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Thread: There is always an exception to the rule

  1. #1
    Regular Member jt59's Avatar
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    There is always an exception to the rule

    Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the grey twilight that knows not victory nor defeat....Teddy Roosevelt

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    Regular Member ghosthunter's Avatar
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    For me there is no issue of self defense.
    The young men were invited in by the daughter who lives there.
    The young men did not threaten or attack the father.

    I would have ordered them out and told them not to come back.
    Than I would have communicated with my daughter in private.
    No reason to draw or threaten to shoot because there was no attack or reason to think there would be.

    Little different if you come home and hear your daughter screaming and being attacked.
    Not the case it seems here.

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    The father claims to have slapped his daughter's arm, but then why does the article say her face was red and swollen?

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    Regular Member skiingislife725's Avatar
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    +1 Ghosthunter. A "Get the hell out of my house." and a talk with my daughter would have sufficed if it was the first time. The assaulting of the two boys, threatening them with a firearm, holding them hostage for extended lengths of time, and beating my daughter I could do without.

  5. #5
    Opt-Out Members BigDave's Avatar
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    This story is full of distorted truths or just plain lies, likely from all parties involved.

    The Father was not arrested, I see this being odd when a conflict involving firearms to a domestic violence charge for hitting his daughter in the face which was reddened and swollen! Correct me if I am wrong here but in Washington State an arrest would be required with evidence of violence.

    How about the accusation of the Father refusing to let the teens to leave for up to 2 hours? Kidnapping Maybe?

    The issue of the Father said after one of the teens came out of the bathroom yelling at him and then he remembered or noticed he had his firearm on his hip so he went to his bedroom to put it away! Really after finding 3 male teens in his home he did not expect to be there and one yelling at him.

    What a mess.

    One thing for sure, there is likely 3 young boys that will think twice before going into another girls home if the parents are not there!
    • Being prepared is to prepare, this is our responsibility.
    • I am not your Mommy or Daddy and do not sugar coat it but I will tell you simply as how I see it, it is up to you on how you will or will not use it.
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    Regular Member Metalhead47's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigDave View Post
    This story is full of distorted truths or just plain lies, likely from all parties involved.

    The Father was not arrested, I see this being odd when a conflict involving firearms to a domestic violence charge for hitting his daughter in the face which was reddened and swollen! Correct me if I am wrong here but in Washington State an arrest would be required with evidence of violence.

    How about the accusation of the Father refusing to let the teens to leave for up to 2 hours? Kidnapping Maybe?

    The issue of the Father said after one of the teens came out of the bathroom yelling at him and then he remembered or noticed he had his firearm on his hip so he went to his bedroom to put it away! Really after finding 3 male teens in his home he did not expect to be there and one yelling at him.

    What a mess.

    One thing for sure, there is likely 3 young boys that will think twice before going into another girls home if the parents are not there!
    This. Sounds like loads of BS all the way around.

    What ever happened to the traditional "invite the boyfriend over for the ol' 'fear o' God' talk while cleaning ALL your guns" bit?
    It is very wise to not take a watermelon lightly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PistolPackingMomma View Post
    The father claims to have slapped his daughter's arm, but then why does the article say her face was red and swollen?
    The article doesn't claim her face was red and swollen but that one of the kids said that her face was red and swollen. The girl herself told investigators that her father didn't hit her or point the gun and the boys. I think the boys were lying because they were caught with their peckers in their hands and are trying to redirect the cops attention.

    I think a lot of people are only reading the first half of the article and jumping to conclusions. Please read the whole article and you'll see that there are some conflicting info.
    Last edited by sirpuma; 12-18-2011 at 02:28 PM.

  8. #8
    Regular Member MadHatter66's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigDave View Post
    Correct me if I am wrong here but in Washington State an arrest would be required with evidence of violence.
    Correct, evidence of domestic assault is a mandatory arrest in WA. Also, generally speaking LE will also remove the firearms in the residence. Not that I agree with that or not, but generally they will.


    I think there is a whole lot more to this story though.........

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    Regular Member SovereignAxe's Avatar
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    There's obviously a WHOLE lot more to the story and if all three stories are different, then at least two of them are lying. Which two is anyone's guess. I'm sure the daughter is lying to protect her dad, and to protect herself FROM her dad if the boys' story is true.

    But keeping a couple of naked teens at your house by force is AWFULLY strange behavior, so I'm betting the dad's story is less than truthful.
    "Anyone worth shooting once is worth shooting twice." -Zeus

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  10. #10
    Regular Member hermannr's Avatar
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    The dad is in a bad position here, with the two boy's against him. If the daughter sides with the boys, he's in a deep hurt. Personally sounds like the boys are making up a story. If I was on a jury of this insidence I would have a hard time believing the boys.

