Stolen or not?

J1MB0B · Dec 27, 2011

I'm not sure what section to post this in, so here goes...

If I am buying a gun from a private party, how can I find out if it is stolen or not? I was told there is a website to go to but I can't find one.

Thanks guys.

Jayd1981 · Dec 27, 2011

You can politely call the local police (non-emergency line is probably best) and ask if they are willing to run the serial number. I don't know if anyone has actually done it or not. Aside from that, there is no way for you to verify if the pistol is stolen or not yourself.

I have bought used pistols and I don't bother calling the police or any of that. I just trust my gut. If the person is acting shady, then I will not buy from them. On the other hand if they are knowedgable about the gun, have a plausible story where it came from and are willing to show me their CPL and DL (I write a reciept for them to sign that I keep that includes their name, address, gun model and serial) then I will do business with them. I highly doubt a criminal is going to be that open, so I feel safe enough. If you purchase a stolen weapon then you are the one in possession of stolen property (also you will be out your money too), do what you need to to be comfortable or walk away from the deal.

amlevin · Dec 27, 2011

Most of the PD's I've ever dealt with want to see the firearm in person before they'll "run it". That way if it's stolen they can seize it and have someone to question.

You may get lucky and find someone that can check the various databases but usually all access is controlled and someone along the way will want to know "who and why".

That's one area that our lawmakers could actually help solve the traffic of stolen guns, at least to honest, law abiding people. Give us a way to check, even if for a small fee. There are sites that will allow women to run background checks on prospective dates but no way to check a prospective purchase of a firearm.

Badger Johnson · Dec 27, 2011

http://www.hotgunz.com/

(not tried, but there it is).

gogodawgs · Dec 27, 2011

amlevin said:
Most of the PD's I've ever dealt with want to see the firearm in person before they'll "run it". That way if it's stolen they can seize it and have someone to question.

You may get lucky and find someone that can check the various databases but usually all access is controlled and someone along the way will want to know "who and why".

That's one area that our lawmakers could actually help solve the traffic of stolen guns, at least to honest, law abiding people. Give us a way to check, even if for a small fee. There are sites that will allow women to run background checks on prospective dates but no way to check a prospective purchase of a firearm.

Correct, it will be seized.

Badger Johnson said:
http://www.hotgunz.com/

(not tried, but there it is).

The issue with hotgunz is that it is a user submitted data base only.

MSG Laigaie · Dec 27, 2011

Badger Johnson said:
http://www.hotgunz.com/

(not tried, but there it is).

I tried it with the pistol I have on. It has not been reported as stolen. There was a disclaimer advising me to verify the information with local LEOs using NCIC. It might have looked like this.

DISCLAIMER
All information in our database is user supplied content. HotGunz.com makes no guarantee or warranty as to the validity or accuracy of the information. Please contact your local police department and request that the serial number be run through NCIC to confirm all results.

jbone · Dec 27, 2011

amlevin said:
Most of the PD's I've ever dealt with want to see the firearm in person before they'll "run it". That way if it's stolen they can seize it and have someone to question.

No doubt, mere Possession, I'd sure check the state and local law's first before taking to the PD, like you said they might question and charge a person.

sirpuma · Dec 27, 2011

Hotguns and http://www.stolenweapon.com/ both rely on users to report to them. I have accounts on both and file weapon info when I learn of stolen weapons (like my neighbor). When you search their databases if you get a hit the system emails the person who uploaded the firearm info. But if no one reports to them that the firearm was stolen then it won't be in their system.

Badger Johnson · Dec 27, 2011

What I would suggest is a 'good faith effort'. Here we have multiple databases you can check. I'd run this suspect or new purchase through them, print them out and store this record of absence of hits in the pistol case. I shows you made a good-faith effort to check on it. I think that would go a long way in supporting your intentions. (Mens Rea?)

This will help a coincidental problem, but if you think you might have a hot gun and don't want to get stopped with it, the only recourse is to hire a lawyer and have him turn it in for his anonymous client or something like that. It could get expensive. Guess that's why people'd rather have a clean sale.

It's not like you have any easy options.

MadHatter66 · Dec 27, 2011

Jayd1981 said:
You can politely call the local police (non-emergency line is probably best) and ask if they are willing to run the serial number. I don't know if anyone has actually done it or not.

YOU CANNOT CALL AND HAVE THEM RUN IT... Not only will they not, but its actually illegal and against ACCESS rules to do so without a reason or a LE request. As someone said before, if you go to a PD to check and they give it back to you or confiscate it, that's a pretty good indication that its is/is not stolen... Please don't burden your local 911 center with calls like this, they cannot help you.

Jayd1981 · Dec 27, 2011

MadHatter66 said:
YOU CANNOT CALL AND HAVE THEM RUN IT... Not only will they not, but its actually illegal and against ACCESS rules to do so without a reason or a LE request. As someone said before, if you go to a PD to check and they give it back to you or confiscate it, that's a pretty good indication that its is/is not stolen... Please don't burden your local 911 center with calls like this, they cannot help you.

