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Thread: Open carry under 21?

  1. #1
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    Open carry under 21?

    Hello, I am under 21 but over 18 and live in NE Oregon and have questions regarding open carry. Since I cannot legally purchase a hangun is it legal for me to open carry one that has been registered in one of my parents name? If anyone can provide me with some answers or laws that I can read pertaining to this I would appreciate it. Another thing I was curious about is carrying in a vehicle, I have seen laws that say the hangun has to be in a locked container that is not readily accessible, so does this mean that while you are open carrying every time you get in your vehicle you have to place your hangun in a locked box? And when leaving the vehicle you can simply place it in your holster and carry on? This seems a bit fuzzy to me so if someone can teach me about this that would be great. I'm looking forward to your replies, I have read over a few threads on this forum and everyone seems very knowledgeable and helpful.

    Also, I realize the acronym for my user name is CC, perhaps addressing me as CFC would cause less confusion. Thanks.

    -Another thing I heard was that once you get your concealed, you lose the right to OC, is that true? Can someone elaborate on that?

    I appreciate anything anyone has to say, thanks everyone.
    Last edited by Centerfire Citizen; 10-24-2011 at 12:29 AM.

  2. #2
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    if you are not otherwise banned from owning a handgun, at 18 you may open carry in oregon unless you are in a banned city. since you cant get the chl until you are 21 you are not exempt from the ban.

    the chl doesnt restrict your oc rights, infact it broadens them.....
    *Disclaimer~ I am not an attorney, i do not give legal advice. Any opinion stated here is in no way meant to insinuate, imply, compel or encourage that you should do anything that is illegal either knowingly or otherwise. My answers however valid may not be complete or applicable to your individual situation. I strongly recommend that you do your own research, make your own decisions and hire an attorney for legal advice ~

  3. #3
    Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter bigtoe416's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Centerfire Citizen View Post
    -Another thing I heard was that once you get your concealed, you lose the right to OC, is that true? Can someone elaborate on that?
    Perhaps somebody was making the argument that by asking the government permission to exercise a right, that you are giving up your right? Just a guess. Teddy is right though, by getting your CHL you can do more in Oregon than you can without a CHL, so the "right" is broadened by getting permission from the government.

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    Thank you both for the information. I am still a bit unclear on carry while in a vehicle. As I take it, you can either choose to leave the hangun in plain view, or if trying to conceal it (without a CHL) it needs to be locked up. Im looking forward to trying my first OC but am not near confident enough in my knowledge of the laws to try it yet. I ordered the Understanding Oregon's Gun Laws book to have some legal text to refer to incase of confrontation but am open to what anyone refers to for their solid black and white laws. And possibly even things to carry with me to refer to if necessary.

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    Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter bigtoe416's Avatar
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    Check 166.250.

    Unlawful possession of firearms. (1) Except as otherwise provided in this section or ORS 166.260, 166.270, 166.274, 166.291, 166.292 or 166.410 to 166.470, a person commits the crime of unlawful possession of a firearm if the person knowingly:
    (a) Carries any firearm concealed upon the person;
    (b) Possesses a handgun that is concealed and readily accessible to the person within any vehicle; or
    <snip>
    (3) Firearms carried openly in belt holsters are not concealed within the meaning of this section.
    (4)(a) Except as provided in paragraph (b) of this subsection, a handgun is readily accessible within the meaning of this section if the handgun is within the passenger compartment of the vehicle.
    (b) If a vehicle has no storage location that is outside the passenger compartment of the vehicle, a handgun is not readily accessible within the meaning of this section if:
    (A) The handgun is stored in a closed and locked glove compartment, center console or other container; and
    (B) The key is not inserted into the lock, if the glove compartment, center console or other container unlocks with a key.

  6. #6
    Regular Member hermannr's Avatar
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    There is another mistake in your OP.

    You (as an 18-20 year old) MAY purchase and own a handgun when you are 18. There is no law that says you cannot purchase a handgun at 18.

