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Thread: General Help--Sorry

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    Regular Member Red Dawg's Avatar
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    General Help--Sorry

    Guys/Gals,

    I searched on "checking a fireamrs history" and "Serial number checks". Nothing worthwhile comes up for what I need. I thought about the general forums, but I trust my fellow VA members, and those that come on here. I aquired a handgun from a friend who died, and I know no history of it. His ex-wife that gave it to me, knew no history. Is there any way of checking the history? See if it was stolen, or had any issues in it's past without going to a police station and losing the gun if it does have a history, or just put in jail for having a stolen, "crime" gun...
    The Second Amendment is in place
    in case the politicians ignore the others

    A gun in the hand is better than a cop on the phone

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    To my knowledge, no, there is no way other than asking the police to run the serial number.

    More importantly, do you have reason to believe it may be stolen? If so I wouldn't touch it, if not, then I wouldn't worry about it, especially if it's not going to be a daily carry piece.

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    As far as history of any issues, you may be able to contact the manufacturer to see if it has ever been sent back to them for repair. Again, I wouldn't worry about it, look it over good, if there are no signs of issues, fire a few rounds to test, or if you're not that familiar with guns have a local gunsmith look it over.
    Last edited by builtjeep; 11-28-2011 at 11:26 AM.

  4. #4
    Regular Member Red Dawg's Avatar
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    I'm not worried mechanically, good an tight, etc...I worry about it criminally. just want to make sure it wasn't stolen, or anything in it's "previous life". Would be nice second/BUG. But may be relagated to closet/home security only. Which always a bad thing, but....
    The Second Amendment is in place
    in case the politicians ignore the others

    A gun in the hand is better than a cop on the phone

  5. #5
    Regular Member mk4's Avatar
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    it sounds like you may have more than a passing concern about a 'poor' history on the gun.

    personally fwiw, unless it were a highly sentimental or collectable firearm, in which case i'd probably relegate it to the safe, i'd have it checked and not worry about it being confiscated. i don't think it'd be worth risking a gun charge/conviction/jail and putting your 2a rights or cc privilege at risk for something like a "nice second/BUG".

  6. #6
    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Dawg View Post
    I'm not worried mechanically, good an tight, etc...I worry about it criminally. just want to make sure it wasn't stolen, or anything in it's "previous life". Would be nice second/BUG. But may be relagated to closet/home security only. Which always a bad thing, but....
    Even if you take it to the police station, they probably won't do it without a reason.

    If you know a Cop well enough to ask a favor, that's the way to go...otherwise it's nearly impossible.
    If you lived in York it's possible Sheriff Diggs would arrange it. He's that type of Sheriff he is.

    Your best bet is to get a receipt from the wife complete with Serial Number. That takes you off the hook criminally.
    Last edited by peter nap; 11-28-2011 at 12:45 PM.

  7. #7
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by peter nap View Post
    Even if you take it to the police station, they probably won't do it without a reason.

    If you know a Cop well enough to ask a favor, that's the way to go...otherwise it's nearly impossible.
    If you lived in York it's possible Sheriff Diggs would arrange it. He's that type of Sheriff he is.

    Your best bet is to get a receipt from the wife complete with Serial Number. That takes you off the hook criminally.
    Best advice given - take it from the pro.

    Document, record and proceed.

    Besides aren't all guns presumed innocent until proven guilty?
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

  8. #8
    Regular Member Red Dawg's Avatar
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    Thanks for the advice. Get a receipt, and then I'm thinking plinking on private property only. Only partly a bummer. Still will be fun to shoot, but not going to press my luck out in the open in public where I might run into a leo. Just not worth it. I have other options...
    The Second Amendment is in place
    in case the politicians ignore the others

    A gun in the hand is better than a cop on the phone

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Are you willing to provide even a hint about why you are worried about the provenance of this firearm?

    And if you are that worried, why are you taking any chance at all?

    Sometimes I am flabbergasted at the amount of paranoia folks dream up over nothing.

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

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    Regular Member ocholsteroc's Avatar
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    Sometimes I am flabbergasted at the amount of paranoia folks dream up over nothing.
    Why worry about it unless someone on the street asked you wanted to buy a gun.. Lol I'd call the cops on that.

    BOS when you do private transactions.

