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Fredericksburg shooting, delayed charges

skidmark

skidmark

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Good grief, Badger Johnson! We'd never get out of class if things turned your way.

Why are you such a nanny-ninny, anyhow? It seems of late that you are advocating for folks "being told" this or that, as opposed to letting them figure it out for themselves. Yes, a CHP class ought to cover the basics of defense of self and innocent others, but after that you are and should be on your own. Handgun ownership is a huge responsibility, so let those who have undertaken it be responsible.

And why are you even discussing CHP classes? Sure, education/training is always a good thing, but there is no course one must attend before being allowed to OC, which is the focus of this forum. We all know you chose not to OC for fear that some rogue cop will throw you to the ground and permanently paralyze you. That's OK - nobody here is saying you have to OC. But why do you always turn the discussion to concealed carry and CHPs?

stay safe.
 
Badger Johnson

Badger Johnson

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skidmark said:
Good grief, Badger Johnson! We'd never get out of class if things turned your way.

Why are you such a nanny-ninny, anyhow? It seems of late that you are advocating for folks "being told" this or that, as opposed to letting them figure it out for themselves. Yes, a CHP class ought to cover the basics of defense of self and innocent others, but after that you are and should be on your own. Handgun ownership is a huge responsibility, so let those who have undertaken it be responsible.

And why are you even discussing CHP classes? Sure, education/training is always a good thing, but there is no course one must attend before being allowed to OC, which is the focus of this forum. We all know you chose not to OC for fear that some rogue cop will throw you to the ground and permanently paralyze you. That's OK - nobody here is saying you have to OC. But why do you always turn the discussion to concealed carry and CHPs?

stay safe.
Click to expand...

Why? The news article said:
Belgrave has a concealed weapons permit.
Click to expand...
I'm sorry for posting on CC issues and will try not to do so in the future, unless it's on topic. I don't ever recall STARTING A TOPIC on CC issues; maybe I've said something about it in the

Why are you such a nanny-ninny, anyhow?
Click to expand...
Why are you making PERSONAL comments about me? Isn't there an OCDO rule against personal attacks. I SHOULD report this post (lot of good it will do), but I have a lot of respect for you and I try to keep it clinical and analytical. Have I EVER attacked another poster personally? You've done this repeatedly. I'll pose the same question to you...why are you threatened by people who are 'ninnies' (your word)?

'Nobody is saying I have to OC'
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On the contrary, many are saying that including you and Peter Nap and the Moderators are implying if I want to stay here I should OC. Normally I'd AGREE with you. I shouldn't be here unless I OC AND support OC. But, sadly, I like some of you guys and hope I contribute something. If asked I will leave or lurk.

If we're trading insults, I COULD say something about people here but I don't. For example only: "In the morning, I could decide to 'butch up' and OC, but so-and-so would still be obese...and can't ride the roller coaster." :dude:

Why lower yourself to making repeated personal comments about me? Talk about the issues. That's why we're here.
 
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Grapeshot

Grapeshot

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Promoting CC over OC on these forums is like selling tainted fish on the pier - it even smells bad. Don't expect us to consume it or feed it to our family and friends - more importantly expect that we will not buy what you are selling. Likely we'll suggest that you may ingest that which you put on your own plate.

In the beginning OCDO was created and it was good. There was however no rest on the seventh day - all days being created equal and dedicated to the principle that open carrying a properly holstered handgun was meet and right so to do.



 
peter nap

peter nap

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MSC 45ACP said:
I told ya... 10 paces and turn...

There you have it.
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qd1.jpg
 
skidmark

skidmark

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Badger Johnson said:
Why? The news article said:
I'm sorry for posting on CC issues and will try not to do so in the future, unless it's on topic. I don't ever recall STARTING A TOPIC on CC issues; maybe I've said something about it in the
Yes, the two jerks were CCing, but my comment was directed at your suggestion about CHP classes focusing on when someone cannot shoot, as opposed to when it might be either excusable or justified. Gow about you staying on topic instead of trying to divert attention?

Why are you making PERSONAL comments about me? Isn't there an OCDO rule against personal attacks. I SHOULD report this post (lot of good it will do), but I have a lot of respect for you and I try to keep it clinical and analytical. Have I EVER attacked another poster personally? You've done this repeatedly. I'll pose the same question to you...why are you threatened by people who are 'ninnies' (your word)?
I called you a nanny-ninny because you are one. And because it has a great deal of bearing on the issue under discussion. I'd call that clinical and analytical. Again, you are trying to divert attention.

