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Thread: Black college student hangs Confederate Flag in his dorm room

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    Regular Member MilProGuy's Avatar
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    Black college student hangs Confederate Flag in his dorm room

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    That's something ya don't see every day.
    Don't believe any facts that I say! This is the internet and it is filled with lies and untruth. I invite you to look up for yourself the basic facts that my arguments might be based upon. This way we can have a discussion where logic and hints on where to find information are what is brought to the forum and people look up and verify facts for themselves.

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    Regular Member MilProGuy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daylen View Post
    That's something ya don't see every day.
    That's true!

    I was impressed by this statement in the article about the young man:

    "Thomas, who says he prefers to be called black rather than African-American, adds that he believes the Confederate flag is a sign of Southern pride, and not racism."


    Last edited by MilProGuy; 12-04-2011 at 11:48 PM. Reason: edited for greater clarity
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    Founder's Club Member thebigsd's Avatar
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    Now, if a white kid put one up and had the same reasoning, I wonder if the story would end the same way?
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    Regular Member zoom6zoom's Avatar
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    I have a friend who was born in South Africa, and later emigrated here and became an American citizen. Now, he's one who can put "African American" on his documents and really be correct.

    Screws with people's minds when they find out he's white.

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    Regular Member SFCRetired's Avatar
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    Good for him!!

    Many years ago, I had a young soldier put up a Confederate flag in his room. All the blacks were up in arms and demanding it be taken down. As Platoon Sergeant, I told them that I'd get him to take it down, but all the flags they had up would have to come down also. Never heard another word.

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    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by SFCRetired View Post
    Good for him!!

    Many years ago, I had a young soldier put up a Confederate flag in his room. All the blacks were up in arms and demanding it be taken down. As Platoon Sergeant, I told them that I'd get him to take it down, but all the flags they had up would have to come down also. Never heard another word.
    Aye! The mark of a wise and fair Platoon Sergeant!
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    Quote Originally Posted by MilProGuy View Post
    That's true!

    I was impressed by this statement in the article about the young man:

    "Thomas, who says he prefers to be called black rather than African-American, adds that he believes the Confederate flag is a sign of Southern pride, and not racism."


    Then he's an idiot, because the "rebel" flag was never used by the confederacy.
    "If we were to ever consider citizenship as the least bit matter of merit instead of birthright, imagine who should be selected as deserved representation of our democracy: someone who would risk their daily livelihood to cast an individually statistically insignificant vote, or those who wrap themselves in the flag against slightest slights." - agenthex

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    Regular Member Jack House's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zoom6zoom View Post
    Screws with people's minds when they find out he's white.
    Most South Africans are white, wonder how many here knew that. Most people in general do not. At least of those I have spoken to on the subject.


    Posted using my HTC Evo

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    Campaign Veteran since9's Avatar
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    After sticking up for my black friends from first grade (William) through graduation from high school and well beyond..

    It's about damned time.

    As for the guy sticking up for the C-flag, I'm not sure I agree with him, but I do applaude him. I hope from a distance.
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    Regular Member Jack House's Avatar
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    Guess I'm wrong then!

    Need an egg on face emote.

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    I agree with him that the flag is not a sign of racism, but southern heritage. I used to live in north Carolina, and it was not unusual to see whites and blacks with rebel flags on their vehicles, or on their shirts. Good for him.

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    Regular Member Deanimator's Avatar
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    I question the point of displaying a symbol of not just despicable values, but an utterly failed attempt to uphold those values.

    But ff he wants to display a symbol of ignominious defeat, well I guess that's his 1st Amendment right.

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    Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter Venator's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tawnos View Post
    Then he's an idiot, because the "rebel" flag was never used by the confederacy.
    Not a flag for the nation, but adopted as a battle flag for some units including the Army of Northern Virginia. The battle flag was used in the canton of the Stainless Flag (Last style flag used by the CSA).
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    Quote Originally Posted by zoom6zoom View Post
    I have a friend who was born in South Africa, and later emigrated here and became an American citizen. Now, he's one who can put "African American" on his documents and really be correct.

