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Thread: Veteran's Day -NYT's Andrew Rosenthal on Gun Control, Gun Lobby and Military Suicides

  1. #1
    Herr Heckler Koch
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    Veteran's Day -NYT's Andrew Rosenthal on Gun Control, Gun Lobby and Military Suicides

    http://loyalopposition.blogs.nytimes...tary-suicides/
    "I want to be clear: the New York Times editorial board does not oppose gun ownership. We believe the Second Amendment confers a communal right on Americans to own guns – not an individual one. But that’s actually a smaller point than you might think. All we really want are sensible restrictions based on public safety and common sense. I wrote about our position in April, 2009 on our website. You can read it there, but I’ll summarize it here."

    http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/13/bu...pagewanted=all

  2. #2
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Sory, Mr. Rosenthal, but that discussion is now closed - and your side lost.

    In other words, the NYT is saying that SCOTUS got it wrong in Heller and then again in MacDonald and the NYT refuses to accept the rule of law because they disagree with it. It's nice to know that's how they see things.

    stay safe.
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    Campaign Veteran since9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Herr Heckler Koch View Post
    http://loyalopposition.blogs.nytimes...tary-suicides/
    "I want to be clear: the New York Times editorial board does not oppose gun ownership.
    Of course not. They and pretty much everyone else having anything to do with New York, including former Senator Hillary Clinton, Bloomburg, etc, are so ridiculously brainwashed they...

    ... We believe the Second Amendment confers a communal right on Americans to own guns
    Terrific! So did our Founding Fathers, you know, the ones who penned the Declaration of Independence and wrote our Constitution and added our Bill of Rights.

    ...not an individual one....
    That's just wrong so many ways to Sunday it's not funny, like contrary to the Declaration of Independence, contrary to our Constitution, contrary to our Bill of Rights, contrary to countless local, state, and federal (including SCOTUS) decisions.

    So your basis for your gross claim without basis is... What?

    It's time you put your entire argument beneath the floor mat of the foundations upon which our country is based, as the "not an individual one" fails tens of thousands of Founding Father documents on hand in our Library of Congress. It also fails hundreds of thousands of documents penned thereafter, as well as dozens of Supreme Court findings to the contrary, include one of their most recent findings (the other didn't mention it).

    All we really want are sensible restrictions based on public safety and common sense.
    Here's an idea: Any and all folks who feel they cannot responsibly carry firearms are free to opt out of the rights guaranteed by our Founding Fathers to do so. They would, by voluntary discretion, confer any and all rights to defend themselves on the self-voluntary basis they're either unwilling or incapable of doing so.

    How does that float your boat? If it doesn't, I suggest you take your anti-American ideas and flee our country. There are many other countries out there which buy into your boatload of ******** and utter, anti-American nonsense. Cluebird, dude - America isn't one of them.
    Last edited by since9; 11-20-2011 at 02:15 AM.
    The First protects the Second, and the Second protects the First. Together, they protect the rest of our Bill of Rights and our United States Constitution, and help We the People protect ourselves in the spirit of our Declaration of Independence.

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    Regular Member Dreamer's Avatar
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    Of course the fact that our brave military personnel are being pumped full of experimental psychoactive drugs while on tour, being forced to do 6,7,8, even 9 tours in hard-core combat zones, being ordered by their psychopathic "leaders" to commit war crimes as SOP, and are fighting a war that many of them know has NOTHING to do with what is right and just but is in fact a form of imperialistic eugenics to kill brown people for their land, oil and gold doesn't have ANYTHING to do with the rocketing rates of PTSD and veteran suicide...

    An the fact that the VA and the DOD are doing EVERYTHING in their power to screw returning vets out of disability payments, medical coverage, mental-health treatment and unemployment benefits, (and even allowing the insurance companies to steal their death benefits from their families if they die on duty!) forcing them into a downward spiral of depression, poverty, and desperation has NOTHING to do with it either.

    Our government sees soldiers as "expendable resources". When they are no longer out and about in uniform killing brown people, they are viewed as being "no longer valuable", and in some cases are seen as a potential threat to the establishment. They WANT these returning vets to be marginalized, subjugated, dependent on the system, and ultimately "eradicated" when their "work" is done. The entire system is DESIGNED to perform this task with supreme efficiency.

    Why can't people see this--it's plain as the nose on your face.
    It is our cause to dispel the foggy thinking which avoids hard decisions in the delusion that a world of conflict will somehow mysteriously resolve itself into a world of harmony, if we just don't rock the boat or irritate the forces of aggression—and this is hogwash."
    --Barry Goldwater, 1964

  5. #5
    Regular Member Dreamer's Avatar
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    BTW, a little background on Mr. Rosenthal...

    He is the son of the previous Executive Editor of the NYT--so that makes him a generational propagandist.

    He was born in New Dehli India, so technically, he's not even a natural-born US citizen.

    He served as the AP's Moscow Bureau Chief in 1987.

    "You shall know them by their fruits."

    And apparently this apple didn't fall far from the tree..
    It is our cause to dispel the foggy thinking which avoids hard decisions in the delusion that a world of conflict will somehow mysteriously resolve itself into a world of harmony, if we just don't rock the boat or irritate the forces of aggression—and this is hogwash."
    --Barry Goldwater, 1964

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamer View Post
    BTW, a little background on Mr. Rosenthal...