    A Federally licensed firearms dealer (FFL) cannot sell you a handgun until you are 21. The prohibition is on the FFL, NOT YOU.

  7. #7
    Regular Member We-the-People's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hermannr View Post
    There is another mistake in your OP.

    You (as an 18-20 year old) MAY purchase and own a handgun when you are 18. There is no law that says you cannot purchase a handgun at 18.

    A Federally licensed firearms dealer (FFL) cannot sell you a handgun until you are 21. The prohibition is on the FFL, NOT YOU.
    What he is talking about in the quoted post above is that you MAY LAWFULLY purchase a handgun at 18 from a private seller.

    Also, it doesn't matter who the firearm is registered to. There is no registration (official) in Oregon, though there is undoubtedly a defacto registration when the background check is done for purchase from an FFL. Just be confident that any firearm you purchase from a private citizen isn't stolen or otherwise being looked for by police. i.e. know who you're buying from!!!

    Keep in mind that without the CHL you have more restrictions on you such as prohibition against carry in "public building" (defined in ORS 166.360), and you must be unloaded in "ban" cities, some of which also require magazines not in the weapon to be unloaded (beyond their authority but not yet challenged in court).
    "The Second Amendment speaks nothing to an unfettered Right". (Post # 100)
    "Restrictions are not infringements. Bans are infringements.--if it reaches beyond Reasonable bans". (Post # 103)
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    Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer, nothing in any of my posts should be considered legal advice. If you need legal advice, consult a reputable attorney, not an internet forum.

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    Sorry for the confusion about the wording of that, I meant through an FFL. I own 3 handguns so far so I am aware that it is legal for me to own them, just can't go through an FFL without someone of age. Thanks for posting in here We The People, I'm looking forward to learning anything I can and I defenitley take the time to read and understand your posts. You seem very knowledgable and up on your research. I do have one question, where do you read up on the laws? I see you cited a law in your post and I am curious where you cited that from?

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    Regular Member We-the-People's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Centerfire Citizen View Post
    Sorry for the confusion about the wording of that, I meant through an FFL. I own 3 handguns so far so I am aware that it is legal for me to own them, just can't go through an FFL without someone of age. Thanks for posting in here We The People, I'm looking forward to learning anything I can and I defenitley take the time to read and understand your posts. You seem very knowledgable and up on your research. I do have one question, where do you read up on the laws? I see you cited a law in your post and I am curious where you cited that from?
    ORS = Oregon Revised Statutes. ORS 166.### is where you will find the majority of state statutes that pertain to firearms and open carry. There are a few others such as the statutes for recording audio, the ones that define trespassing, etc. The ORS can be found by doing a google search for "Oregon Revised Statutes" and selecting the result that takes you to the Oregon Legislatures site. From there, you can access all of the ORS's published.

    Most localities (cities and counties) also have web sites where you can access their municipal codes. This is helpful for determining if they have any restrictions on firearms including loaded carry as well as void (per state preemption) attempts to regulate firearms.

    There are also a ton of legal decisions (i.e. Terry v Ohio, Heller v DC, Oregon Firearms Federation v Oregon Board of Education, etc.) which are more diffcult to find but are out there.

    OCDO (this site) has a rule that if you state something is law, you must cite that law. Keeps us all informed, it's educational, and it helps reduce the amount of what people THINK the law is.
    "The Second Amendment speaks nothing to an unfettered Right". (Post # 100)
    "Restrictions are not infringements. Bans are infringements.--if it reaches beyond Reasonable bans". (Post # 103)
    Beretta92FSLady
    http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...ons-Bill/page5

    Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer, nothing in any of my posts should be considered legal advice. If you need legal advice, consult a reputable attorney, not an internet forum.