    Screws with people's minds when they find out he's white.
    I know someone very similar. Buddy of mine married a local woman (they are both caucasian) while he was temporarily living in South Africa. They had their first kid there, before coming back to the U.S. The kid gets into high school here and it seems some of the students wanted to start an "African-Americans" club. My friend's son shows up to the first organizational meeting and this ends up starting a minor brouhaha.

    'You can't join this club, you're whi...' and the like. My friend and his wife (somewhat amusedly) backed up their son's play all the way to a meeting with the school board.

    Bottom line the school board just torpedoed the whole club idea, they were gonna get hosed one way or another if they let it go forward.

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    Regular Member SFCRetired's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deanimator View Post
    I question the point of displaying a symbol of not just despicable values, but an utterly failed attempt to uphold those values.

    But ff he wants to display a symbol of ignominious defeat, well I guess that's his 1st Amendment right.
    Please read your history. The War was much more about States' Rights than it was about slavery. You've heard of the Lincoln-Douglas debates, have you not? Would you care to hazard a guess as to which of the two argued in favor of slavery?

    The greatest stain on the honor of the Confederate military was Andersonville. But no one remarks on the stain put on the Northern military by Rock Island prison. Not to mention the excesses of the butcher, Sherman, and his armed mob.

    Ignominious defeat? The legend has it that when Lincoln heard that Lee had surrendered, he ordered the band to play "Dixie" as a tribute to a valiant and honorable foe. The South retained its honor. What the North did during the war and afterward not only left a vile taste in the mouths of the Southerners, but stained whatever honor the North had indelibly.

    We still see the evidence of that stain today.

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    Regular Member SouthernBoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack House View Post
    Most South Africans are white, wonder how many here knew that. Most people in general do not. At least of those I have spoken to on the subject.


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    True.

    I have only know three African-Americans in my life... and one was white. I currently don't know any African-Americans.

    Quite simply, if you have to qualify your citizenship with a hyphen, you're not an American.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SFCRetired View Post
    Please read your history. The War was much more about States' Rights than it was about slavery. You've heard of the Lincoln-Douglas debates, have you not? Would you care to hazard a guess as to which of the two argued in favor of slavery?
    Yet if you read the constitution of the confederacy, it turns the notion that it was about states rights on its head. The CSA didn't bother eliminating what are presumably the most egregious parts of the federal power over the states. However, they did manage to codify slavery into the highest law of the land.

    Such a bullshiat claim that the CSA was for the states and not for slavery.

    Edit: Also, you're just plain wrong about the LD debates. Source and quote follow:
    http://www.mrlincolnandfreedom.org/i...22&subjectID=2
    I think, and shall try to show, that is wrong, wrong in its direct effect, letting slavery into Kansas, and Nebraska — and wrong in its prospective principle, allowing it to spread to every other part of the wide world, where men can be found inclined to take it.

    This declared difference, but as I must think, cover real zeal for the spread of slavery, I can not but hate. I hate it because of the monstrous injustice of slavery itself. I hate it because it deprives our republican example of its just influence in the world — enables the enemies of free institutions, with plausibility, to taunt us as hypocrites — causes the real friends of freedom to doubt our sincerity, and especially because it forces so many really good men amongst ourselves into an open war with the very fundamental principles of civil liberty — criticising the Declaration of Independence, and insisting that there is no right principle of action but self-interest.
    Last edited by Tawnos; 12-05-2011 at 05:06 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Venator View Post
    Not a flag for the nation, but adopted as a battle flag for some units including the Army of Northern Virginia. The battle flag was used in the canton of the Stainless Flag (Last style flag used by the CSA).
    The rebel flag wasn't a battle flag, either. The battle flag was square, not rectangular. What is commonly flown as "the confederate flag" is most close to the second confederate navy jack. However, it was _never_ the "confederate" flag. If people are going to say "heritage not hate", they'd better damned well know the heritage, and it's certainly not in flying a sign that was never officially what they claim to represent, and most certainly represents the fighting more than anything else.
    "If we were to ever consider citizenship as the least bit matter of merit instead of birthright, imagine who should be selected as deserved representation of our democracy: someone who would risk their daily livelihood to cast an individually statistically insignificant vote, or those who wrap themselves in the flag against slightest slights." - agenthex

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    Regular Member Ironbar's Avatar
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    This reminds me of Dave Chappell's Black White Supremacist Sketch! LOL!

