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Thread: Police kill open carrier in Nevada, is this true?

  1. #1
    Regular Member kyleplusitunes's Avatar
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    Police kill open carrier in Nevada, is this true?

    I posted a couple days ago about my friend who lives in Nevada, she was interested in open carry, today I got an interesting text from her, I have tried to find some evidence of this, but haven't found any. This is her text verbatim.

    "There have been a few cases in Nevada of police killing open carriers, I remember hearing about a few. After talking about it a little a couple people brought those up and then I remembered herding about them, One dude was at a furniture store and some people saw the gun, freaked out and called the cops when he walked out, they mowed him down, I think I'm going to get a concealed permit to avoid the trouble"

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    Regular Member kyleplusitunes's Avatar
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    if this is true, does anyone have a link to the original story, and/or the outcome?

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    Regular Member Sabotage70's Avatar
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    She must be thinking of the Erik Scott Costco incident. He was CC and his gun became exposed.
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    Regular Member Dodoandduck's Avatar
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    He also had enough prescription meds in his system to kill most people and reportedly made some poor decisions. He shouldn't have been carrying and likely would be alive had that been the case.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dodoandduck View Post
    He also had enough prescription meds in his system to kill most people
    . . .according to the same coroner's inquiry which only took testimony from people who were openly on the side of the cops . . .and even then, their stories didn't match each other, much less the dozens of other eyewitnesses.

    If, as you say, Scott was so loaded up that most people couldn't survive, how could he have walked past the cops without being noticed? Until he was pointed out, these trained observers saw nothing out of the ordinary. No staggering, no disorientation, no NOTHING. And neither did the eyewitnesses.

    Didn't I read something about the coroner's inquest procedures being changed because of the way this case was handled? That's not something that they would do if the victim was clearly in the wrong, is it?

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    Regular Member Nevada carrier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DVC View Post
    Didn't I read something about the coroner's inquest procedures being changed because of the way this case was handled? That's not something that they would do if the victim was clearly in the wrong, is it?
    Yes, and because of those changes, the entire process is being challenged in court; postponing any further inquests until a hearing and ruling is made. Because of this, any officer involved in a shooting is going to collect a paycheck for doing little more than administrative work with no official public contact until there is resolution. The situation in Clark County is a mess right now.

    To my knowledge, no one has been murdered by Metro who was simply open carrying. I personally have had no negative interactions with Metro even though they have been called one me for open carry in the past. One metro officer even chastised the person who called; telling them that "ignorance of the law is not an excuse for violating it, " and that applies to making false reports of criminal activity as much as anything else."
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    Regular Member Dodoandduck's Avatar
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    The only point I was making is that the autopsy showed the level of prescription meds (narcotic painkillers if I remember correctly) was high enough at the time of the incident to kill most people. He reportedly had severe chronic pain from injuries and regardless of how acclimated he was, he shouldn't have been carrying. No matter how used to meds, and pain killers especially, someone may be, it will affect their judgement, reactions, and affect how they think they're being perceived. If I recall he served our country and went to battle. His life shouldn't have ended like it did, but I don't lay the blame on Metro. I read a quote in the paper regarding the officer involved shootings. "Everyone is quick to blame the police. I haven't heard of a single case where someone was shot who wasnt threatening police or citizens, ramming or trying to run them down with a car." Sadly there seem to have been a lot more cases involving soldiers returning from war. Veterans deserve our highest respect and should be taken care of at all levels, including edit if service.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DVC View Post
    . . .according to the same coroner's inquiry which only took testimony from people who were openly on the side of the cops . . .and even then, their stories didn't match each other, much less the dozens of other eyewitnesses.

    If, as you say, Scott was so loaded up that most people couldn't survive, how could he have walked past the cops without being noticed? Until he was pointed out, these trained observers saw nothing out of the ordinary. No staggering, no disorientation, no NOTHING. And neither did the eyewitnesses
    .

