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Thread: My friend got home invaded

  1. #1
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    My friend got home invaded

    He did not have a gun or any weapon.

    They ran up to him as he was putting his key in the door. Held him at gunpoint for almost an hour. While one left the room and the other was going through his stuff he made a break for it and got away.

    He is very beat up and cut up bad, said he was so rattled that he doubts that even if he had a gun he would not have had the ability to use it.

    He is very lucky he got escaped from these thugs.

  2. #2
    Regular Member Polynikes's Avatar
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    This is just another object lesson teaching that the best weapon in your arsenal is still your mind. You can carry a weapon all day long and still wind up losing because you lacked the situational awareness to see the threat coming.

    I'm glad your friend is OK, and I hope he learns to watch his surroundings in the future.
    "Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it; no constitution, no law, no court can even do much to help it." - Judge Learned Hand

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    Regular Member Badger Johnson's Avatar
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    Used to be that these things were not done - burglars seemed to avoid contact, operated on empty houses, at night. Now, with crack-heads, all bets are off. They'll go in anytime they think there's a nickel to be had.

    Having said that does your friend have any idea why he might have been targeted? Glad to hear he escaped mostly unharmed. Suppose you'll be helping him get a gun, huh?
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    Damn, glad it wasn't any worse. Hopefully now he can fully appreciate the importance of self defense and situational awareness so he never has to go through something like this again.

  5. #5
    Regular Member MilProGuy's Avatar
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    What a harrowing experience this must have been for the poor fellow.

    Hopefully, for his sake and the sake of his family, this horrific ordeal has been a "wake-up call" for him, and he will become an armed citizen and become aware of who and what is going on around him at all times when out in the public domain.
    Last edited by MilProGuy; 10-28-2011 at 02:17 PM. Reason: edited to conform to forum standards by author.
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  6. #6
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sky1 View Post
    He did not have a gun or any weapon.

    They ran up to him as he was putting his key in the door. Held him at gunpoint for almost an hour. While one left the room and the other was going through his stuff he made a break for it and got away.

    He is very beat up and cut up bad, said he was so rattled that he doubts that even if he had a gun he would not have had the ability to use it.

    He is very lucky he got escaped from these thugs.
    Even when I sometimes think I might get tired of saying it, situations like this come up to reinforce the need to say it again: The gun is not some magic talisman.

    You need training and practice so that when the time comes you have something to fall back on. Lots of wise folks say, in sometimes different ways, that when the brown stuff hits the rotating air distribution device you will not rise to the occassion but revert back to your training - and probably perform at only half of your best training day's performance.

    I'm very glad to hear that your friend survived the encounter. When he has begun to heal physically you might want to get him thiking about developing a plan of how to respond to that specific scenariom and how to train so that he can formulate plans for other possible scenarios. A gun may or may not fit into his plans, and that's a decision he needs to make once he learns how to plan.

    For all the rest of you out there - how's your plan for dealing with being bum-rushed by home invaders? You do have one, don't you? You have tried it out, haven't you?

    Remember, just because you are paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you.

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

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    yeah, they banged him up and cut him up pretty bad. I am pretty sure they cops will get them, just a matter of time.

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    without a gun or big dogs, he is exactly what the robbers were looking for. criminals look for the sure thing.

    i know it sounds terrible, but better my neighbors house than my house. every man is his own families steward. if you are not strong you better be smart.

  9. #9
    Regular Member TechnoWeenie's Avatar
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    I'm curious how the arrangement of the entryway in the house/apartment is set up to allow someone to come from behind without him knowing.

    Everyone has days off, and/or lets their guard down when they get home....

    But there's a reason why I carry even inside my house.. you never know..

    I was trained to keep a defensive posture around my gun. Arm/elbow/wrist over it to prevent random grabs. It also provides the shortest reach, short of having your hand already on it.

    I would use the experience as a smack in the face that HE decides whether he lives or dies. and HE is ultimately responsible for himself.

    It's easier to disarm someone in close quarters than they think. Shoving a gun in someones face is the LEAST safe thing to do.