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    It's not terribly uncommon in the South, but I'm sure it's more of a shocker on a college campus.

    Quote Originally Posted by thebigsd View Post
    Now, if a white kid put one up and had the same reasoning, I wonder if the story would end the same way?
    That was my first thought as well; I suspect we know the answer.


    Quote Originally Posted by zoom6zoom View Post
    I have a friend who was born in South Africa, and later emigrated here and became an American citizen. Now, he's one who can put "African American" on his documents and really be correct.

    Screws with people's minds when they find out he's white.
    I made the acquaintance of a fellow in his late 20s, born in South Africa but now a naturalized American citizen, who tried the same thing. Turns out that the Census, U.S. Department of Education, and any other "official" government racial classification disagrees.

    From the 2010 Census: "'Black or African American' refers to a person having origins in any of the Black racial groups of Africa. It includes people who indicated their race(s) as 'Black, African Am., or African American' or reported entries such as African American, Kenyan, Nigerian, or Haitian."

    Afrikaaners can't officially be African-American.

    The funniest PC brain twist I've ever seen was a few years ago, on a news report about a group of American students making a human aid trip to Africa. They could not grasp the concept of white Africans, and kept trying to distinguish the "African-American Africans" --in Africa!-- from the "white Africans".
    Last edited by KBCraig; 12-05-2011 at 07:23 PM.

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    Regular Member MilProGuy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SFCRetired View Post
    Please read your history. The War was much more about States' Rights than it was about slavery. You've heard of the Lincoln-Douglas debates, have you not? Would you care to hazard a guess as to which of the two argued in favor of slavery?

    The greatest stain on the honor of the Confederate military was Andersonville. But no one remarks on the stain put on the Northern military by Rock Island prison. Not to mention the excesses of the butcher, Sherman, and his armed mob.

    Ignominious defeat? The legend has it that when Lincoln heard that Lee had surrendered, he ordered the band to play "Dixie" as a tribute to a valiant and honorable foe. The South retained its honor. What the North did during the war and afterward not only left a vile taste in the mouths of the Southerners, but stained whatever honor the North had indelibly.

    We still see the evidence of that stain today.
    Yes, the stain is still there.

    Thank you, sir, for sharing a thoughtful and historically-correct post.
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    *poof*

    Late to the party, as usual.
    Last edited by Brimstone Baritone; 12-06-2011 at 03:33 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Deanimator View Post
    I question the point of displaying a symbol of not just despicable values...
    Well, that's just it. It's a symbol of despicable values only to those who misunderstand the symbol. Both sides agree that certain values are despicable. The difference is not which values are despicable, but the values the two camps ascribe to the symbol.

    That's a common problem with symbols. Last year we had a gent here who myopically held a certain widely-heralded symbol as despicable, thereby ruining a truly wonderful event, simply because one of his arch-enemies embraced the symbol. To him, because an enemy embraced the symbol, that meant the symbol was bad. Never mind thousands of others around the world, also enemies of his enemy, embraced the symbol as well. Not only was he unable to see past the nose on his face, but he rather pathologically set out to destroy an good event for us all.

    The symbol isn't the problem. The problem lies in both the meaning which we ascribe to the symbols, as well as level of idiocy to which we're willing to stoop to eradicate the symbol while ignoring the underlying issues.

    Although I grew up in the South, I never ascribed to a reverence for the Confederate flag. Nevertheless, I've know well those who do, and none have been supportive of restoring practices like slavery.

    As my brother used to say, chill.
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  25. #25
    Regular Member DangerClose's Avatar
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    Damn right it's about pride and not racism. Watch them Duke Boys make that jump! Yeeeeee-hawwwwwww


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