    He is the son of the previous Executive Editor of the NYT--so that makes him a generational propagandist.

    He was born in New Dehli India, so technically, he's not even a natural-born US citizen.

    He served as the AP's Moscow Bureau Chief in 1987.

    "You shall know them by their fruits."

    And apparently this apple didn't fall far from the tree..
    After reading this I realized I'd been thinking the putz was someone else, Dr. Rosenfeld from fox news Sunday house call. I'm glad I didn't send any nastygrams to him or fox. Seems I have no idea who this Rosenthal is nor why anyone including those on here give a rats rear what he says.
    Don't believe any facts that I say! This is the internet and it is filled with lies and untruth. I invite you to look up for yourself the basic facts that my arguments might be based upon. This way we can have a discussion where logic and hints on where to find information are what is brought to the forum and people look up and verify facts for themselves.

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    Campaign Veteran since9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamer View Post
    Of course the fact that our brave military personnel are being pumped full of experimental psychoactive drugs while on tour...
    No, Dreamer. We were not. This is nonsense.

    Why can't people see this--it's plain as the nose on your face.
    I could be because we're not just so close we can't see the forest through the trees. Or it could be because we vets are the trees, and we see zero evidence of this groundless meanderings.
    The First protects the Second, and the Second protects the First. Together, they protect the rest of our Bill of Rights and our United States Constitution, and help We the People protect ourselves in the spirit of our Declaration of Independence.

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    Quote Originally Posted by since9 View Post
    No, Dreamer. We were not. This is nonsense.
    Not to give any sort of credibility to his claim, BUT, I do recall signing a waiver for some meds that I was "asked" to take, or to suffer some form of "non-related" punishment during PDP. They didnt tell us what they were for either...

    Just sayin lol....
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  9. #9
    Regular Member Redbaron007's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Herr Heckler Koch View Post
    http://loyalopposition.blogs.nytimes...tary-suicides/
    "I want to be clear: the New York Times editorial board does not oppose gun ownership. We believe the Second Amendment confers a communal right on Americans to own guns – not an individual one. But that’s actually a smaller point than you might think. All we really want are sensible restrictions based on public safety and common sense. I wrote about our position in April, 2009 on our website. You can read it there, but I’ll summarize it here."

    http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/13/bu...pagewanted=all
    Liberals!!

  10. #10
    Regular Member Dreamer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by since9 View Post
    No, Dreamer. We were not. This is nonsense.
    Believe what you want--Congress sees things differently, and is currently investigating the inappropriate prescription of a myriad of psychotropics to combat troops, and there are several other ongoing investigations in academic circles looking into links between vet suicides and drugs prescribed while on tour.

    Not to mention the intentional exposure to massively inappropriate doses of pesticides, and experimental "antidotes" for neurotoxic chemical weapons they are given like pyridostigmine bromide, which has well-known neurotoxic side-effects and long-term serious health problems with even minimal exposure (like in a "vaccine")...

    And we won't even get into the whole Squalene adjuvant issue...

    http://militarytimes.com/news/2010/0..._drugs_031710w

    http://news.injuryboard.com/federal-...oogleid=251754

    http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.p...t=va&aid=20186

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Wmnhw0MzeY

    http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/biowar.html

    http://www.gulfwarvets.com/insight5.htm

    http://www.gulfwarvets.com/senate.htm


    I mean it only took the DOD, like what, 30 years to admit that they KNEW Agent Orange would cause several different kinds of cancer, digestive disorders and even neurological and mental disorders in humans after spraying literally TONS of it on American Troops in SouthEast Asia in the 1960s--and then DENYING them medical coverage for the cancers that plagued those fine servicemen later in life. And even after they admitted they KNEW about the long-term effects of Agent Orange--for the last 20 years--they STILL fight tooth and nail any legitimate claim that Viet Nam combat vets file that is provably Agent-Orange-related, and I'm speaking from the first-hand experience of a close family member who's gone through this Viet Nam-era Cluster Foxtrot of denial, lies, and coverups...

    You are right--they'd NEVER lie to us about that sort of thing. I guess the suicide rates of returning vets has NOTHING to do with the mind-bending coctail of psychotropics they are being given while "in the sand".

    It must just be because our troops today are such spineless wussies, then, eh? (SARCASM alert...)

    I mean, how else can YOU explain it?...
    Last edited by Dreamer; 11-22-2011 at 01:17 AM.
    It is our cause to dispel the foggy thinking which avoids hard decisions in the delusion that a world of conflict will somehow mysteriously resolve itself into a world of harmony, if we just don't rock the boat or irritate the forces of aggression—and this is hogwash."
    --Barry Goldwater, 1964

  11. #11
    Campaign Veteran since9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamer View Post
    Believe what you want...
    Having been in the thick of things, I choose to believe what's real. From one of your links: "And many troops are taking more than one kind, mixing several pills in daily “cocktails” — for example, an antidepressant with an antipsychotic to prevent nightmares, plus an anti-epileptic to reduce headaches..."

    That's standard treatment for PTSD, AFTER combat ops. It's not given beforehand as an "experimental measure."

    I don't know where you're dredging up your info, Dreamer, but your information is totally without merit.
    The First protects the Second, and the Second protects the First. Together, they protect the rest of our Bill of Rights and our United States Constitution, and help We the People protect ourselves in the spirit of our Declaration of Independence.

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