    People buy sell guns privately every day across America, websites like VAguntrader etc...
    How come a DUI you can get your driver licence back, which it is a privilege. But if commiting a felon, even something non violent like stealing, you are denied your constitutional rights for the rest of your life?
    If you don't support the Second Amendment to the Constitution, what other parts of the Constitution do you reject?
    More restrictions on guns? how about restrictions on chainsaws and knives?

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    Regular Member mk4's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    Are you willing to provide even a hint about why you are worried about the provenance of this firearm?

    And if you are that worried, why are you taking any chance at all?
    agree!
    it just seems like there's more to this story...

  12. #12
    Regular Member ocholsteroc's Avatar
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    Q: To whom may an unlicensed person transfer firearms under the GCA?
    A person may sell a firearm to an unlicensed resident of his State, if he does not know or have reasonable cause to believe the person is prohibited from receiving or possessing firearms under Federal law. A person may loan or rent a firearm to a resident of any State for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes, if he does not know or have reasonable cause to believe the person is prohibited from receiving or possessing firearms under Federal law. A person may sell or transfer a firearm to a licensee in any State. However, a firearm other than a curio or relic may not be transferred interstate to a licensed collector.
    http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/unli...ensed-transfer



    Do you have reasonable cause that your he was a criminal?
    How come a DUI you can get your driver licence back, which it is a privilege. But if commiting a felon, even something non violent like stealing, you are denied your constitutional rights for the rest of your life?
    If you don't support the Second Amendment to the Constitution, what other parts of the Constitution do you reject?
    More restrictions on guns? how about restrictions on chainsaws and knives?

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    FDLE

    Florida department of law enforcement has a good site. Just google "FDLE gun serial" and see what you get

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    Regular Member TFred's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gm2max View Post
    FDLE

    Florida department of law enforcement has a good site. Just google "FDLE gun serial" and see what you get
    "This database contains Florida stolen property information as reported to the Florida Department of Law Enforcement by law enforcement agencies throughout the state and authorized for release to the public."

    http://pas.fdle.state.fl.us/pas/item/displayGunSearch.a

    And I would expect that much like the decoy NOC List in the film Mission Impossible, someone would probably be calling you up soon after you submitted a search for a gun that "hit" the database...

    Maybe I'm paranoid.

    TFred

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    Regular Member TFred's Avatar
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    Free advice

    From the school of hard knocks:

    "Don't ask questions you don't want to know the answer to..."

    Not proper English, but you get the point.

    The simple fact is, there is no good outcome from asking a LEO to let you know the status of your stolen gun.

    What do you think is going to happen? If it hits, do you think your friend is going to just tell you and forget about it? If there are records of searches, and especially if the searches are not conducted anonymously (less and less likely every day that IT security increases), and one day that gun does show up in another crime, how would it look if your friend "found" the gun (which would be considered "on the street" and not in ownership by an authorized owner) and then did nothing to recover it?

    I don't know the ins and outs of the system(s) involved, but think about it... what good could come?

    TFred

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    Regular Member 2a4all's Avatar
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    If you are in possession of a gun which is shown to have been stolen, you could be charged with possession of stolen property, even if you are the one attempting to learn its status. At the very least you would be answering questions about how you came into possession, which means naming names. A claim of receiving it as a gift will require verification.

    If this weapon was used in a crime (a prime reason to steal it), you could have some 'splainin' to do.

    Of course, all of this hinges on the relative recency of any related criminal activity. If all the actors involved are dead (and weren't killed with this gun), you've got some interesting lore to pass on to your grandchildren. Otherwise, you could be passing on this lore on visitors day...

    Trying to learn if your gun is stolen is like trying to learn if Schrodinger's cat is alive.
    Last edited by 2a4all; 11-29-2011 at 12:05 AM.
    A law-abiding citizen should be able to carry his personal protection firearm anywhere that an armed criminal might go.

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    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2a4all View Post
    If you are in possession of a gun which is shown to have been stolen, you could be charged with possession of stolen property, even if you are the one attempting to learn its status. At the very least you would be answering questions about how you came into possession, which means naming names. A claim of receiving it as a gift will require verification.

    If this weapon was used in a crime (a prime reason to steal it), you could have some 'splainin' to do.

    Of course, all of this hinges on the relative recency of any related criminal activity. If all the actors involved are dead (and weren't killed with this gun), you've got some interesting lore to pass on to your grandchildren. Otherwise, you could be passing on this lore on visitors day...