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    Thank you for pointing me toward that site, looks like I have a lot of reading to do.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Centerfire Citizen View Post
    Thank you for pointing me toward that site, looks like I have a lot of reading to do.
    I would suggest starting wtih ORS 166.170 and reading through to 166.390 (might be a bit beyond that). Pay attention to which itteration of a particular section is the CURRENT one as some that have been modified by legislative action will appear in multiple versions (there are notes at the bottom of the section that will explain which one is active when).

    Also, take the Oregon Open Carry pamphlet and look up any other ORS's that are listed...such as the audio recording regs.
    "The Second Amendment speaks nothing to an unfettered Right". (Post # 100)
    "Restrictions are not infringements. Bans are infringements.--if it reaches beyond Reasonable bans". (Post # 103)
    Beretta92FSLady
    http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...ons-Bill/page5

    Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer, nothing in any of my posts should be considered legal advice. If you need legal advice, consult a reputable attorney, not an internet forum.

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    The first part will take me a while, but is there an official Oregon State OC Pamphlet? I have searched for something like that but havent found an actual pamphlet, it just takes me to this forum and people just talking about one. Sorry for all the questions, I just want to prepare myself and be able to hold up my end of a conversation with a person saying im "breaking the law" or "not supposed to be carrying that thing" or a LEO that thinks he/she knows everything there is to know. And of course, I dont want to be breaking the law in any way.
    Last edited by Centerfire Citizen; 10-26-2011 at 01:18 AM.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Centerfire Citizen View Post
    The first part will take me a while, but is there an official Oregon State OC Pamphlet? I have searched for something like that but havent found an actual pamphlet, it just takes me to this forum and people just talking about one. Sorry for all the questions, I just want to prepare myself and be able to hold up my end of a conversation with a person saying im "breaking the law" or "not supposed to be carrying that thing" or a LEO that thinks he/she knows everything there is to know. And of course, I dont want to be breaking the law in any way.
    very first thread on the oregon page.... says STICKY next to it
    *Disclaimer~ I am not an attorney, i do not give legal advice. Any opinion stated here is in no way meant to insinuate, imply, compel or encourage that you should do anything that is illegal either knowingly or otherwise. My answers however valid may not be complete or applicable to your individual situation. I strongly recommend that you do your own research, make your own decisions and hire an attorney for legal advice ~

  14. #14
    Regular Member We-the-People's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Centerfire Citizen View Post
    The first part will take me a while, but is there an official Oregon State OC Pamphlet? I have searched for something like that but havent found an actual pamphlet, it just takes me to this forum and people just talking about one. Sorry for all the questions, I just want to prepare myself and be able to hold up my end of a conversation with a person saying im "breaking the law" or "not supposed to be carrying that thing" or a LEO that thinks he/she knows everything there is to know. And of course, I dont want to be breaking the law in any way.
    As TeddeBearFromHell said, first thread in the Oregon forum. Links to the PDF are found in message numbers 20 and 21 so you have to scroll down a bit.

    Also, be sure to carry an audio recording device (at minimum) and be very familiar with Oregon law on recording audio. You must inform all persons being recorded, but you do not need their permission. You can pick up an audio only recorder for less than $30 from WalMart, Fred Myers, Target, etc. Key features to look for are digital recording, a long record time, easy activation from standby to recording, and ease of downloading the file to your computer (some have built in USB plugs). Because of the necessity to inform that you are recording, the ease of activating the recording function is quite important as you may not always "see the need coming" yet unlike many states, you can't simply turn it on when you leave the house because you would have to inform every person within the devices mic pickup area that "I am recording audio"...just not convienient nor realistically doable.
    "The Second Amendment speaks nothing to an unfettered Right". (Post # 100)
    "Restrictions are not infringements. Bans are infringements.--if it reaches beyond Reasonable bans". (Post # 103)
    Beretta92FSLady
    http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...ons-Bill/page5

    Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer, nothing in any of my posts should be considered legal advice. If you need legal advice, consult a reputable attorney, not an internet forum.

