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Are TSA officers "Law Enforcement"?

MAC702

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Jul 31, 2011
Messages
6,331
Location
Nevada
I was very interested as I started to finally read this thread. But after Googling a few other articles it seems as if it was only commercial truck drivers that were subject to these stops, right? And even though TSA was assisting on these particular days, State DOTs routinely do these inspections on commercial trucks, right? No one in a private vehicle was ever stopped in this ordeal, right?

I'm not saying TSA is correct, nor am I for random stops on commercial trucks, but I want to make sure I understand this was not RANDOM to private citizens, just commercial trucking, right? I'm pretty sure commercial truckers know going into the job that they are susceptible to random DOT inspections, right?
 

Z1P2

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 17, 2012
Messages
85
Location
Corryton
supreme court rulings

Somehow after their decisions that the government's interest in making money trumps your private property ownership rights with regard to eminent domain abuse and after ruling that corporations are people and that money is speech and that any restrictions on bribing government officials should be lifted, I have little faith in the Supreme Court anymore.
 

sraacke

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Joined
Jul 20, 2008
Messages
1,214
Location
Saint Gabriel, Louisiana, USA
NO, There is no duty to inform.

NO. This is not a lawful search, Your only duty is to defy.
And if they setup and start attacking people like this in-mass then its an act of war, any able bodied man witnessing such an attack has a duty to fight.

Post Reported.
Posts like this do nothing to help our cause. They damage it. The Anitgun/AntiOC groups are reading this board too and this kind of stuff gives them proof that OCers are a bunch of anti-government extremists.
 

PALO

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Feb 12, 2012
Messages
729
Location
Kent
I was very interested as I started to finally read this thread. But after Googling a few other articles it seems as if it was only commercial truck drivers that were subject to these stops, right? And even though TSA was assisting on these particular days, State DOTs routinely do these inspections on commercial trucks, right? No one in a private vehicle was ever stopped in this ordeal, right?

I'm not saying TSA is correct, nor am I for random stops on commercial trucks, but I want to make sure I understand this was not RANDOM to private citizens, just commercial trucking, right? I'm pretty sure commercial truckers know going into the job that they are susceptible to random DOT inspections, right?

random stops on COMMERCIAL trucks don't necesarily bother me. it's similar to the fact that law enforcement can conduct random inspections (taps, liquor license, server's license etc.) of a liquor establishment and to obstruct same is a crime

commercial vehicles are very highly regulated for good reason. they can cause immensely more damage than (most) private vehicles, and they are engaged in commerce, which has substantially less privacy protections (on a public road) than transport by private persons does and should.

granted, in many respects, a truckers cab is his home away from home, but these are safety inspections, and my understanding is they are not searching his sleeping area, they are checking brakes, tire tread, stuff like that.
 

jrob33

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 17, 2010
Messages
60
Location
oklahoma
From http://blog.tsa.gov/2011/10/myth-buster-tsa-not-setting-up.html "Depending on what inaccurate blog post you may have read, you would think that TSA has checkpoints set up all across Tennessee’s highways. That’s just simply not the case."

"TSA officers did not physically screen drivers during this exercise as erroneously reported. The actual vehicle inspections were conducted by the Tennessee State Highway Patrol just the same as they are done every day."



LOL! seriously? do you not remember the TSA publicly stating that the images could not be saved from the X-ray machines..then OOPS a TSA screener got busted cause he had them on his memory card, Or the TSA saying WE DO NOT DO STRIP SEARCHES", but then coming back and saying "oh well, yeah we do that but WE dont CALL it a strip search,AFTER they got caught, or even better the TSA pointing to a report from John Hopkins and telling its employees that the report proves the X-ray scanner doesnt cause cancer...Nevermind the fact that THE HEAD of John Hopkins has publically said NO, thats not what the report says, we KNOW they cause cancer....
 

jrob33

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 17, 2010
Messages
60
Location
oklahoma
I was very interested as I started to finally read this thread. But after Googling a few other articles it seems as if it was only commercial truck drivers that were subject to these stops, right? And even though TSA was assisting on these particular days, State DOTs routinely do these inspections on commercial trucks, right? No one in a private vehicle was ever stopped in this ordeal, right?

I'm not saying TSA is correct, nor am I for random stops on commercial trucks, but I want to make sure I understand this was not RANDOM to private citizens, just commercial trucking, right? I'm pretty sure commercial truckers know going into the job that they are susceptible to random DOT inspections, right?

ok so we are cool with Commercial truck drivers..Are we cool with Dept of Homeland security patting down teenagers to go into their prom? Or at the Super Bowl? Or High school sports events (theyve stated thats coming) see it STARTS with commercial vehicles, (well technically it started at the Airports) because that seems reasonable then it increases., its called conditioning
 

MAC702

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Jul 31, 2011
Messages
6,331
Location
Nevada
No one said it was okay for commercial trucking. But it MAY be Constitutional. Interstate commercial trucking and shipping actually is something the Federal government is supposed to regulate.

HOWEVER, I am not saying I agree with any of their policies. But this thread started and ran about things that actually weren't happening to private citizens. I only pointed that out.
 

sudden valley gunner

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Dec 13, 2008
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16,674
Location
Whatcom County
No one said it was okay for commercial trucking. But it MAY be Constitutional. Interstate commercial trucking and shipping actually is something the Federal government is supposed to regulate.

