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doj working to meet 45 day requirement

H

Herr Heckler Koch

Guest
Wisconsin is not a Right-To-Work state

That many people, and only cranking out like 500 to 600 a day.
So, what'ya think, union goons dragging their feet, maliciously compliant, or overburdened civil servants cruelly denied overtime needed to finish on time?
 

MKEgal

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 8, 2010
Messages
4,383
Location
in front of my computer, WI
Heck, I'd drive over to Madistan 3 days a week to process applications if they'd
a) pay me
b) let me do a 10 or 12 hour day so the drive is worth it.
 

safcrkr

Regular Member
Joined
May 16, 2009
Messages
318
Location
Vilas County, WI, ,
Heck, I'd drive over to Madistan 3 days a week to process applications if they'd
a) pay me
b) let me do a 10 or 12 hour day so the drive is worth it.


pssssst.... <whisper> I'll give you $100 if you can find mine and get it done ASAP. I mailed on the 1st, so look at the bottom of the pile. <whisper/> :)
 
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ccwinstructor

Centurion
Joined
Jul 11, 2008
Messages
919
Location
Yuma, Arizona, USA
500-600 a day only if you assume they are working 7 days a week.

That many people, and only cranking out like 500 to 600 a day.

If you assume that they are only working weekdays and not holidays, it comes out to 940 a day. I figured that they did not start to recieve the mass of permits until the third of November, so that is 17 work days including the 28th. We had permits numbered in the 16,000 issued on the 28th of November. If they are working 8 hour days and have an average of thirty people working those 8 hours, it comes to just a hair less than 4 permits per hour.

They have about 18000 permits to go for the first couple of days. At 4 permits per person per hour, that is 4,500 manhours of work. Say 30 people, that is 150 hours per person. The DOJ had 20 days (29 November to 17 December, including weekends to meet the deadline. Each person would have to be putting in 8 hour days, 7 days a week to meet it.

It is possible that they have been putting in overtime and weekends on this already. Does anyone know?
 
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markush

Regular Member
Joined
May 19, 2011
Messages
172
Location
Kenosha
600 a day average (that's what i get) or 940 (your figure) for every work day still works out to an average of 600 a day since the 1st of Nov. There's different ways of getting to the same final number...be it one person doing 600 a day or 60 people doing 10 a day it's all the same to me. In the end all I care about is how long it takes them to get to the 30,000 permits issued area. That's where I figure mine will be.
 
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H

Herr Heckler Koch

Guest
Fourty-five days expires on Monday, 19 December for some

I have my USPS delivery certification receipt in hand. Tomorrow I will pay the fee for a copy of my personal check for the CWL application fee.

Will there be a administrative rule in place for 2011 Act 35 Section 100. Nonstatutory provisions Subsection (2) Notwithstanding section 175.60 (9) (b) of the statutes, as created by this act, beginning on the effective date of this subsection and ending on the first day of the 5th month beginning after the effective date of this subsection, the department of justice shall, as soon as practicable and without delay, but no longer than 45 days, after receiving a complete application under section 175.60 (7) of the statutes, as created by this act, for a license to carry a concealed weapon, do one of the following: (a) Issue the license and promptly send the licensee his or her license document by 1st class mail.
 

wiscollector

Banned
Joined
Nov 19, 2010
Messages
62
Location
Wisconsin
"Fourty-five days expires on Monday, 19 December for some"

Not really..............

45 days would be around Dec 16th depending on how you look at it.

All of the apps hand delivered on the 1st have been completed and issued. So that leaves apps that were received on the 2nd and later.

So as of close of business on the 16th, the DOJ has the great possibility to go late on an app.

The clock window would start when the app was received by DOJ and end when DOJ gives it to the post office. The post office to you time would not count.

In my opinion apps received on Nov 1st thru Nov 4th will make the 45 day.

Apps received on Nov 5th and later could most likely miss the 45 days.

My wife's app was received on Nov 3rd and she still has not received it.
 
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safcrkr

Regular Member
Joined
May 16, 2009
Messages
318
Location
Vilas County, WI, ,
It is possible that they have been putting in overtime and weekends on this already. Does anyone know?



They've worked every single day since No. 1st, except Thanksgiving day. Every saturday, every sunday. As to overtime on those days, that hasn't been mentioned, but the DOJ spokesperson said there's been no "days off" except 11/24. They did work Veterans Day, because people have posted about licenses with issue dates of 11/11/11, just as there's been postings for issue dates for every sat & sun.

Even though I've been one of DOJ's biggest critics, I have to give credit where credit is due. They are trying, and I've never criticized the workers using the system they were given, nor see any reason to in the future. My beef all along has been with the organization (or lack of) with the system in place to see that they're processed in order received... which would benefit DOJ too, in meeting the deadlines. It's difficult to meet a deadline if you don't deal with the "oldest" first.
 