    Trying to learn if your gun is stolen is like trying to learn if Schrodinger's cat is alive.
    BS!
    Cite the statute and read it first.

  18. #18
    Regular Member Red Dawg's Avatar
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    You guys have more than answered what I need. Skid is right, no need for paranoia. A bill of sale, and I am off the hook. They know me, so they wouldn't give me a bad gun intentionally. I really have no reason to sweat it. Like was stated previous, not my daily carry, and even if it was who's to know just from looking at it, and if there is no PC or RAS, no reason to just run the serial number. Thanks, for your help...I won't beat this horse..
    The Second Amendment is in place
    in case the politicians ignore the others

    A gun in the hand is better than a cop on the phone

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    Activist Member nuc65's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by peter nap View Post
    BS!
    Cite the statute and read it first.
    I don't think there is a legal cite for Schrodinger's cat. But he will be dead after you open the box, no matter that his status is only in doubt while the box is closed.
    When I carry a gun, I don't do so because I am looking for a fight, but because I'm looking to be left alone. The gun at my side means that I cannot be forced, only persuaded. I don't carry it because I'm afraid, but because it enables me to be unafraid. It doesn't limit the actions of those who would interact with me through reason, only the actions of those who would do so by force.

    excerpt By Marko Kloos (http://munchkinwrangler.wordpress.com/?s=major+caudill)

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    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nuc65 View Post
    I don't think there is a legal cite for Schrodinger's cat. But he will be dead after you open the box, no matter that his status is only in doubt while the box is closed.
    You're right Nuc...in practice.
    I can't do much about police corruption, just deal with facts. The simple fact is, possession of stolen property is NOT a crime. The crime is in knowing or having a reasonable belief that it's stolen.

    Probably the most applicable statute is a portion of
    18.2-108.01. Larceny with intent to sell or distribute; sale of stolen property; penalty.
    B. Any person who sells, attempts to sell or possesses with intent to sell or distribute any stolen property with an aggregate value of $200 or more where he knew or should have known that the property was stolen is guilty of a Class 5 felony.


    With stolen property, it's always been the knowledge that it was stolen.

    I get a little sick of wild eyed hysterics over private sales. With people on our side doing that, Goddard doesn't have to work as hard to prove a loophole exists.

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    Regular Member Marco's Avatar
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    Thumbs down you could be charged with possession of stolen property

    Quote Originally Posted by 2a4all View Post
    If you are in possession of a gun which is shown to have been stolen, you could be charged with possession of stolen property, even if you are the one attempting to learn its status. At the very least you would be answering questions about how you came into possession, which means naming names. A claim of receiving it as a gift will require verification.

    If this weapon was used in a crime (a prime reason to steal it), you could have some 'splainin' to do.

    Of course, all of this hinges on the relative recency of any related criminal activity. If all the actors involved are dead (and weren't killed with this gun), you've got some interesting lore to pass on to your grandchildren. Otherwise, you could be passing on this lore on visitors day...

    Trying to learn if your gun is stolen is like trying to learn if Schrodinger's cat is Trying to learn if your gun is stolen is like trying to learn if Schrodinger's cat is alive.


    HOGWASH!!!!!!
    If you have something to back up this claim I'd like to read about it.

    I bought a gun awhile back at a VA GS and before the show was over I sold that same gun. The person I sold it to was LE.
    I saw him at the next show and he told me the gun I sold him was reported stolen out of FL in 2008. The only question I was asked was if I had the name or number of the guy I bought it from.

    I had a similar incident happen in 1998 in NV, I sold a gun (via the newpaper) and when the guy went to register it (clark county) the gun came back stolen.
    I got a call from the firearms unit and again the only question I was asked if I had the name/number of the person I got it from.
    I had the gun for yrs unregisitered (civil violation) and had no info for them.

    I wasn't charged with anything and I wasn't pressured to name names, just asked.




    From my experience the worst that happens is you lose the gun and your money, if a gun you bought is reported stolen and is discovered.



    YMMV.
    If you think like a Statist, act like one, or back some, you've given up on freedom and have gone over to the dark side.
    The easiest ex. but probably the most difficult to grasp for gun owners is that fool permission slip so many of you have, especially if you show it off with pride. You should recognize it as an embarrassment, an infringement, a travesty and an affront to a free person.


