Rifle Open Carry question

Born2Lose · Oct 21, 2011

I will be attending the San Diego ULGOC event this Saturday.
I am going to open carrying my pistol as usual but sling an unloaded SKS on my back to limit media "evil black rifle" drama.

If someone were to carry an AR and have an empty mag in the well but a full mag coupled to it would it still be legal..i thought the answer was yes until i reread the Open Carry.org "Yes it's legal" pamphlet.
It has a paragraph at the end that makes me second guess.
I know that case law says to be considered loaded the ammunition must be in position to be fired but look at this paragraph in the pamphlet.

Note: For PC12031(e) to be a valid statute, open carry of unloaded firearms must be a legal action. If a full magazine of ammunition is openly carried in a holder on the belt, but not attached to the firearm in any way, the firearm is by definition unloaded as the ammunition is in no way attached to the firearm.

Iopencarry · Oct 21, 2011

do not carry the loaded mag attached to the gun.
use a mag pouch

Born2Lose · Oct 21, 2011

Iopencarry said:
do not carry the loaded mag attached to the gun.
use a mag pouch

Then what about shotgunners? Even though case law says it's legal should they not carry in a sidesaddle attached to the rifle or a sling with ammo attached?

oc4ever · Oct 21, 2011

Sks?

Don't SKS have to have non-detachable magazines to be legal?

The idea of a taped up back to back magazine one empty inserted in the gun the other full* should *be legal....however I would never do it that way. Too easily for a LEO to show up in court saying he saw it the other way around......and kiss goodby to your freedom and your gun rights. If it is speed of loading you are worrying about, dropping a empty one from the gun and loading it from a detached magazine holder of some type away from the gun should be just about as fast with practice. Being the "trial ballon" case can be financially devastating, even if you win.

bigtoe416 · Oct 21, 2011

Born2Lose said:
I know that case law says to be considered loaded the ammunition must be in position to be fired but look at this paragraph in the pamphlet.

"Must be in position to be fired." Can you manipulate the firearm so the magazine can be used to load a cartridge and fire the rifle? No. You should be okay. Read People v. Clark if you want to see the reasoning behind the decision.

Save Our State · Oct 21, 2011

bigtoe416 said:
"Must be in position to be fired." Can you manipulate the firearm so the magazine can be used to load a cartridge and fire the rifle? No. You should be okay. Read People v. Clark if you want to see the reasoning behind the decision.

Personally I see no advantage or reason to concentrate on having it attached to the gun. When I hiked, I had the rounds attached to my belt. They seemed easier to get to there than on a gun. Also, they were visible as hell. Not hiding a thing

Born2Lose · Oct 21, 2011

oc4ever said:
Don't SKS have to have non-detachable magazines to be legal?

The idea of a taped up back to back magazine one empty inserted in the gun the other full* should *be legal....however I would never do it that way. Too easily for a LEO to show up in court saying he saw it the other way around......and kiss goodby to your freedom and your gun rights. If it is speed of loading you are worrying about, dropping a empty one from the gun and loading it from a detached magazine holder of some type away from the gun should be just about as fast with practice. Being the "trial ballon" case can be financially devastating, even if you win.

Yes they do..that's why i said i'm carrying my SKS..if someone were to carry an AR could they do that.
I'm not even bring rounds for the SKS because i have no way of open carrying them.

@ Save our State- The advantage of having a coupled mag would be that i wouldn't need to wear a mag pouch. I could just have the rifle as a unit.
For instance if i want to dress nice (like i will be at this event) i won't need a rifle mag pouch. I have a monsterman AR with preban mags..the idea of having a mag pouch for hicaps doesn't entice me.

ConditionThree · Oct 21, 2011

Born2Lose said:
Yes they do..that's why i said i'm carrying my SKS..if someone were to carry an AR could they do that.
I'm not even bring rounds for the SKS because i have no way of open carrying them.

