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Thread: Demanding ID on credit card purchases

  1. #1
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    Demanding ID on credit card purchases

    Can employers require the purchaser to display their identification upon making a purchase with a VISA/MASTERCARD credit card? I know many merchants are doing this, and some customers are being refused service for failing to comply. Some customers have mentioned that it's a violation of agreement between the creditor and merchant, and all that is required is the card itself, and the signature on the back.

    Anyone know any further info on this?

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    Regular Member Metalhead47's Avatar
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    Given the rampant fraud & identity theft nowadays, seems perfectly reasonable to me. It's not a GOVT requirement at all, it's private entities trying to protect their (and your) interests. It's probably buried in the Brazilian page card member agreements & addendums that no one ever bothers to read.


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    Not sure about employer and whomever transactions, but Im glad as heck when stores demand it.
    As someone who has been on the wrong-end of both credit/debit cards stolen and attempts made to use them, AND an Identity theft case a few yrs back...

    I actually get a bit annoyed when they DONT ask for my ID. When they dont, it means any ******* could have my card and be cleaning me out.

    Observed a case just the other day, in fact, in which some "urban" asshat was attempting to make a huge purchase at a store-in line in front of me. The clerk looked at the card, asked for the guy's ID. The moron who tried to use the card had the nerve to get irate about that, and tried making a big scene -to include the "race card" (interestingly, both clerk and "customer" were of the same race.. )

    The cashier just chuckled, and said, "look, dude, I KNOW your name isnt Shirley.....so..... )
    As an added bonus, our Darwin Awardee, lacking any grasp of SA, failed to note that the guy behind ME in the line was a cop lmao.. BUSTED on the spot.

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    Oh, I completely understand the reason for asking for identification. I have just been reading some documents stating it's a violation of the credit/merchant contract.

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    Regular Member Badger Johnson's Avatar
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    With signature filled in on the back (and even if not) there is no requirement to show ID. Unfortunately, some stores will be obstructionist and it might take you a couple days to sort it out.

    In general, asking for ID is a good thing. But of course a lot of women take their husband's CCs and go shopping. I doubt showing their ID will do anything to authenticate a card.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aaron1124 View Post
    Oh, I completely understand the reason for asking for identification. I have just been reading some documents stating it's a violation of the credit/merchant contract.
    That depends entirely on who's (which firm/co. etc) is processing the credit card transactions for the merchant.

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    This is a matter of the contract between the merchant and VISA, MC, etc.

    As I understand it, ID may NOT be required, with one exception: If the card is not signed, the merchant may be required to check ID and then require the card be signed in their presence. IIRC, if you refuse to sign the card, the merchant is to confiscate the card.

    This is a contractual matter and, apart from disputes arising from that contract, is not a matter for the law.

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    Regular Member Metalhead47's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Badger Johnson View Post

    In general, asking for ID is a good thing. But of course a lot of women take their husband's CCs and go shopping. I doubt showing their ID will do anything to authenticate a card.
    Why is this even necessary? It's the easiest thing in the world to add a second card in another's name to the existing account



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    Regular Member Steeler-gal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aaron1124 View Post
    Can employers require the purchaser to display their identification upon making a purchase with a VISA/MASTERCARD credit card?
    I believe merchants and vendors can require it. It's a safety measure to ensure that person using the card is the person the card was issued to? They're trying to protect you from theft and them from lawsuits. I don't know if this violates our agreements with VISA, MASTERCARD or the banks though.

    Quote Originally Posted by Badger Johnson View Post
    In general, asking for ID is a good thing. But of course a lot of women take their husband's CCs and go shopping. I doubt showing their ID will do anything to authenticate a card.
    Did we just travel back to 1950? Don't most women have their own cards now?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Steeler-gal View Post
    I believe merchants and vendors can require [the production of ID to use a credit card]...
    Not according to the agreement they voluntarily entered into with the credit card company.

    A co-worker of mine learned this when she tried to compare my military ID to my credit card. She may check my ID to verify that I am an authorized patron, but not to verify that the name on the credit card matches. Although I would rather that she could, we all must respect contracts lawfully entered into. It is the lack of respect for contracts that is at the root of many of our current financial woes in this country.

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    Regular Member Steeler-gal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    A co-worker of mine learned this when she tried to compare my military ID to my credit card. She may check my ID to verify that I am an authorized patron, but not to verify that the name on the credit card matches.
    How else would they verify that the person presenting the card is the same person whose name is the authorized patron if they don't ask to see your ID? Doesn't your Military ID and your credit card both have your name on them?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Steeler-gal View Post
    How else would they verify that the person presenting the card is the same person whose name is the authorized patron if they don't ask to see your ID? Doesn't your Military ID and your credit card both have your name on them?
    Checking the ID at the beginning of the transaction and taking the credit card at the end of the transaction are distinct steps. She made them the same step by holding both cards and comparing them--a clear violation of the agreement between the Exchange and the credit card company.