On the contrary, many are saying that including you and Peter Nap and the Moderators are implying if I want to stay here I should OC. Normally I'd AGREE with you. I shouldn't be here unless I OC AND support OC. But, sadly, I like some of you guys and hope I contribute something. If asked I will leave or lurk.
I have never said that you should OC, and as a matter of fact explicitly said that it was OK if you chose not to.

If we're trading insults, I COULD say something about people here but I don't. For example only: "In the morning, I could decide to 'butch up' and OC, but so-and-so would still be morbidly obese...and too short to ride the roller coaster." :dude:
So, my repeating your stated reason for not OCing is insulting? I will not dignify the rest of your screed with further notice.

Why lower yourself to making repeated personal comments about me? Talk about the issues. That's why we're here.
Click to expand...

So your repeated posting of comments that swing the discussion from OC towards CC are not issues? And are not germane? How would you prefer that I comment on that behavior so that it is not "personal"?

stay safe.
 
W

wrightme

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Grapeshot said:
Promoting CC over OC on these forums is like selling tainted fish on the pier - it even smells bad. Don't expect us to consume it or feed it to our family and friends - more importantly expect that we will not buy what you are selling. Likely we'll suggest that you may ingest that which you put on your own plate.
Click to expand...

From my read of this thread so far, no one is promoting CC over OC here, are they? Given the actions by the CC-permit holder, the comments concerning the course content is valid. Further, it does highlight a point where some members of society may be 'lacking' in the ability to tell where it is time to 'disengage.' In this case, it does seem like both parties failed to disengage, neither was a true aggressor against a victim, and both are likely to earn convictions for their part in the mutual affray. IMHO.
 
deepdiver

deepdiver

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wrightme said:
From my read of this thread so far, no one is promoting CC over OC here, are they? Given the actions by the CC-permit holder, the comments concerning the course content is valid. Further, it does highlight a point where some members of society may be 'lacking' in the ability to tell where it is time to 'disengage.' In this case, it does seem like both parties failed to disengage, neither was a true aggressor against a victim, and both are likely to earn convictions for their part in the mutual affray. IMHO.
Click to expand...

+1
 
Grapeshot

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My response was intended for those amongst us (users) who disparage OC and otherwise leave an impression that CCing is the better choice.
 
TFred

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If I may try to pull this thread back On Topic. The reason I posted the story was because of the fact that we are dealing with a case that may or may not be justifiable self-defense. As I read the article, I was reminded of something I read during the Skidmark/Surry debacle about the judge saying you don't give up your right to engage in a verbal disagreement simply because you choose to openly carry a gun.

Although details are incomplete in the reporting of this story, it appears to me that one possible scenario is that the CHP holder chose to visit the prior felon to discuss an issue that the two had in conflict. Perhaps he knew said prior felon possessed handguns illegally. I submit that if for whatever reason any of us decided to confront such a fellow in similar circumstances, we would likely choose to carry a gun ourselves. The important part of the story that is missing is exactly how that conversation went, and what exactly led to the gunfire. There are obviously several scenarios that could either convict or exonerate either of the two men involved.

It appears to me that the FPD could not decide with any level of confidence what happened, so they have chosen to throw everyone to the courts and will see what sticks.

In any case, the story is very pertinent to anyone who carries a gun for self-defense, whether it is openly or concealed. That is why I posted and I hope we will learn fully what happened and that justice will be served.

At the very least, it seems that one lesson we can all take from this story as seen so far is that appearances are very important. This scenario does not provide an obvious conclusion to which man was in the right and which man was in the wrong, or even if either of them were one or the other. At best, I would say that we should observe that CHP holder probably did not make the wisest choice to confront prior felon on the street after dark, like he did.

TFred
 
peter nap

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Quit blubbering Badger. It's unbecoming!

And well said Grapeshot.

TFred, the story is completely within guidelines. CC Vs OC isn't an issue. Who, what, when, where and was it justifiable are the key issues in this.
 
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Marco

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TFred said:
There are obviously several scenarios that could either convict or exonerate either of the two men involved.

we should observe that CHP holder probably did not make the wisest choice to confront prior felon on the street after dark, like he did.

TFred
Click to expand...

IMHO, that is why the chper was charged, as he went to the felons home with friends to DISGUST what seems to be a touchy situation.
The doctrine of competing harms may come into play infavor of the felon if he can provide evidence showing he had reason to fear for this life against the chper.
A VM or text stating "I'm going to kill" you would go a long way to help explain why the felon was armed illegally.

It's going to be interesting to see how this plays out in court.
 
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