@ Save our State- The advantage of having a coupled mag would be that i wouldn't need to wear a mag pouch. I could just have the rifle as a unit.
For instance if i want to dress nice (like i will be at this event) i won't need a rifle mag pouch. I have a monsterman AR with preban mags..the idea of having a mag pouch for hicaps doesn't entice me.

Your SKS is fed by stripper clip. There is no reason why you couldnt have the ammunition in your pocket or in a pouch. There are also stock cuffs that rounds can be carried in.

Save Our State · Oct 21, 2011

Born2Lose said:
@ Save our State- The advantage of having a coupled mag would be that i wouldn't need to wear a mag pouch. I could just have the rifle as a unit.
For instance if i want to dress nice (like i will be at this event) i won't need a rifle mag pouch. I have a monsterman AR with preban mags..the idea of having a mag pouch for hicaps doesn't entice me.

C'mon now...
you are carrying a sizeable steel mechanical device on your person, but you think a mag pouch is intrusive?

Born2Lose · Oct 21, 2011

Save Our State said:
C'mon now...
you are carrying a sizeable steel mechanical device on your person, but you think a mag pouch is intrusive?

Precisely.

Born2Lose · Oct 21, 2011

ConditionThree said:
Your SKS is fed by stripper clip. There is no reason why you couldnt have the ammunition in your pocket or in a pouch. There are also stock cuffs that rounds can be carried in.

Good point Sir.

Born2Lose · Oct 21, 2011

Save Our State said:
C'mon now...
you are carrying a sizeable steel mechanical device on your person, but you think a mag pouch is intrusive?

This seems like a good solution for me. (if i were to carry my AR in the future)

ccrews · Oct 21, 2011

Saw some reasonably priced ($20) VOODO Tactical shotgun and "assault" style scabbards at Ammo Brothers last night. The scabbards has a strap that could be used to shoulder sling your weapon and pockets that might be serviceable for ammo storage.

Beretta9mm (army) · Oct 21, 2011

Born2Lose said:
This seems like a good solution for me. (if i were to carry my AR in the future)

That what 90% of us are doing in afganastand. One in the magwell, 2 in the mag pouch.

Firemark · Oct 21, 2011

Born2Lose said:
Then what about shotgunners? Even though case law says it's legal should they not carry in a sidesaddle attached to the rifle or a sling with ammo attached?

Refer to 22nd open carry thread, spoke with senior SDPD, side saddle shotgun shell carriers on stocks are ok, they are not from a position to be fired. They understand the ruling.

pullnshoot25 · Oct 22, 2011

Israeli-style carry is legal and something I actually would utilize.

Sent from my TracFone

KYGlockster · Oct 22, 2011

How about all you California gun owners just pack up and head to a state that holds your freedoms dear, and let your previous home slip off into the pacific. I find it absurd that questions like this even need to be asked, I find it utterly intrusive on your rights as free, peaceable Americans. Thank you folks, for standing up to the tyrannical government that has slowly eroded your rights, when will they learn that more guns means less crime??? It is a proven fact with a wide spectrum of proof. I sincerely hope you atleast gain some ground in your concealed permitting process, but until then keep up the work, maybe oneday someone will realize your arguments hold some merit....

ConditionThree · Oct 22, 2011

The answer to this;

KYGlockster said:
How about all you California gun owners just pack up and head to a state that holds your freedoms dear, and let your previous home slip off into the pacific.

Might be found somewhere in this...

KYGlockster said:
I sincerely hope you atleast gain some ground in your concealed permitting process, but until then keep up the work, maybe oneday someone will realize your arguments hold some merit....

Rifle Open Carry question

Born2Lose

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Iopencarry

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Born2Lose

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oc4ever

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bigtoe416

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Save Our State

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Born2Lose

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ConditionThree

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Save Our State

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Born2Lose

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Born2Lose

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Born2Lose

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ccrews

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Beretta9mm (army)

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Firemark

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pullnshoot25

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KYGlockster

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ConditionThree

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