  10. #10
    Campaign Veteran since9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sky1 View Post
    yeah, they banged him up and cut him up pretty bad. I am pretty sure they cops will get them, just a matter of time.
    I hate to state the obvious, Sky1, but if your friend had been carrying, he could have got them, just a matter of a second or two.

    And without getting cut up.
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  11. #11
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by since9 View Post
    I hate to state the obvious, Sky1, but if your friend had been carrying, he could have got them, just a matter of a second or two.

    And without getting cut up.
    Would you please post the video you have of the incident that you are relying on to make that assertion, along with a detailed description of the responses that the homeowner should have made. Noting the time-stamp for each move will be most helpful and is therefore requested. Also please explain how the neighbor could pull all of that off without having attended training - and a list of the specific training he should have attended would be helpful, too.

    In other words, unless you are bucking for Keyboard Commando of the Year the assertion you make is bovine excrement.

    I guess I'll have to say it again so you can have another whack at understanding it - the gun is not some magic talisman. Without training and practice it is just something that might make you feel good until the time comes when you find out not knowing how to effectively use it under pressure can be more deadly than not having a gun at all.

    Befire I close, I'd like to ask how you determined that the neighbor could have avoided getting cut when he was assaulted with a knife from close range? Are there other sekrit ninja skills you know of that have actually been tested i real-world situations that can prevent one from getting cut in a knife fight? And howe come you know them but none of the knife-fighting instructors with decades of experience based on real knife fights never even heard of such skills?

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

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  12. #12
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    I agree with skidmark.

    It's always easy to play armchair quarterback.

  13. #13
    Regular Member MKEgal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by since9
    ... if your friend had been carrying, he could have got them, just a matter of a second or two.
    And without getting cut up.
    Dunno about the "not getting cut" part, especially since the attackers apparently managed to get very close before he noticed them,
    but if that person were like most people we know who carry,
    he'd have training, & he would practice,
    & yes, he'd have a pretty good chance of stopping the attack without being held for an hour, beat up, etc.

    No, a gun isn't magic, for good or for evil.
    But can't people other than me & since9 make the logical leap (or, if you prefer, assumption) that someone who's been through such a horrible experience & decided to be armed in the future for his own protection would most likely get appropriate training & practice??
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  14. #14
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Unfortunately, most people who carry do not train and do not practice. It may seem to you that most folks train and practice because you hang around with the ones that do.

    And yes, if the friend survived the ordeal and decided that the best response was to gun up, then we can hope that the friend also gets training and practices. But that is not what the majority of folks do when they go out and get a gun after being the victim of some violent incident. Most of them don't even do what's necessary to qualify for, let alone apply for, the .gov paperwork that will allow them to carry discreetly. As for practicing - does going somewhere and shooting up a box of ammo once before putting the gun in the sock drawer where it will be "handy" count?

    Sorry your bubble got burst.

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
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    Good points, Skid..

    That said, Op should advise his pal to take the lessons learned from the situation -and seek every possible method he can afford to ,to get into a "never again" mode. Life is no longer a "what if" is has happened-it;s time to become a gunfighter (when needed)


    1) Situational awareness- ie: stay alert, stay alive. Even at "home" or wherever you normally feel safe- you need to be aware of who/what's around you as much as is possible. He needs to learn to look past the obvious ("oh, there's no one standing beside my front door") to thinking like the bad-guys ("if I were to target ME, where would I lie in wait?,how and from where would I approach?.etc")

    2) Gun-up and train-up. Get equipped with what he can afford and handle, learn how to use it to the best of his abilities,look into his local laws regarding carry (if-any) and carry OC and/or CC 24-7, even IN the house.
    If Sky is also armed, or knowledgeable in being so- train him-show him what you know, or set things up to learn and train together -as partners.

    3) Murphy-Proofing- have a backup, and backup plan to the backup for when that fails.Not just for the gun of choice, but in preperation to go hand-to-hand, knife to hand, blunt object to hand, etc.
    On the same note-if he arms up, have him invest in some snap-caps, and learn to insert 1 or 2 -at random-into every mag. or every other mag- to learn to deal with failures to fire, clear malfunctions, and so forth. (good habit to get into) -also have him train (and train yourself) to shoot with either hand. Shoot left-handed one mag, right handed the next, etc.