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safcrkr

Regular Member
Joined
May 16, 2009
Messages
318
Location
Vilas County, WI, ,
"Fourty-five days expires on Monday, 19 December for some"

Not really..............

45 days would be around Dec 16th depending on how you look at it.

All of the apps hand delivered on the 1st have been completed and issued. So that leaves apps that were received on the 2nd and later.

So as of close of business on the 16th, the DOJ has the great possibility to go late on an app.

The clock window would start when the app was received by DOJ and end when DOJ gives it to the post office. The post office to you time would not count.

In my opinion apps received on Nov 1st thru Nov 4th will make the 45 day.

Apps received on Nov 5th and later could most likely miss the 45 days.

My wife's app was received on Nov 3rd and she still has not received it.

I would say it's safe to assume it was in DOJ's hands no later than 2 delivery days (no sundays, holidays) after it was picked up at the mailbox where it was mailed. In many cases, it was probaly there the next day, but that's not a certainty.... depends on how far you are from Madison. So if you mailed on the 1st, your deadline is "likely" the 16th or 17th of Dec. Add 46 or 47 days to the day you mailed (if mailed before last daily pick-up at your P.O.), and that'd be your deadline for issuance or denial (doesn't mean it will be 'returned' to you in 47 days... add a few more for return mailing).

edit to add: Because the law does have the deadlines in it, which specifies "X" number of days "from day received", DOJ is required by the law to accurately keep track of all "days received".
 
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wiscollector

Banned
Joined
Nov 19, 2010
Messages
62
Location
Wisconsin
Persons not using a form of delivery confirm or a means of positive receipt dont have much of a leg to stand on when counting their days.

If you dont have a receipt, DOJ could and can claim that the 45 days starts when your check was deposited in their bank.

Yes we all know thats bull.....BUT without a receipt, it would be hard to prove otherwise.

Unless of course your app is stamped by DOJ at some point. Even then your app could be stamped days later than it was actually received.

If you have a receipt, you are gold and nothing DOJ says will over ride it.

If your USPS receipt is 3 days prior to a DOJ stamp, then DOJ cant use their stamp date as the 45 start date.
 
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davegran

Regular Member
Joined
May 1, 2009
Messages
1,563
Location
Cassville Area -Twelve Miles From Anything, Wiscon
For those of us who don't have 45 fingers and toes to count on, here is how the 45 day period works out:
Date
45
Recvd
Days
1-Nov16-Dec
2-Nov17-Dec
3-Nov18-Dec
4-Nov19-Dec
5-Nov20-Dec
6-Nov21-Dec
7-Nov22-Dec
8-Nov23-Dec
9-Nov24-Dec
10-Nov25-Dec
11-Nov26-Dec
12-Nov27-Dec
13-Nov28-Dec
14-Nov29-Dec
15-Nov30-Dec
16-Nov31-Dec
17-Nov1-Jan
18-Nov2-Jan
19-Nov3-Jan
20-Nov4-Jan
21-Nov5-Jan
22-Nov6-Jan
23-Nov7-Jan
24-Nov8-Jan
25-Nov9-Jan
26-Nov10-Jan
27-Nov11-Jan
28-Nov12-Jan
29-Nov13-Jan
30-Nov14-Jan
1-Dec15-Jan
 

ccwinstructor

Centurion
Joined
Jul 11, 2008
Messages
919
Location
Yuma, Arizona, USA
They are working hard, We should give the workers some credit.

They've worked every single day since No. 1st, except Thanksgiving day. Every saturday, every sunday. As to overtime on those days, that hasn't been mentioned, but the DOJ spokesperson said there's been no "days off" except 11/24. They did work Veterans Day, because people have posted about licenses with issue dates of 11/11/11, just as there's been postings for issue dates for every sat & sun.

Even though I've been one of DOJ's biggest critics, I have to give credit where credit is due. They are trying, and I've never criticized the workers using the system they were given, nor see any reason to in the future. My beef all along has been with the organization (or lack of) with the system in place to see that they're processed in order received... which would benefit DOJ too, in meeting the deadlines. It's difficult to meet a deadline if you don't deal with the "oldest" first.

I say we give them some credit. It looks like they will get about 75-80 percent of the big influx done within the 45 day limit. I doubt that they will be past a week late on any application.

It is better to have good relations with the people who are doing the work, than not.
 

ccwinstructor

Centurion
Joined
Jul 11, 2008
Messages
919
Location
Yuma, Arizona, USA
From Safcrkr, you are correct.

600 a day average (that's what i get) or 940 (your figure) for every work day still works out to an average of 600 a day since the 1st of Nov. There's different ways of getting to the same final number...be it one person doing 600 a day or 60 people doing 10 a day it's all the same to me. In the end all I care about is how long it takes them to get to the 30,000 permits issued area. That's where I figure mine will be.

I figure they will get 30,000 processed before Christmas.
 
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