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LEO and CCL????
- Thread starter oliverclotheshoff
- Start date
littlewolf
Regular Member
Thank You,Hope you get yours soon. Even though the law does not require you to tell LEO unless they ask and if you are carrying and have a license to do so,it is a good idea to inform them just in case some unforeseen circumstances occur and they find out on their own and end up shooting your dumb arse for being hard headed.
If you are not carrying why in the world would you provide that information ?
Brass Magnet
Founder's Club Member
You might change your mind the first time you or someone you know gets dragged out of a car at gun point for kindly giving up your rights by "informing" them.
Ever see some of the videos from the duty to inform states like Ohio? The one were the cop keeps telling a permit holder to shut up, keeping him from informing? When the guy finally gets a word in the cop tells him he should have just shot him and then proceeds to continually verbally abuse him. You should be able to google that video up.
Or how about the guy in Texas that gets physically and verbally abused?
There's a big problem with "duty to inform". We should be happy we didn't get that forced on us and I can't see why you'd want to volunteer it.
You're free to do as you wish but there's nothing dumb or hard headed about exercising your rights.
GlockRDH
Regular Member
I have 2 friends that are LEOs...one is a state patrol the other Columbia county deputy... the SP officer said that if he stops someone hed like for that person to let him know...the county deputy said that they havent had any formal training on what to do/not do...otherwise he said he doesnt care one way or the other as to seeing the CCL. He agreed with my statement to him, 'the bad guy isnt going to tell you if he has a gun anyway'....
Firearms Iinstuctor
Regular Member
I wouldn't inform unless I have to by law. Or for some reason my actions well expose my firearm IE reaching for drivers lic registration ect.
One should keep his documents away from his weapon, carry them so when accessing them you do not expose or reach near your weapon.
For exsample you would have a weapon in your glove box along with your registration and insurance and you have to dig them out. I would inform the officer that I am a lic CCW holder my registration is in my glove box and I have weapon in there also.
LEO's don't like surprizes
It wouldn't hurt to do a little role play acting with freinds to prepare yourself in case you get stopped for that traffic violation.
One should keep his documents away from his weapon, carry them so when accessing them you do not expose or reach near your weapon.
For exsample you would have a weapon in your glove box along with your registration and insurance and you have to dig them out. I would inform the officer that I am a lic CCW holder my registration is in my glove box and I have weapon in there also.
LEO's don't like surprizes
It wouldn't hurt to do a little role play acting with freinds to prepare yourself in case you get stopped for that traffic violation.
xmanhockey7
Regular Member
- Joined
- Jun 15, 2010
- Messages
- 1,195
Well looking at the fact they can lie to you why not just say, "I have nothing that is going to harm you." If they try to follow up simply say "I do not wish to discuss the contents in my vehicle."
dmworken
Regular Member
Every one of you have valid points what to and what not to say to a LEO. The bottom line is; be respectful and keep your cool. Every village, township, city, or state will vary in their tactics to get you to talk. Be professional even if the LEO may not be.
Captain Nemo
Regular Member
The words in the letter that accompanies the CCL license reads: "These documents must be displayed to a law enforcement officer upon request while the officer is acting in an official capacity and with lawful authority". As usual the DoJ weasle worded it to the benefit of law enforcement. Certainly an on dutry officer detaining us for a traffic stop is acting in official capacity and certainly he/she has the lawful authority to do so. Might be just as well to swallow our constitutional pride and display our CCL at the get go. After all we all did that when we submitted our CCL applications.
Unless you a driving and have no CCL. Then you have no steeeeekin permit to hand over. :lol:
I can't understand why a person who is armed would want to piss anyone off. If you are stopped, your knee jerk opinion of weather RAS exists is of no importance. The LEO is in charge, and you pressing the envelope will only result in him making your day really bad. The DOJ chose to call the sidearms we carry weapons, the word weapon carries with it a mind set meaning to antis that creates alarm. You're not giving up rights by offering comfort to what could be a bad situation. Caring enough about your rights requires some cooperation, stopping something from becoming a problem, could stop it from becoming a law. IMHO, boar out.
It was either in VA or WA where a judge ruled that just because someone is armed, doesn't mean he cannot get upset.
Brass Magnet
Founder's Club Member
Why should peaceably exercising your rights piss off an LEO? If it does, it's the LEO's problem and not mine. One doesn't need a "Knee Jerk opinion" about RAS but can have an educated one. Exercising your rights is not "pressing the envelope" an LEO violating them is and you plainly ARE giving up rights for comfort.