    Didn't I read something about the coroner's inquest procedures being changed because of the way this case was handled? That's not something that they would do if the victim was clearly in the wrong, is it?
    That does not take into account that he was reportedly taking large continual doses of painkillers to deal with pain, not as an abuse. It is quite possible that he didn't exhibit any effects discernable to the casual observer.

    But, more to the point, it wasn't even a case of "OC-er getting shot" at all.
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    Regular Member TigerLily's Avatar
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    This post got off track but some silly things were said that need to be addressed.

    A note to those of you who are in denial and enablers of our wicked, satanic police state: Erik Scott was the VICTIM. He was executed by Metro. If he was that "drugged" up, then what excuse do the cops have for THEIR bad judgement? Blaming Erik for the Metro screwup is like blaming the raped victim for acting sexy. We have more cop shootings and killings of innocent people by Metro than in any other place in the U.S. Gestapo Gillespie is corrupt to the very core. Gestapo claims he WELCOMES the feds to investigate his clusterfk. So it shouldn't come to a surprise that the geezer is in bed with the feds and has no fear of any repercussions.

    See page 28: http://www.dhs.gov/xlibrary/assets/h...mendations.pdf

    I expect better critical thinking from some on this forum.

    As for any open carrier being violated in Nevada - here it is one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vt70pnWkx7w

    But I'm sure some will argue that I had it coming for daring to videotape cops for WHILE open carrying - both lawful activities. And FYI - I found out these assclowns were at best violating their own policy during this traffic stop. And don't anyone tell me how dangerous their work is. It's far more likely I'll get killed by one of these cops with guns for open exercising those rights people still think we have - and to be killed by a criminal.

    The police state is our biggest threat to our liberties. And arming ourselves is all we have left to ATTEMPT to balance the power!
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    Regular Member Dodoandduck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TigerLily View Post
    This post got off track but some silly things were said that need to be addressed.

    A note to those of you who are in denial and enablers of our wicked, satanic police state: Erik Scott was the VICTIM. He was executed by Metro. If he was that "drugged" up, then what excuse do the cops have for THEIR bad judgement? Blaming Erik for the Metro screwup is like blaming the raped victim for acting sexy. We have more cop shootings and killings of innocent people by Metro than in any other place in the U.S. Gestapo Gillespie is corrupt to the very core. Gestapo claims he WELCOMES the feds to investigate his clusterfk. So it shouldn't come to a surprise that the geezer is in bed with the feds and has no fear of any repercussions.

    See page 28: http://www.dhs.gov/xlibrary/assets/h...mendations.pdf

    I expect better critical thinking from some on this forum.

    As for any open carrier being violated in Nevada - here it is one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vt70pnWkx7w

    But I'm sure some will argue that I had it coming for daring to videotape cops for WHILE open carrying - both lawful activities. And FYI - I found out these assclowns were at best violating their own policy during this traffic stop. And don't anyone tell me how dangerous their work is. It's far more likely I'll get killed by one of these cops with guns for open exercising those rights people still think we have - and to be killed by a criminal.

    The police state is our biggest threat to our liberties. And arming ourselves is all we have left to ATTEMPT to balance the power!
    Well I agree his demise should not have happened but also said he should have exercised the judgement to not carry in a compromised condition. As far as the cops having bad judgement, there human just as we are. If someone was acting erratic and possibly made a motion toward a visible weapon. I know how I would react.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TigerLily View Post
    This post got off track but some silly things were said that need to be addressed.

    A note to those of you who are in denial and enablers of our wicked, satanic police state: Erik Scott was the VICTIM. !
    I am interested in hearing from you, who you feel fits that mold you created.
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    Quote Originally Posted by wrightme View Post
    That does not take into account that he was reportedly taking large continual doses of painkillers to deal with pain, not as an abuse. It is quite possible that he didn't exhibit any effects discernable to the casual observer.

    But, more to the point, it wasn't even a case of "OC-er getting shot" at all.
    The real question is whether he was "under the influence" of them. Drugs -- especially painkillers -- have attenuated effects on certain people, requiring a far higher dosage to get the beneficial effects.

