of these in detroit also? ?Circus park or sum such? OC might not be a bad idea there! But if anyone does go bring a friend with a camera and have him/her follow behind you about 10 15 steps behind. The expressions should be worth the time.
    But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security. Declaration of Independence July 4, 1776

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    Regular Member MilProGuy's Avatar
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    I didn't participate in the hippies' protests, draft card burnings, etc.,...(edited by author)

    But...if I had, I would not have openly carry a handgun at the protest site, even if were legal to do so.

    Hey, but that's just me.
    Last edited by MilProGuy; 10-17-2011 at 10:24 PM.
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    Campaign Veteran Glock9mmOldStyle's Avatar
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    We should be very careful about criticizing others....

    We (OCers) do not like being called names such as zealots, nutts, gun whacko's etc... yet some of us are willing to poke fun at these folks? Now they may not make a lot of sense to some of us but, remember we don't make a lot of sense to most Americans yet. My understanding of this group is they take issue (however disorganized) with the 1% of US corporations and Uber wealthy that get special breaks, benefits etc... I don't have a dog in this fight. The way I see it is we should make it very clear that we support all constitutional rights, especially those such as the 1A, that benefit directly from the 2A and vice versa. Whether we agree with them or not, we should avoid publicly demeaning them. If we take the high road and state we support their right to peacefully assemble and air their grievances, they may see us as the good guys/gals we are, and not the gun nuts they thought we were.

    As with many things in life you will find that, often there are more things to bind us together than to divide us. Just saying sugar & spice works far better than urine & vinegar in most cases.
    “A government that does not trust it’s law-abiding citizens to keep and bear arms is itself unworthy of trust.” James Madison.

    “Firearms are second only to the Constitution in importance; they are the peoples' liberty's teeth.” “The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that's good.” George Washington

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    Regular Member MilProGuy's Avatar
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    Thanks, I needed that!

    Quote Originally Posted by Glock9mmOldStyle View Post
    We should be very careful about criticizing others....

    We (OCers) do not like being called names such as zealots, nutts, gun whacko's etc... yet some of us are willing to poke fun at these folks? Now they may not make a lot of sense to some of us but, remember we don't make a lot of sense to most Americans yet. My understanding of this group is they take issue (however disorganized) with the 1% of US corporations and Uber wealthy that get special breaks, benefits etc... I don't have a dog in this fight. The way I see it is we should make it very clear that we support all constitutional rights, especially those such as the 1A, that benefit directly from the 2A and vice versa. Whether we agree with them or not, we should avoid publicly demeaning them. If we take the high road and state we support their right to peacefully assemble and air their grievances, they may see us as the good guys/gals we are, and not the gun nuts they thought we were.

    As with many things in life you will find that, often there are more things to bind us together than to divide us. Just saying sugar & spice works far better than urine & vinegar in most cases.
    Thanks...I needed that.

    You are exactly right, and I am ashamed enough of a portion of the first part of my post that I'm going back and delete the inflammatory portion.

    I need good people like you to keep me on the "straight and narrow"!
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  10. #10
    Campaign Veteran Glock9mmOldStyle's Avatar
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    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by MilProGuy View Post
    Thanks...I needed that.

    You are exactly right, and I am ashamed enough of a portion of the first part of my post that I'm going back and delete the inflammatory portion.

    I need good people like you to keep me on the "straight and narrow"!
    you are a very wise person.
    “A government that does not trust it’s law-abiding citizens to keep and bear arms is itself unworthy of trust.” James Madison.

    “Firearms are second only to the Constitution in importance; they are the peoples' liberty's teeth.” “The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that's good.” George Washington

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    Michigan Moderator DrTodd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glock9mmOldStyle View Post
    We should be very careful about criticizing others....

    We (OCers) do not like being called names such as zealots, nutts, gun whacko's etc... yet some of us are willing to poke fun at these folks? Now they may not make a lot of sense to some of us but, remember we don't make a lot of sense to most Americans yet. My understanding of this group is they take issue (however disorganized) with the 1% of US corporations and Uber wealthy that get special breaks, benefits etc... I don't have a dog in this fight. The way I see it is we should make it very clear that we support all constitutional rights, especially those such as the 1A, that benefit directly from the 2A and vice versa. Whether we agree with them or not, we should avoid publicly demeaning them. If we take the high road and state we support their right to peacefully assemble and air their grievances, they may see us as the good guys/gals we are, and not the gun nuts they thought we were.

    As with many things in life you will find that, often there are more things to bind us together than to divide us. Just saying sugar & spice works far better than urine & vinegar in most cases.
    Thanks G9mmOS for saying what I too felt needed to be said.
    Giving up our liberties for safety is the one sure way to let the violent among us win.

