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Thread: Concealing magazines under 21

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    Concealing magazines under 21

    I just picked up a 1911 today through a private sale. I was wondering if there is any laws against concealing a extra loaded Magazine if the gun is being open carried. I'm under 21 so i know i can't conceal the gun, I just didn't know if that includes mags. Thanks!

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    Regular Member carry for myself's Avatar
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    in order to conceal a firearm it has to be a firearm. law states that a firearm is any object capable of producing or firing a missile *aka bullet* also the ATF only regards a firearm as the PART of the firearm containing the serial # . therefore a glock is a firearm because it produces and fires a missile and the barrel, frame and slide are marked with a serial number.

    that being said a magazine is a magazine. it is a hollow piece of metal that holds ammunition. therefore it is not a firearm and could not be charged as such. the charge would be "concealing ammunition or a device used to carry ammunition" but the issue with that charge is.......it doesnt exist.

    now under 21 is up to AZ law. as i am aware AZ you do not need a permit to conceal or OC. much like alaska and vermont. therefore *i may be wrong and am having issues finding the statues* you may even be able to CC under 21 but maybe another member who knows the AZ laws can confirm or deny that.

    however concealing ammunition or a mag is not illegal as far as i know.
    i would rather run out of blood, breath and life. and die fighting. than run out of ammo , and die with my pants down -Tom Scantas

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    Regular Member xmanhockey7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carry for myself View Post
    in order to conceal a firearm it has to be a firearm. law states that a firearm is any object capable of producing or firing a missile *aka bullet* also the ATF only regards a firearm as the PART of the firearm containing the serial # . therefore a glock is a firearm because it produces and fires a missile and the barrel, frame and slide are marked with a serial number.

    that being said a magazine is a magazine. it is a hollow piece of metal that holds ammunition. therefore it is not a firearm and could not be charged as such. the charge would be "concealing ammunition or a device used to carry ammunition" but the issue with that charge is.......it doesnt exist.

    now under 21 is up to AZ law. as i am aware AZ you do not need a permit to conceal or OC. much like alaska and vermont. therefore *i may be wrong and am having issues finding the statues* you may even be able to CC under 21 but maybe another member who knows the AZ laws can confirm or deny that.

    however concealing ammunition or a mag is not illegal as far as i know.
    You must be 21 to conceal in AZ with or without a permit.
    "No state shall convert a liberty to a privilege, license it, and charge a fee therefor.- Murdock vs Pennsylvania 319 US 105

    ...If the state converts a right into a privelege, the citizen can ignore the license and fee and engage in the right... with impunity.
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    Regular Member crackersillo's Avatar
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    Welcome

    Arizona law prohibits CC'ING a "firearm" under 21, the law is very clear about CC.
    Bullets are technically considered "explosives" not "firearms" so you’re good to go.

    Remember to carry responsibly and try to remember or carry a copy in your wallet of the ARS that correspond to OC’ing under 21.

    Stay safe, and welcome to OC.

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    Regular Member Phoenix David's Avatar
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    I don't think loaded ammunition is classified as an explosive at least at the federal level and I am fairly sure Arizona doesn't classify it as an explosive , if it was there are strict federal and state storage laws and it wouldn't be sitting on the shelf at Wal-Mart.

    As far as I can find the law is silent on the concealment of magazines.

    Remember this is Arizona not California.
    Freedom is a bit like sex, when your getting it you take it for granted, when you're not you want it bad, other people get mad at you for having it and others want to take it away from you so only they have it.

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    Regular Member crackersillo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phoenix David View Post
    I don't think loaded ammunition is classified as an explosive at least at the federal level and I am fairly sure Arizona doesn't classify it as an explosive , if it was there are strict federal and state storage laws and it wouldn't be sitting on the shelf at Wal-Mart.

    As far as I can find the law is silent on the concealment of magazines.

    Remember this is Arizona not California.

    § 173.50 Class 1—Definitions.
    (a) Explosive. For the purpose of this
    subchapter, an explosive means any substance
    or article, including a device,
    which is designed to function by explosion
    (i.e., an extremely rapid release of
    gas and heat) or which, by chemical reaction
    within itself, is able to function
    in a similar manner even if not designed
    to function by explosion, unless
    the substance or article is otherwise
    classed under the provision of this subchapter.



    "Small Arms Ammunition. Ammunition is classified as a Division 1.1, 1.2, 1.3, or 1.4 explosive, depending on the degree of hazard. Ammunition that is regulated as a Class 1 explosive and designed to be fired from a pistol, revolver, rifle, or shotgun, as well as associated primers and blank cartridges (including those designed for tools)"



    Is this not right? I got this info a while back from another forum, Please correct me if i'm wrong.
    Last edited by crackersillo; 11-23-2011 at 02:08 AM.

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    Campaign Veteran Schlitz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Don.Az View Post
    I just picked up a 1911 today through a private sale. I was wondering if there is any laws against concealing a extra loaded Magazine if the gun is being open carried. I'm under 21 so i know i can't conceal the gun, I just didn't know if that includes mags. Thanks!



    The single digit post count, specifically 1, makes this seem a bit...you know...trollish? but not too much of a troll question to incite ZOMFG .22 IS NOT THE BEST CALIBER YOU IDIOT...but possibly a valid question? idunno.
    “The claim and exercise of a constitutional right cannot be converted into a crime.”
    [Miller vs. U.S., 230 F. Supp. 486, 489 (1956)]
    “There can be no sanction or penalty imposed upon one because of his exercise of constitutional rights.”
    [Sherar vs. Cullen, 481 F2d. 946 (1973)]

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    It is a serious question. Didn't see anything in ars 13-3102 about it but wanted to double check before I started carrying.

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