    I once saw a cop with a twice-over-the limit blood alcohol content who was able to not only pass every field sobriety test given AND the LAPD's driver training course, but do so with a BETTER ability than the nugget cops who gave it to him (he was brought in to show them that the legal limit was not proof of anything).

    Scott was not showing the common signs of the drugs reportedly found in his system. The reason for that has never been explained, but indicate the strong possibility that they were not effective on him, and that he was NOT under the influence of them.

    Also, yes, he was not OCing. I think that even Metro cops would have noticed that when he came out of the store, instead of having to be told which of the evacuees was the target.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dodoandduck View Post
    Well I agree his demise should not have happened but also said he should have exercised the judgement to not carry in a compromised condition. As far as the cops having bad judgement, there human just as we are. If someone was acting erratic and possibly made a motion toward a visible weapon. I know how I would react.
    . . .except that witnesses said that he was NOT acting erratically, and the video surveillance which would have answered the question was "lost."

    I don't know your background, and you are new here. When Scott was killed, this was a topic here for weeks, as was the coroner's inquest. You might go back and read what was brought forth at the time and since about this and about the records and behavior of the officers involved. We're not talking Malloy and Reed here, we're talking about cops who aren't being properly supervised, in a department with a clear record of anti-gun-rights abuses.

  14. #14
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    True personal story regarding Rx pain medications that demonstrates how people are effected differently by them.

    During the discovery, diagnosis and treatment of a potentially life threatening medical condition, I was referred to the Pain Management Clinic at the Medical College of Virginia by my Oncology Physician. I was on what politely would be called large doses of Oxycontin, Percocet and ibuprofen to be taken "as needed" and it was needed with great regularity.

    When the PM doc ask me who was driving me home, I replied, "I'm not going home. I'm going back to work and I drive myself."

    What!!!! When was the last time you took your meds? Can you take them now?

    I said I was due, took them in front of him, and waited about 45 min. before being called back into the exam room.
    They did blood work, put me through an extensive battery of physical and cognitive tests. End result, no ill effects and I am written up in a medical journal somewhere. Might be Ripley's Believe It or Not. While this reaction/condition to this degree is not unheard of, this particular facility and never seen it first hand. They put the odds at 1 out of 10,000,000.

    BTW - when the treatment succeeded in alleviating the problem, I actually sat up on the table and was pain free for the first time in well over a year. Stopped the meds w/o any withdrawal problems and eventually flushed 'em down the drain.

    Point is not everyone is the same and we don't always fit the expected mold.

    Was I carrying daily then? If you know me, you wouldn't even ask that question.
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    Regular Member TigerLily's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dodoandduck View Post
    Well I agree his demise should not have happened but also said he should have exercised the judgement to not carry in a compromised condition. As far as the cops having bad judgement, there human just as we are. If someone was acting erratic and possibly made a motion toward a visible weapon. I know how I would react.
    Maybe we could all speak more intelligently on the issue if only the costco surveillance tape hadn't gone "MISSING." Until then, I'm siding with Erik.
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    Regular Member TigerLily's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wrightme View Post
    I am interested in hearing from you, who you feel fits that mold you created.
    Anyone making excuses for why the police executed Erik or any other victim of Gillespies trained dogs.

    Ask yourself these questions: Do we need cops? Is their job dangerous? Should we respect cops? If your answer is anything but NO then you fit the mold that I created.
    Last edited by TigerLily; 01-10-2012 at 04:09 PM.
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    Regular Member TigerLily's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grapeshot View Post
    True personal story regarding Rx pain medications that demonstrates how people are effected differently by them.

    During the discovery, diagnosis and treatment of a potentially life threatening medical condition, I was referred to the Pain Management Clinic at the Medical College of Virginia by my Oncology Physician. I was on what politely would be called large doses of Oxycontin, Percocet and ibuprofen to be taken "as needed" and it was needed with great regularity.

    When the PM doc ask me who was driving me home, I replied, "I'm not going home. I'm going back to work and I drive myself."

    What!!!! When was the last time you took your meds? Can you take them now?