    The credit card company only expects cashiers to compare the signature on the card to the signature on the receipt. That's it. Since the credit card company is willing to take the hit for fraud and since both the merchant and the card-holder have agreed to this, then they should live by the agreement.

    I would rather that the card-holder retain the option of requiring positive ID before his card is accepted, but no one offers that option. Heck, I'd like my photo to be emblazoned big and bold on the front of the card and that merchants be required to match that photo with me before accepting the card for payment. Maybe someone will see this business opportunity and offer such a product.

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    Regular Member Steeler-gal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    I would rather that the card-holder retain the option of requiring positive ID before his card is accepted, but no one offers that option. Heck, I'd like my photo to be emblazoned big and bold on the front of the card and that merchants be required to match that photo with me before accepting the card for payment. Maybe someone will see this business opportunity and offer such a product.
    I see what you're saying. Isn't there a card that offers that as an option now? Thought I saw commerecials for that but may be they stopped.

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    Regular Member Redbaron007's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    ....[snip] Heck, I'd like my photo to be emblazoned big and bold on the front of the card and that merchants be required to match that photo with me before accepting the card for payment. Maybe someone will see this business opportunity and offer such a product.
    Bank of America does this for soome of their accounts. Since I have done this, I have had no one ask for my ID. It's an ugly mug shot too!!

    Although the CC companies not require it, a business can ask for your ID at any time for any reason. You are not required to provide it to them, but then they have the option of not doing business with you either.

    Remember hand written checks!? How many times were you asked for your DL so they could write down info. The banks didn't require this. If you didn't present it, they didn't do business with you by not accepting your check. Same simple process applies here.The CC companies don't require it or condone it. A store could ask for your ID if you paid by cash, if they wanted to.
    Last edited by Redbaron007; 12-01-2011 at 04:32 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Redbaron007 View Post
    ...Same simple process applies here.The CC companies don't require it or condone it. A store could ask for your ID if you paid by cash, if they wanted to.
    But it does not apply to credit card purchases. The merchants have specifically agreed not to check ID when customers use the card. If they check ID, they are in blatant violation of the terms of the contract. Banks have not specifically disallowed the checking of ID for cashing checks. No one disallows the checking of ID for cash transactions; it's just pointless. But the credit card companies specifically disallow merchants from checking IDs when customers present the credit card. So it is not the same simple process.


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    Regular Member Metalhead47's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    But it does not apply to credit card purchases. The merchants have specifically agreed not to check ID when customers use the card. If they check ID, they are in blatant violation of the terms of the contract. Banks have not specifically disallowed the checking of ID for cashing checks. No one disallows the checking of ID for cash transactions; it's just pointless. But the credit card companies specifically disallow merchants from checking IDs when customers present the credit card. So it is not the same simple process.


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    Anyone got a cite for this policy?
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    Technically, the merchant is only "supposed" to check to make sure the signatures match, or if the card is not signed, to match up the names.

    Many people write "see ID" on the back in the hopes that the merchant will ALWAYS ask for an ID, in case the card is lost or stolen. My husband has this on his, and an ID is still only asked for about 40% of the time.

    I do sometimes use my "husband's" debit card (we don't use credit cards at all), not because i'm spending "his" money, but because we share a bank account, and for some reason, our bank refuses to issue a card with my name on it (makes no sense because it's a joint account with both names on the statements and the checks, but whatever; it's something i need to look into simply because it's a inconvenient). Usually when they ask, i show my own ID, and sign the slip with my first initial (it's the same as his middle initial) and our shared last name, because i figure i have less to explain that way. 90% of the time it's no problem; they either don't notice, don't care, or figure we're married and share a card, no big deal. But occasionally they won't take it without his signature, so i'll either write a check, or simply take my business elsewhere if they won't accept them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Metalhead47 View Post
    Anyone got a cite for this policy?
    It's been posted on this site a few times before. As a matter of fact, this is the site on which I learned of this policy. On the Internet, you can look for the merchant agreements for Visa and MC. Mike has talked about enough that he probably knows the links.

    If I have a few minutes, I'll poke around for them.