Like I said, you can do what you want but remember that exercising your rights will eventually make it easier on all of us even if it's inconvenient for you at the time. Heck, a twice arrested member of the Madison 5 could have just gave the nice ossifur his ID too and our cause would have never advanced as fast as it has.
Being new to the carry envirionment, I think this makes sense. Of course, I reserve the right to change my mind and not admit to it (I have a permit for that
, although it is not valid in the home - according to my wife).wild boar: I think your signature line kinda says the same thing as your post?.
I will not escalate a situation with a bad guy, or the police. Brass M you're entitled to do as you will, I will do the same. we all have a cross to burn, mine is not enforcement, or the Constitution. I know what my rights are, and I hold them dear; as far as the cause sir, i've fought too. boar out.
Captain Nemo
Regular Member
Yup Helorob wives are stronger than the constitution. They always have been. When I was younger there was a saying "The stronger sex is the weaker sex because of the weakness of the stronger sex for the weaker sex".
BROKENSPROKET
Regular Member
And this very attitude give a police state more power. Surrender your rights, then don't cry when you don't have any.
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Pretentious hard liners such...
...as depicted in your writings must have lived a life of oppression. I find no other reason for one to cling to a freedom they have never known. What drives such possessive anger that one forsakes their rights for a fleeting moment of defiance. What the hell is your age, where have you been, and what have you done for, and to your country? In 1973 I swore an oath to God, and Country to protect, and honor the Constitution, and to date I have, do, and will for ever fulfill this obligation. boar out.
...as depicted in your writings must have lived a life of oppression. I find no other reason for one to cling to a freedom they have never known. What drives such possessive anger that one forsakes their rights for a fleeting moment of defiance. What the hell is your age, where have you been, and what have you done for, and to your country? In 1973 I swore an oath to God, and Country to protect, and honor the Constitution, and to date I have, do, and will for ever fulfill this obligation. boar out.
hermannr
Regular Member
I don't know specifically about WI, but I have carried here in WA for over 40 years, and even though I do not get stopped very often, (Couple months ago was first time in 15 years) I have been stopped, but I have never been asked for my CPL, ever. Your WI milage may very until your local law enforcement gets used to the idea that they are not the only ones that can carry. Average citizens have been able to carry here in WA forever.
Here in WA: I do know that when an officer stops you and checks your DL on his computer, the screen comes back with your CPL, so every officer automatically knows I have a CPL when he checks my DL. Most of the time they now approach the vehicle from the right side (officer safety/traffic) at least on the two lane roads I frequent, and my carry is in full sight on my hip when they do that...(unless I have a jacket on)
As I said, NEVER, here in WA, in over 40 years, have I been asked for my CPL, ever. One encounter with MWAG call that I did actually talk to the Deputy, (Hunting? Yep) I was not even asked for ID. Also, you do not need a CPL to carry (CC or OC) a pistol for self protection when recreating, as in hunting, fishing, hiking etc.
Of course, I do dress like a farmer, and I live in an agricultural county back in the woods on the dry side...but I have never been asked even when I have been stopped on I5 on the wet/highly populated side of the state either.
Here in WA: I do know that when an officer stops you and checks your DL on his computer, the screen comes back with your CPL, so every officer automatically knows I have a CPL when he checks my DL. Most of the time they now approach the vehicle from the right side (officer safety/traffic) at least on the two lane roads I frequent, and my carry is in full sight on my hip when they do that...(unless I have a jacket on)
As I said, NEVER, here in WA, in over 40 years, have I been asked for my CPL, ever. One encounter with MWAG call that I did actually talk to the Deputy, (Hunting? Yep) I was not even asked for ID. Also, you do not need a CPL to carry (CC or OC) a pistol for self protection when recreating, as in hunting, fishing, hiking etc.
Of course, I do dress like a farmer, and I live in an agricultural county back in the woods on the dry side...but I have never been asked even when I have been stopped on I5 on the wet/highly populated side of the state either.
Hey! I resemble that ruling. (Where's the pointy index finger smiley?)
Getting back on topic -- from what I've read about your bew law it says the cop can ask for it and you have to show it to him. That's pretty much what the law says here - there might be a few different words but at the end of the day it works out pretty much the same. Some folks here pull the permit out and put t next to te DL because they figure the LEO is going to get a computer notification that the registration comes back to someone with a CHP. Others leave it in the wallet unless and until the LEO asks for it. What we have over you folks is history on both sides of the badge that the mere presence of the handgun (OC or CC) does not change the dynamic and demeanor of the encounter between LEO and driver/passenger.
There is nothing I am aware of that "proves" that showing the permit at the beginning of the encounter endangers the "right" or priviledge of carrying concealed, or that withholding it until specifically told (asked?) to display it protects it.
stay safe.