    "Though defensive violence will always be a 'sad necessity' in the eyes of men of principle, it would be still more unfortunate if wrongdoers should dominate just men." -Saint Augustine

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  12. #12
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    Well,,,,

    Quote Originally Posted by lapeer20m View Post
    I think it would be more fun, and much safer to blend in rather than openly carrying while surrounded by a mob of anti's. However, i do respect your right to carry as you see fit.

    i do not want to OC at an OWS protest, but i have been thinking it would be fun to throw in an element of satire and make a sign that is pro-capitalism, but clever enough that most of the protesters don't get it.

    or maybe i could make one about people making under $40/yr paying their fair share! Since on average, people who make under $40K get more money back in credits than they pay in federal payroll tax.

    Maybe this sign....

    Very good point!!!!

    I saw a bit of obamas Q+A thingy on TV recently,
    I Kept thinking, I wish he would call on me for a question.
    I would have asked "Who is John Galt?"

    I bet he would not know!

    I also wished he would ask me "how could the government improve the economy of the united states?"
    I would have stood at attention,and proclaimed... "Get Out Of My Way!"
    EMNofSeattle wrote: Your idea of freedom terrifies me. So you are actually right. I am perfectly happy with what you call tyranny.....

    “If ever a time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in Government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin.”

    Stand up for your Rights,, They have no authority on their own...

    All power is inherent in the people,
    it is their right and duty to be at all times ARMED!

  13. #13
    Regular Member PDinDetroit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glock9mmOldStyle View Post
    We should be very careful about criticizing others....

    We (OCers) do not like being called names such as zealots, nutts, gun whacko's etc... yet some of us are willing to poke fun at these folks? Now they may not make a lot of sense to some of us but, remember we don't make a lot of sense to most Americans yet. My understanding of this group is they take issue (however disorganized) with the 1% of US corporations and Uber wealthy that get special breaks, benefits etc... I don't have a dog in this fight. The way I see it is we should make it very clear that we support all constitutional rights, especially those such as the 1A, that benefit directly from the 2A and vice versa. Whether we agree with them or not, we should avoid publicly demeaning them. If we take the high road and state we support their right to peacefully assemble and air their grievances, they may see us as the good guys/gals we are, and not the gun nuts they thought we were.

    As with many things in life you will find that, often there are more things to bind us together than to divide us. Just saying sugar & spice works far better than urine & vinegar in most cases.
    You are absolutely right, we should be careful with RIGHTS.

    The Protesters for OWS have RIGHTS - Peacefully Assemble and Freedom of Expression. On this point we agree - we should support those RIGHTS.

    The Posters on OCDO have RIGHTS - Freedom of Association and Freedom of Expression (as allowed by Forum Rules). On this point we disagree - I support the RIGHTS of OCDO Members to EXPRESS THEMSELVES FREELY, whereas you do not. One CAN Support the Rights of OWS Protesters WHILE Freely Expressing Themselves, whether they AGREE with the Message or Not.

    Personally, I would rather others see us for what we are - Supportive Of Rights.

  14. #14
    Campaign Veteran Glock9mmOldStyle's Avatar
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    Thumbs down

    Quote Originally Posted by PDinDetroit View Post
    You are absolutely right, we should be careful with RIGHTS.

    The Protesters for OWS have RIGHTS - Peacefully Assemble and Freedom of Expression. On this point we agree - we should support those RIGHTS.

    The Posters on OCDO have RIGHTS - Freedom of Association and Freedom of Expression (as allowed by Forum Rules). On this point we disagree - I support the RIGHTS of OCDO Members to EXPRESS THEMSELVES FREELY, whereas you do not. One CAN Support the Rights of OWS Protesters WHILE Freely Expressing Themselves, whether they AGREE with the Message or Not.

    Personally, I would rather others see us for what we are - Supportive Of Rights.
    Really, you think that? I support ALL OF "OUR" rights. The problem is your "OUR" is the OC community or anyone else you agree with. My "OUR" is all US citizens, regardless if I agree with them or not. I was simply pointing out that "we" get upset when others rip on us for our legal activities, so to do this to others who are exercising their rights lawfully is hypocritical at best. WORDSMITH AWAY PD....
    “A government that does not trust it’s law-abiding citizens to keep and bear arms is itself unworthy of trust.” James Madison.

    “Firearms are second only to the Constitution in importance; they are the peoples' liberty's teeth.” “The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that's good.” George Washington

  15. #15
    Regular Member PDinDetroit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glock9mmOldStyle View Post
    Really, you think that? I support ALL OF "OUR" rights. The problem is your "OUR" is the OC community or anyone else you agree with. My "OUR" is all US citizens, regardless if I agree with them or not. I was simply pointing out that "we" get upset when others rip on us for our legal activities, so to do this to others who are exercising their rights lawfully is hypocritical at best. WORDSMITH AWAY PD....
    Will do!