HOWEVER, I am not saying I agree with any of their policies. But this thread started and ran about things that actually weren't happening to private citizens. I only pointed that out.

Well since we have twisted the original meaning of regulate from "to make regular" to impose restriction upon, you would have a point except that the constitution is a legal restriction on what the government can do, and the 4th amendment applies to is a restriction on the federal government that would apply to commercial truck drivers too in my opinion.
 

MAC702

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Messages
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Nevada
Well since we have twisted the original meaning of regulate from "to make regular" to impose restriction upon, you would have a point except that the constitution is a legal restriction on what the government can do, and the 4th amendment applies to is a restriction on the federal government that would apply to commercial truck drivers too in my opinion.

Excellent point!
 

OC for ME

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Jan 6, 2010
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Location
White Oak Plantation
random stops on COMMERCIAL trucks don't necesarily bother me. it's similar to the fact that law enforcement can conduct random inspections (taps, liquor license, server's license etc.) of a liquor establishment and to obstruct same is a crime
Why does not LE conduct random 'inspections' of patrons leaving a liquor establishment, with car-keys in their hand?

commercial vehicles are very highly regulated for good reason. they can cause immensely more damage than (most) private vehicles, and they are engaged in commerce, which has substantially less privacy protections (on a public road) than transport by private persons does and should.
Yet, far more non-commercial vehicles are involved in accidents than commercial vehicles. Why not hold non-commercial vehicles to the same standards and regulations? It is not about the private person or....what non-private person....er, public person driver guy, it is about the vehicle type. Commerce is commerce.

How many commercial vehicles involved in accidents on the roads are caused by the driver and how many are due to the driver getting caught up in a accident caused by a four-wheeler?

granted, in many respects, a truckers cab is his home away from home, but these are safety inspections, and my understanding is they are not searching his sleeping area, they are checking brakes, tire tread, stuff like that.
Does this apply to in-state only trucking? Does this apply to trucks that haul construction equipment as course of doing business only in their state? Does this apply to a farmer hauling his farm machinery to a remote field? What is the dividing line? Interstate highway travel or all roads within a state? What is deemed commercial and what is not? The license plate type does not denote commercial or non-commercial. 'Accidents' do not differentiate between commercial or non-commercial.

Granted, when a big truck gets in a wreck, a far worse outcome results, been there done that, dang four-wheelers.

Why does not LE conduct random inspections of non-commercial vehicles to check brakes, tire tread, stuff like that? Safety inspection sticker you may say? Not all states require them. How can a LEO determine from afar that the safety sticker, if one is required, is current or valid?

Heck, do I need federal permission to manufacture and sell firearms for use only in Missouri? Can I be held to account for a customer who could possibly 'transport' a Missouri only firearm to another state?
 

OC for ME

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How about a big-rig that is classified as a private vehicle? Looks like a big truck, but is used like a family car. Do these 'drivers' get the same treatment as the J.B. Hunt drivers?

Been there done that too.
 

MAC702

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Nevada
How about a big-rig that is classified as a private vehicle? Looks like a big truck, but is used like a family car. Do these 'drivers' get the same treatment as the J.B. Hunt drivers?

Been there done that too.

I've asked that same question of some trucker friends. Supposedly, you are exempt from the commercial trucking BS and stuff, but they said hassles happen. Big surprise.

After hearing some stories, I get nervous just driving my 1-ton dually pickup in Texas.
 

ncwabbit

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Nov 2, 2011
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670
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rural religious usa
Theoretically, those big rigs marked ‘not for commercial use’ are exempt from DOT oversight. Have a friend who hauls his demo vehicle in his and got stopped and played twenty questions w/DOT trooper. Trooper was going to cite him because he ‘won’ a trophy for his last race and called the trophy compensation. My friend told him to get a supervisor or two out there ASAP. DOT trooper backed down immediately.

wabbit
 

jrob33

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Joined
Dec 17, 2010
Messages
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Location
oklahoma
the "mainstream" media article (and I use the term mainstream VERY lightly) I read stated that state troopers were conducting the safety inspections with assistance from TSA VIPR teams...interesting that the troopers have been doing this for years and all the sudden they need TSA there with them....But they also reported that the TSA VIPR teams were speakig with the driver in an attempt to "recruit" them into the TSA's "see something say something" program.
 

jrob33

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 17, 2010
Messages
60
Location
oklahoma
According to the TSA website, they conducted a two day training excercise in which they accompanied TN SHP officers, but it was TN SHP officers that were doing the stops, so if they ever conduct another such excercise you would have a duty to inform because you would be dealing with a TN SHP officer and not the TSA agents who were just basically doing a ride-along.

http://blog.tsa.gov/2011/10/myth-buster-tsa-not-setting-up.html

Regardless, it's better to inform when you don't have the duty to, than to fail to inform when you do have the duty to... or put another way, better safe than sorry.

Again thats all according to the TSA, and its not like they have ever lied to the people.......taking the word of known and proven liars is not ony STUPID, but could end up being VERY costly in this case.
 

OC for ME

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White Oak Plantation
How about this, read and understand your state's statutes and follow them. You will be way ahead of most LEOs regarding knowledge, and some LEOs regarding following.
 
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