    ~Alan Korwin

  22. #22
    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent19 View Post
    HOGWASH!!!!!!
    If you have something to back up this claim I'd like to read about it.

    I bought a gun awhile back at a VA GS and before the show was over I sold that same gun. The person I sold it to was LE.
    I saw him at the next show and he told me the gun I sold him was reported stolen out of FL in 2008. The only question I was asked was if I had the name or number of the guy I bought it from.

    I had a similar incident happen in 1998 in NV, I sold a gun (via the newpaper) and when the guy went to register it (clark county) the gun came back stolen.
    I got a call from the firearms unit and again the only question I was asked if I had the name/number of the person I got it from.
    I had the gun for yrs unregisitered (civil violation) and had no info for them.

    I wasn't charged with anything and I wasn't pressured to name names, just asked.




    From my experience the worst that happens is you lose the gun and your money, if a gun you bought is reported stolen and is discovered.



    YMMV.
    +100

  23. #23
    Regular Member 2a4all's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2a4all View Post
    If you are in possession of a gun which is shown to have been stolen, you could be charged with possession of stolen property, even if you are the one attempting to learn its status. At the very least you would be answering questions about how you came into possession, which means naming names. A claim of receiving it as a gift will require verification.

    If this weapon was used in a crime (a prime reason to steal it), you could have some 'splainin' to do.

    Of course, all of this hinges on the relative recency of any related criminal activity. If all the actors involved are dead (and weren't killed with this gun), you've got some interesting lore to pass on to your grandchildren. Otherwise, you could be passing on this lore on visitors day...

    Trying to learn if your gun is stolen is like trying to learn if Schrodinger's cat is alive.
    Quote Originally Posted by Agent19 View Post
    HOGWASH!!!!!!
    If you have something to back up this claim I'd like to read about it.

    I bought a gun awhile back at a VA GS and before the show was over I sold that same gun. The person I sold it to was LE.
    I saw him at the next show and he told me the gun I sold him was reported stolen out of FL in 2008. The only question I was asked was if I had the name or number of the guy I bought it from.

    I had a similar incident happen in 1998 in NV, I sold a gun (via the newpaper) and when the guy went to register it (clark county) the gun came back stolen.
    I got a call from the firearms unit and again the only question I was asked if I had the name/number of the person I got it from.
    I had the gun for yrs unregisitered (civil violation) and had no info for them.

    I wasn't charged with anything and I wasn't pressured to name names, just asked.




    From my experience the worst that happens is you lose the gun and your money, if a gun you bought is reported stolen and is discovered.



    YMMV.
    I said that "you could be charged". And it seems like you experienced the "very least" level of inquiry, and were asked (I never said how intensly) for a name. And it appears that they let you off the hook because the event wasn't recent history.

    You said YMMV.

    You claim my description of possible events is hogwash, yet your experience doesn't seem to be at odds with it.
    A law-abiding citizen should be able to carry his personal protection firearm anywhere that an armed criminal might go.

    Member VCDL, NRA

  24. #24
    Regular Member Marco's Avatar
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    Arrow

    Quote Originally Posted by 2a4all View Post
    I said that "you could be charged". And it seems like you experienced the "very least" level of inquiry, and were asked (I never said how intensly) for a name. And it appears that they let you off the hook because the event wasn't recent history.

    You said YMMV.

    You claim my description of possible events is hogwash, yet your experience doesn't seem to be at odds with it.

    There was nothing for them to let me off with as I committed no crime.

    I experienced the least and you are Chicken little'ing(?) things.
    At least one of us has first hand experience as to what might happen.

    You "could" sell a used car to a convicted drunk driver or someone with a suspended/revoked license are you going to ask for a DMV printout? You "could" be charged as an Accomplice.

    I'll concede the point since you stated "could".
    As we all know anyone could be charged with anything..
    Last edited by Marco; 11-29-2011 at 11:36 AM.
    If you think like a Statist, act like one, or back some, you've given up on freedom and have gone over to the dark side.
    The easiest ex. but probably the most difficult to grasp for gun owners is that fool permission slip so many of you have, especially if you show it off with pride. You should recognize it as an embarrassment, an infringement, a travesty and an affront to a free person.


    ~Alan Korwin

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