    Quote Originally Posted by Glock9mmOldStyle, Post #8
    We (OCers) do not like being called names such as zealots, nutts, gun whacko's etc... yet some of us are willing to poke fun at these folks? Now they may not make a lot of sense to some of us but, remember we don't make a lot of sense to most Americans yet. My understanding of this group is they take issue (however disorganized) with the 1% of US corporations and Uber wealthy that get special breaks, benefits etc... I don't have a dog in this fight. The way I see it is we should make it very clear that we support all constitutional rights, especially those such as the 1A, that benefit directly from the 2A and vice versa. Whether we agree with them or not, we should avoid publicly demeaning them. If we take the high road and state we support their right to peacefully assemble and air their grievances, they may see us as the good guys/gals we are, and not the gun nuts they thought we were.
    Important part bolded above for emphasis. Telling others to "avoid" certain postings is against Freedom of Expression.
    Last edited by PDinDetroit; 10-18-2011 at 03:32 PM.

  16. #16
    Regular Member MilProGuy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PDinDetroit View Post

    Telling others to "avoid" certain postings is against Freedom of Expression.
    It is where I come from too.

    Note to moderator: I deleted the above post because I had double-posted, unintentionally.
    Last edited by MilProGuy; 10-19-2011 at 04:45 PM.
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  17. #17
    Campaign Veteran Glock9mmOldStyle's Avatar
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    PD

    So saying we should avoid demeaning a group of people (regardless if we like them or not) is not stripping anyone of their freedom of expression - PLEASE - that's the best argument you have PD? You would cowardly suggest I shrug off my right to voice my concern with how negative the thread was becoming? Isn't that the very thing you are accusing me of? It's my opinion, that is all. Hey flame away at any large group or individuals you want, that is your right. Now is that helping how we are perceived by the general public who may read this forum? Probably not.
    “A government that does not trust it’s law-abiding citizens to keep and bear arms is itself unworthy of trust.” James Madison.

    “Firearms are second only to the Constitution in importance; they are the peoples' liberty's teeth.” “The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that's good.” George Washington

  18. #18
    Campaign Veteran Glock9mmOldStyle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrTodd View Post
    Thanks G9mmOS for saying what I too felt needed to be said.
    Any time Sir

    Now, if I could just get some good people to understand that expressing opposing opinions doesn't make for enemies in a FREE SOCIETY, that would be the real feat!
    “A government that does not trust it’s law-abiding citizens to keep and bear arms is itself unworthy of trust.” James Madison.

    “Firearms are second only to the Constitution in importance; they are the peoples' liberty's teeth.” “The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that's good.” George Washington

  19. #19
    Regular Member PDinDetroit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glock9mmOldStyle View Post
    PD

    So saying we should avoid demeaning a group of people (regardless if we like them or not) is not stripping anyone of their freedom of expression - PLEASE - that's the best argument you have PD? You would cowardly suggest I shrug off my right to voice my concern with how negative the thread was becoming? Isn't that the very thing you are accusing me of? It's my opinion, that is all. Hey flame away at any large group or individuals you want, that is your right. Now is that helping how we are perceived by the general public who may read this forum? Probably not.
    You suggested that people here on OCDO should not express Negative Expressions towards these OWS People. To me, that is not supporting Freedom of Expression and I pointed that out which apparently you take issue with. Whether or not it "helps our cause", I did not address whatsoever.

    To date, I have not expressed ANY POSITION HERE ON OCDO TOWARDS OWS.

    I thought you were better that to attempt to engage in Personal Attacks, but these threads and others have shown you different that I believed you to be.

  20. #20
    Campaign Veteran Glock9mmOldStyle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PDinDetroit View Post
    You suggested that people here on OCDO should not express Negative Expressions towards these OWS People. To me, that is not supporting Freedom of Expression and I pointed that out which apparently you take issue with. Whether or not it "helps our cause", I did not address whatsoever.

    To date, I have not expressed ANY POSITION HERE ON OCDO TOWARDS OWS.