    I had a some what simular situation, boyfriend was coming in a window though...had no idea who he was, when he was half way into the house I stuck my 12 ga shotgun to his head and asked him what he thought he was doing. Our wild child started screaming, don't shoot him dad...well I didn't shoot him...I sent him home to clean out his panties and told him, if he wanted to enter the house, use the door or he might not survive.

    Difference? One boy, obviously entering the house in an "uninvited" manner. If I had shot, he would have neen half in and half out of the house. (oh yes, our daughter had invited him, but not to my knowledge so that was irrelivant) and no-one was their to lie for him.

    Unfortunately, this guy will have to lawyer up. You know if the daughter had been beaten up, the police would have taken photographs of it. Too bad he has to go through the process.

  11. #11
    Opt-Out Members BigDave's Avatar
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    If we take the fathers position or word on what occurred and charges are filed then through this process the truth does not always come out and many plea to a lesser charge as they are made to believe worse things could happen if you don't take the deal and plead out and in that is an injustice.

    Something to ponder here as well, who has the most to gain by lying here? The Boys? The Daughter? or the Father.
    The Daughter likely knew the Father did not want these or boys in the home with out him there, The boys knew likely they were doing something the Father did not approve of like hiding in the bathtub naked

    How will the courts look at a juvenile given permission for others to be in their home against her Fathers wishes, were they legally there or not?

    Lets not forget that it is lawful to display your firearm in your place of abode.

    RCW 9.41.270
    Weapons apparently capable of producing bodily harm Unlawful carrying or handling Penalty Exceptions.

    (1) It shall be unlawful for any person to carry, exhibit, display, or draw any firearm, dagger, sword, knife or other cutting or stabbing instrument, club, or any other weapon apparently capable of producing bodily harm, in a manner, under circumstances, and at a time and place that either manifests an intent to intimidate another or that warrants alarm for the safety of other persons.
    (3) Subsection (1) of this section shall not apply to or affect the following:
    (a) Any act committed by a person while in his or her place of abode or fixed place of business;
    • Being prepared is to prepare, this is our responsibility.
    • I am not your Mommy or Daddy and do not sugar coat it but I will tell you simply as how I see it, it is up to you on how you will or will not use it.
    • IANAL, all information I present is for your review, do your own homework.

  12. #12
    Regular Member badkarma's Avatar
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    I refuse to believe one ounce of anything the PI puts in their articles. So unless someone has the facts then why waste our time on that rag?
    Last edited by badkarma; 12-18-2011 at 08:19 PM.

  13. #13
    Regular Member Lammo's Avatar
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    No reason to draw or display the gun. Just hand them a bullet and tell them the next one is coming a whole lot faster! :-)
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    Activist Member JamesCanby's Avatar
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    I would not have threatened the boys. I would have sent them home ... minus the clothes they were not wearing, telling them that their parents could retrieve their sons' clothing...

  15. #15
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Dad comes home and finds 2 naked (or 1 naked and 1 not-naked) persons in the home with his teenage daughter. Thoughts of rape (forced or statutory do not matter) race through his head.

    Deadly force in defense of rape is usually one of the things justified/excused under law. Holding alleged rapists by use of deadly force may be justified/excused, but a close reading of the law is needed instead of a mere presumption.

    Not having a round already in the chamber is cause for much head-shaking and head-banging .

    Not immediately calling 9-1-1 and asking the cops to come over and play is where this whole thing goes pear-shaped in a hurry. Everything else is just icing on the cake of fail. To say this will not end well for anybody is understatement.

    stay safe.

    Having reread the article, I see that Dad needed a fair amount of time to find the naked kid, and then used a fair amount of time making almost every mistake possible in the situation - at least according to the way things are reported. Dad's level of utter fail has just increased.
    Last edited by skidmark; 12-19-2011 at 09:07 AM. Reason: reread article - additional comments needed
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  16. #16
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    The dad made some mistakes, I find the boys story highly suspect. Slapping the daughter 50 to 100 times means he was slapping her roughly every 30 to 60 seconds, which I HIGHLY doubt. Not to mention that many slaps would have been plainly visible to the cops. At which point I have to question the rest of the story as the kids have already shown theirselves to be lacking in integrity after being caught in an act that they should have known wasn't condoned by the parent.

    I don't think the father is telling the story exactly how it happened, but I'm more likely to believe what he says over those that were caught in the act with their pants down.

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