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    That's very interesting that you have to make a point to tell people you are recording the conversation, that seems very inconvenient and kind of ridiculous. So do you guys record conversations with civilians or just LEO's?

  16. #16
    Regular Member We-the-People's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Centerfire Citizen View Post
    That's very interesting that you have to make a point to tell people you are recording the conversation, that seems very inconvenient and kind of ridiculous. So do you guys record conversations with civilians or just LEO's?
    I would record ANY convo with an LEO that involved me and my firearm. As for citizens (never forget LEO are civillians, they are CIVIL SERVANTS, only MILITARY should be considered "non civillian"...IMHO, YMMV, are not) only if it is a negative encounter of the type where the recording could be useful. i.e. someone saying "you shouldn't have that here" and that's the end of it, not worth it. On the other hand, if I were to be unlucky enough to come across one of the ranting brady bunch types that makes a huge disturbance and, though "scared" of my firearm has superhuman bravery that causes him/her to approach and antagonize anyway, is a "problem", I would definitely be turning it on and informing them of the fact. I'd also offer to call the police for them, might even do it anyway (to report the unstable individual who is disturbing the peace).

    p.s.
    IMHO = In My Humble Opinion (doesn't really fit for me as I'm not very humble but what the heck)
    YMMV - Your Mileage May Vary (i.e. you may have a different experience and/or opinion on the subject, this is mine)
    "The Second Amendment speaks nothing to an unfettered Right". (Post # 100)
    "Restrictions are not infringements. Bans are infringements.--if it reaches beyond Reasonable bans". (Post # 103)
    Beretta92FSLady
    http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...ons-Bill/page5

    Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer, nothing in any of my posts should be considered legal advice. If you need legal advice, consult a reputable attorney, not an internet forum.

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    sorry to just hop in but while reading this i am turning 18 here in June and i would like to start ocing because of my right to bear arms and because of the stuff that happens around here where I live.

    quick question though i can oc. IF

    There are no forbidding firearms signs in the building`s
    1000 feet from school area.

    On public places that dont have a ban. i am able to oc right?

    i am here to learn. and i stay out of the banned cities like beverton or Portland only reason i shall go there is for work.
    Last edited by chadman; 12-30-2011 at 03:01 AM.

  18. #18
    Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter bigtoe416's Avatar
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    You can check out the Oregon OC flyer and check out the restrictions for licensed and unlicensed individuals (they're at the end).

    You're correct that you can't carry in cities with a OC ban. You're sort of correct about the 1000' from school law, but that's a federal law that isn't really enforced unless you're dealing drugs near a school and happen to be armed as well. It's unlikely that you'd be stopped near a school purely because you are carrying. You can't carry on school or university grounds, or in any public buildings.

    As far as the signs on businesses go, it's my understanding that a sign has no legal basis in Oregon. But if you enter any business and you're asked to leave then you have to leave or risk being arrested for trespassing. Hopefully that helps.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigtoe416 View Post
    You can check out the Oregon OC flyer and check out the restrictions for licensed and unlicensed individuals (they're at the end).

    You're correct that you can't carry in cities with a OC ban. You're sort of correct about the 1000' from school law, but that's a federal law that isn't really enforced unless you're dealing drugs near a school and happen to be armed as well. It's unlikely that you'd be stopped near a school purely because you are carrying. You can't carry on school or university grounds, or in any public buildings.

    As far as the signs on businesses go, it's my understanding that a sign has no legal basis in Oregon. But if you enter any business and you're asked to leave then you have to leave or risk being arrested for trespassing. Hopefully that helps.
    so at the age of 18 i am able to open carry a pistol.
    Last edited by chadman; 12-31-2011 at 01:55 AM.

  20. #20
    Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter bigtoe416's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chadman View Post
    so at the age of 18 i am able to open carry a pistol.
    Yup.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigtoe416 View Post
    Yup.
    okay thanks for the confirm i will from now till june read up and become very friendly with the laws around my county and state.

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