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  19. #19
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    State Merchant Laws, what merchants can and cannot do when you pay by credit card

    https://www.privacyrights.org/fs/fs15plus.htm

    California Civil Code § 1747.08. Requiring identification information as condition of acceptance
    http://law.onecle.com/california/civil/1747.08.html

    Wis. Stat. § 423.401. Credit card identification information http://www.legis.state.wi.us/statutes/Stat0423.pdf

    Too bad Alabama is not on this list.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Steeler-gal View Post
    How else would they verify that the person presenting the card is the same person whose name is the authorized patron if they don't ask to see your ID? Doesn't your Military ID and your credit card both have your name on them?
    You do realize that you can get a credit card in any name you want, right?
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  21. #21
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    What Personal Information Should You Give to Merchants? Paying by Credit Card

    https://www.privacyrights.org/fs/fs15-mt.htm#2b

    5.8.4 Additional Cardholder Identification

    A Merchant must not refuse to complete a Transaction solely because a Cardholder who has complied with the conditions for presentment of a Card at the POI refuses to provide additional identification information, except as specifically permitted or required by the Standards. A Merchant may require additional identification from the Cardholder if the information is required to complete the Transaction, such as for shipping purposes. A Merchant in a country or region that supports use of the MasterCard Address Verification Service (AVS) may require the Cardholder’s ZIP or postal code to complete a Cardholder-Activated Terminal (CAT) Transaction, or the Cardholder’s address and ZIP or postal code to complete a mail order, phone order, or e-commerce Transaction. http://www.mastercard.com/global/mer...rCardRules.pdf.

    MasterCard has an online form for reporting merchant violations of this rule. Go to http://www.mastercard.com/us/persona...iolations.html and check the box: “The merchant/retailer required identification.”

    The Visa International Operating Regulations provide as follows:

    Supplemental Identification - U.S. Region

    A U.S. Acquirer must not, as a regular practice, require a Merchant, and a Merchant must not require a Cardholder, to provide any supplementary Cardholder information as a condition for honoring a Visa Card or Visa Electron Card, unless it is required or permitted elsewhere in the U.S. Regional Operating Regulations. Such supplementary Cardholder information includes, but is not limited to:

    • Social Security Number (or any part thereof)

    • Fingerprint

    • Home or business address or telephone number

    • Driver's license number

    • Photocopy of a driver's license

    • Photocopy of the Visa Card or Visa Electron Card

    • Other credit cards

    http://usa.visa.com/download/merchan...tions-main.pdf (pg. 468)

    Unfortunately, the MasterCard Rules and Visa Operating Regulations are often ignored by retailers. If you feel strongly about not showing identification as a condition of using your Visa or MasterCard credit card, you may wish to print out a copy of the relevant merchant rule (from the pdf links cited above) and ask to speak to a store manager.

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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    The credit card company only expects cashiers to compare the signature on the card to the signature on the receipt. That's it. Since the credit card company is willing to take the hit for fraud and since both the merchant and the card-holder have agreed to this, then they should live by the agreement.
    That's not true either. The company only expects the cashier to check that the card is signed. If signed, it means the signer has presumably agreed to all terms and conditions of the credit card. The signature isn't a security measure - it's the last step of a contract.

    I would rather that the card-holder retain the option of requiring positive ID before his card is accepted, but no one offers that option. Heck, I'd like my photo to be emblazoned big and bold on the front of the card and that merchants be required to match that photo with me before accepting the card for payment. Maybe someone will see this business opportunity and offer such a product.
    I'm pretty sure the photo thing exists. E.g. Bank of America's allows for a photo credit card.
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    Regular Member VW_Factor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aaron1124 View Post
    it's a violation of agreement between the creditor and merchant, and all that is required is the card itself, and the signature on the back.

    Anyone know any further info on this?
    This is correct. The merchant agreements with Visa, Mastercard, and Discover (I don't know about Amex, we don't deal with them) clearly outline that asking for ID is a violation of terms for the merchant.

    You know why card companies tell people to not put CID or some such on the card. Its because of the merchant agreement.

    Knowing this, if I get carded for beer or what not. Meh. Whatever.. If I am not purchasing something that requires ID, and they ask for ID for the card purchase, I'll leave.
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    That Alabama does not have a law dictating the behavior of people participating in a private transaction is a good thing...if Liberty is important to you.

    Again, it never ceases to amaze me how some folks WANT government interference in their lives and business in ways not designed solely to protect your life, Liberty, and property from the nefarious actions of others.

    The purpose of government is not to get you what you want, to make things run smoothly, to protect one from his own idiocy, to stop others from doing things one does not want them to do, to make the trains run on time, or any of the like. The purpose of government is to protect us from others, from within and without, who would interfere with our ability to enjoy our lives, Liberty, and property. One would think that, on a pro-2A site, this would be the prevailing view of the purpose of government. It seems that it isn't.


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  25. #25
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    Report merchants demanding ID to use credit cards!

    http://www.mastercard.us/support/mer...iolations.html

    Just report them here, even if you were going ot use a non-MS credit card.

    And if the merchant refuses to take your card on your signature, then refuse the sale after you take up a bunch of their time - the look is often priceless and well worth your time!

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