    4) Get out of whatever he's up to or invovled in that brought these guys to his door, or if that doesnt apply, learn to be more discreet with any valuable items that may draw someone to your place.- (most home-invasions of this type are commited by folks who know you-or at least know what possesions you have that they may be after/it is rare, in the extreme, for any home-invasion type robberies to occur at random, by strangers-ever.).
    Last edited by j4l; 10-29-2011 at 01:13 PM.

  16. #16
    Regular Member okboomer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    Unfortunately, most people who carry do not train and do not practice. It may seem to you that most folks train and practice because you hang around with the ones that do.
    Have to agree with Skid here ... even folks here on OCDO many times show their lack of training. I realize that most regular posters are probably tired of seeing me post time after time for new folks to go get training, but that is the simple fact of the matter. For most folks, even some military personnel, without tactical training, they are just a boob with a gun.

    Before I had tactical training, there were a LOT of issues attendant with carrying daily that I simply had not considered even after having the required gun safety class for my CC. Find the right training class/instructor and you can even receive the same training as your state's LEO and receive state certification for certain aspects of that training such as Certified First Responder to Active Shooter, etc.

    Gladly, many of the members here have had advanced training and I believe that is the best way to 'answer' any claims that OC is dangerous.
    cheers - okboomer
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  17. #17
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    He answered the question that was put to him by his co-workers who have CC permits, his response was that even if he had a gun he would not have had the opportunity. But asked again the next day he said if he had some training then yes, but not sure if he would have been killed. Then said he was just happy to be alive.

    No saying for sure what would have happened.

  18. #18
    Regular Member Resto Guy's Avatar
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    Wink

    He could have tried pointing his finger. That's been known to terrify some folks.

  19. #19
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    2v1. With at least one gun. And they got the drop on the victim, who was possibly cornered in an entryway. Likelihood of escaping uninjured is pretty low, no matter what choice you make (or how you are armed).

    If you have the SA to see them coming, then of course things are different.

  20. #20
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    THEY GOT EM!!!
    I was just informed they tried it with another person and got in a wreck while trying to run from an ex security guard.

    Cops dialed their Glocks on them and game over!

    I will try and find the news story and post. Apparently these guys got around.
    Last edited by Sky1; 11-10-2011 at 05:05 PM.

  21. #21
    Regular Member MilProGuy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by since9 View Post
    I hate to state the obvious, Sky1, but if your friend had been carrying, he could have got them, just a matter of a second or two.

    And without getting cut up.
    I don't know if he could have avoided being cut, or if he could have actually got the attackers before they got to him...BUT...I see your point...he would have been a heck of a lot better off had he been aware of his surroundings AND armed with a handgun when the attack began.
    Last edited by MilProGuy; 11-10-2011 at 06:07 PM. Reason: edited to correct spelling
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  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by MilProGuy View Post
    I don't know if he could have avoided being cut, or if he could have actually got the attackers before they got to him...BUT...I see your point...he would have been a heck of a lot better off had he been aware of his surroundings AND armed with a handgun when the attack began.
    Your point about getting to the attackers first is why its a good idea to carry a sheath knife that can be accessed VERY quickly and with a single hand. This is of course in addition to any firearms carried.
    Don't believe any facts that I say! This is the internet and it is filled with lies and untruth. I invite you to look up for yourself the basic facts that my arguments might be based upon. This way we can have a discussion where logic and hints on where to find information are what is brought to the forum and people look up and verify facts for themselves.

  23. #23
    Regular Member MainelyGlock's Avatar
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    This is one of the reasons why I am currently taking Krav Maga classes. They teach you situational awareness, and how to handle yourself in CQ situations where you may not even be able to draw your weapon. Some people carry a backup gun; I carry a backup knife, and soon my bare hands will be my backup gun.
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