Don't get your panties bunched up now. I said he could call the local police, I never once mentioned calling 911 or a 911 center. Then I said he could ASK. Why can't he? He's free to ask the police anything he wants. I have heard this idea (asking the police to run a serial #) talked about many times on here. But I have yet heard of anyone actually doing it. I was simply stating one thing the OP could TRY if he wanted, then stated what I do to feel comfortable with a sale. But thanks for telling everyone what THEY CANNOT DO. If it weren't for you, I was going to call 911 and ask them to run every serial number I have in my house. Thanks.

J1MB0B · Dec 28, 2011

An idea I was tossing around is an FFL dealer. They have to have some way to check the guns they buy right? On the other hand if the seller is willing to go with me to the cop shop to have the numbers run, then it probably isnt going to be hot.

Thanks for the replies so far.

John Hardin · Dec 28, 2011

jbone said:
No doubt, mere Possession, I'd sure check the state and local law's first before taking to the PD, like you said they might question and charge a person.

A point: you're going to take it in after you've bought it?

amlevin · Dec 28, 2011

JIMMBOB said:
An idea I was tossing around is an FFL dealer. They have to have some way to check the guns they buy right? On the other hand if the seller is willing to go with me to the cop shop to have the numbers run, then it probably isnt going to be hot.

Thanks for the replies so far.

This is the best idea. Tell the seller you'll only complete the transaction if he accompanies you to the PD and has them check the status. If he balks save your money. The risk is all on your shoulders as you'll be out the money, have no pistol, and then get the "stink eye" from the Police while you explain how you came by your stolen pistol. Either when you take it in to be checked or alongside the road some night during a traffic stop.

FMCDH · Dec 28, 2011

JIMMBOB said:
An idea I was tossing around is an FFL dealer. They have to have some way to check the guns they buy right? On the other hand if the seller is willing to go with me to the cop shop to have the numbers run, then it probably isnt going to be hot.

Thanks for the replies so far.

Some FFLs I have talked to will do an NCIC check like this, but typically they will charge their full FFL transfer fee for the service, and some are under the assumption they MUST do paperwork.

I would suggest calling around to your local gun stores and asking.

gogodawgs · Dec 28, 2011

FMCDH said:
Some FFLs I have talked to will do an NCIC check like this, but typically they will charge their full FFL transfer fee for the service, and some are under the assumption they MUST do paperwork.

I would suggest calling around to your local gun stores and asking.

Why? What would that accomplish? A NICS (not NCIC) check checks the background of the person purchasing a handgun and not the gun itself.

FMCDH · Dec 28, 2011

gogodawgs said:
Why? What would that accomplish? A NICS (not NCIC) check checks the background of the person purchasing a handgun and not the gun itself.

http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ncic

About the records: The NCIC database currently consists of 19 files. There are seven property files containing records of stolen articles, boats, guns, license plates, parts, securities, and vehicles. There are 12 persons files containing the Supervised Release; National Sex Offender Registry; Foreign Fugitive; Immigration Violator; Missing Person; Protection Order; Unidentified Person; U.S. Secret Service Protective; Gang; Known or Appropriately Suspected Terrorist; Wanted Person; and Identity Theft Files. The system also contains images that can be associated with NCIC records to help agencies identify people and property items. The Interstate Identification Index, which contains automated criminal history record information, is accessible through the same network as NCIC.

I'm not talking about the NICS system that they use when selling a gun, im talking about the NCIC system that FFL dealers have the ability to access through law enforcement channels. Its how they make sure they are not buying a stolen or "flagged" firearm.

gogodawgs · Dec 28, 2011

FMCDH said:
http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ncic

I'm not talking about the NICS system that they use when selling a gun, im talking about the NCIC system that FFL dealers have the ability to access through law enforcement channels. Its how they make sure they are not buying a stolen or "flagged" firearm.

How do FFL dealers have access? Where is that authorized?

FMCDH · Dec 28, 2011

gogodawgs said:
How do FFL dealers have access? Where is that authorized?

The way it has been explained to me is that many gun stores have a standing "for the mutual good" agreement with local law enforcement agencies to check used firearms SNs to make sure they are not taking in anything that's been stolen or suspected of being used in a crime.

If your asking for the official how and why of such an arrangement, I have no idea, ask your local gun store how they deal with such purchases.

Edited to add: Pawn shops that also deal in guns are the most common to have these arrangements from my experience.

gogodawgs · Dec 28, 2011

FMCDH said:
The way it has been explained to me is that many gun stores have a standing "for the mutual good" agreement with local law enforcement agencies to check used firearms SNs to make sure they are not taking in anything that's been stolen or suspected of being used in a crime.

If your asking for the official how and why of such an arrangement, I have no idea, ask your local gun store how they deal with such purchases.

I will. But I believe you have false information.

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