    I thought you were better that to attempt to engage in Personal Attacks, but these threads and others have shown you different that I believed you to be.
    As I said repeatedly, but you choose to ignore because the context does not fit your agenda here: "We OCers don't like when people rip on us for our legal activity of OCing" right? I was simply saying if we don't like it, then others most likely don't either; that being the case we should "avoid" demeaning them. Hell, if you want say whatever you want, to whoever you want, whenever you want. I'm sure you do this always correct? To do otherwise is to strip yourself of your freedom of expression. You walk into 7-11 often from your posts, and sometimes deal with a not so nice person running the register. Do you express your dissatisfaction? If not, why? Could it be because it is the best choice given the setting. You most likely would come off as a jerk even though you are correct. The same applies here with OWS crowd, even though many here may very well be right in their views, by labeling them wacko's, morons, crazies to name a few names used here, we look like the jerks instead of them in my honest opinion.
    “A government that does not trust it’s law-abiding citizens to keep and bear arms is itself unworthy of trust.” James Madison.

    “Firearms are second only to the Constitution in importance; they are the peoples' liberty's teeth.” “The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that's good.” George Washington

  21. #21
    Regular Member PDinDetroit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glock9mmOldStyle View Post
    As I said repeatedly, but you choose to ignore because the context does not fit your agenda here: "We OCers don't like when people rip on us for our legal activity of OCing" right? I was simply saying if we don't like it, then others most likely don't either; that being the case we should "avoid" demeaning them. Hell, if you want say whatever you want, to whoever you want, whenever you want. I'm sure you do this always correct? To do otherwise is to strip yourself of your freedom of expression. You walk into 7-11 often from your posts, and sometimes deal with a not so nice person running the register. Do you express your dissatisfaction? If not, why? Could it be because it is the best choice given the setting. You most likely would come off as a jerk even though you are correct. The same applies here with OWS crowd, even though many here may very well be right in their views, by labeling them wacko's, morons, crazies to name a few names used here, we look like the jerks instead of them in my honest opinion.
    Each person must decide for themselves how they will exercise their Freedom of Expression. When you stated that we as a group should refrain from Negative Expressions towards the OWS Protesters, I see that as you telling others how to exercise their Freedom of Expression. It's your opinion on how others should express themselves and you can certainly to ask others to "follow your lead", I simply disagree with asking others to limit their Freedom of Expression in this manner. If you have noticed, I have not made any Negative Expressions towards the OWS Protesters here on OCDO whether I agree with them or not.

    As to the one time I had an issue with the girl behind the register, I did discuss the issue with her the very next time I was at that 7-11. She readily apologized as she had a bad day and didn't mean to take it out on me. We have had good conversations ever since whenever I stop by that 7-11.

    As in the other thread, I agree to disagree with you and bid you good luck in all you do.
    Last edited by PDinDetroit; 10-20-2011 at 06:01 AM.

  22. #22
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    I absolutely agree in peoples rights to exercise their rights.

    I do however, disagree with the underlying message of the OWS protest: Socialism. Taking from the rich and giving to the poor.

    We all agree that corruption is bad, and that bailouts are bad, but i just do not agree with the concept of replacing capitalism with socialism.
    Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? (who will watch the watchmen?)

    I am not a lawyer. Nothing in any of posts should be construed as legal advice.

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    I went to the occupy flint protest just to spectate today. It is really fizzling out! The web site indicates that they will be protesting daily from noon to six pm. I spent a couple hours in downtown, the most protesters i saw in any one spot was four. Their headquarters had a total of seven tents set up. I did see two open carry guys who are apparently part of the protest. I was cc'ing. Here are some photos:

    open carry guy:



    gadsden flag flying over "headquarters" how bizarre? don't tread on me if i'm poor, but if you have more than me it is ok for me to take what belongs to you???:



    People wearing red UAW shirts dropped off food and supplies:



    Here are all seven of the occupiers tents:




    the occupiers protesting.....all four of them about 1:45pm on Sunday:



    photo taken of the same spot about an hour later, you can even see the same two vehicles parked. Apparently they got bored and wandered off.....

    Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? (who will watch the watchmen?)

    I am not a lawyer. Nothing in any of posts should be construed as legal advice.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by RenkaiWulf View Post
    i was thinking about going downtown tomorrow to see and maybe join the Occupy Wall Street flint protest would i have any legality problems OCing (other that U of M flint campus is right next to where the protest is taking place)? also where would i be able to find what property Uof M flint owns as to avoid jamming myself up?
    So what your really saying is that you are a hippie. What exactly is it that you are "protesting" free markets?, freedom in general? Do you really think that if you get your way, and we get a communist dictator you will still be allowed to carry at all, or even own a gun?

  25. #25
    Regular Member Evil Creamsicle's Avatar
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    The LA Times is reporting that Occupy Oakland Protester and veteran of the United States Marine Corps, Scott Olsen will need brain surgery to alleviate the swelling caused by the police crackdown last night in the bay city. Olsen cannot speak at this point but has shown the ability to write a little.
    At least nothing like this happened...

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