    I said I was due, took them in front of him, and waited about 45 min. before being called back into the exam room.
    They did blood work, put me through an extensive battery of physical and cognitive tests. End result, no ill effects and I am written up in a medical journal somewhere. Might be Ripley's Believe It or Not. While this reaction/condition to this degree is not unheard of, this particular facility and never seen it first hand. They put the odds at 1 out of 10,000,000.

    BTW - when the treatment succeeded in alleviating the problem, I actually sat up on the table and was pain free for the first time in well over a year. Stopped the meds w/o any withdrawal problems and eventually flushed 'em down the drain.

    Point is not everyone is the same and we don't always fit the expected mold.

    Was I carrying daily then? If you know me, you wouldn't even ask that question.

    I was a registered nurse for almost 10 years and believe this. I had large patients that wouldn't go to sleep with 6 milligrams of xanax and one, similar sized patient took one quarter of a mg of xanax and went into respiratory arrest. Big lesson to me as a nurse: find out what the patient's history and tolerance is. That particular patient could have been sedated with half an over-the-counter benadryl. And no - none of my patients died on MY watch - unless they were "supposed to." (e.g. hospice.)
    Last edited by TigerLily; 01-10-2012 at 04:08 PM.
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    Regular Member TigerLily's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dodoandduck View Post
    Well I agree his demise should not have happened but also said he should have exercised the judgement to not carry in a compromised condition. As far as the cops having bad judgement, there human just as we are. If someone was acting erratic and possibly made a motion toward a visible weapon. I know how I would react.
    Fits my mold.

    "his demise should not have happened..... "BUT"

    The but leads to an excuse.

    "[cops] are human just as we are"

    They should not be compared to "we." WE don't have badges that sanction the wrongful use of the guns they carry.

    "If someone was acting erratic and possibly made a motion toward a visible weapon. I know how I would react."

    Oh really? So is this person saying that if he had seen Erik at Costco HE would have killed him himself?

    This post is a classic example of a Police State enabler.

    Wake up, boys. The police state is here. We have ZERO rights and were losing even more.

    If I am wrong - then someone please enlighten me to what "right" we have? If a right is something given to us by God that cannot be taken away - then name one right that we have in the U.S.A. Just one.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dodoandduck View Post
    The only point I was making is that the autopsy showed the level of prescription meds (narcotic painkillers if I remember correctly) was high enough at the time of the incident to kill most people. He reportedly had severe chronic pain from injuries and regardless of how acclimated he was, he shouldn't have been carrying. No matter how used to meds, and pain killers especially, someone may be, it will affect their judgement, reactions, and affect how they think they're being perceived. If I recall he served our country and went to battle. His life shouldn't have ended like it did, but I don't lay the blame on Metro. I read a quote in the paper regarding the officer involved shootings. "Everyone is quick to blame the police. I haven't heard of a single case where someone was shot who wasnt threatening police or citizens, ramming or trying to run them down with a car." Sadly there seem to have been a lot more cases involving soldiers returning from war. Veterans deserve our highest respect and should be taken care of at all levels, including edit if service.
    Veterans deserve our highest respect? Why is that? Do you also feel that way about police officers; that they deserve our highest respect? What is the difference between a veteran and a police officer? They both serve the state. One is the domestic arm of government violence and killing; the other is the worldwide arm of government violence and killing.

    So, just what is it about that that I am supposed to respect?

  20. #20
    Regular Member TigerLily's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ed2276 View Post
    Veterans deserve our highest respect? Why is that? Do you also feel that way about police officers; that they deserve our highest respect? What is the difference between a veteran and a police officer? They both serve the state. One is the domestic arm of government violence and killing; the other is the worldwide arm of government violence and killing.

    So, just what is it about that that I am supposed to respect?
    Ed, will you marry me? Just kidding. I've been happily married to the same old fart for 30 years come next month. It's my way of saying RIGHT ON!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by TigerLily View Post
    Ed, will you marry me? Just kidding. I've been happily married to the same old fart for 30 years come next month. It's my way of saying RIGHT ON!!
    LOL TigerLily. I am married too... a newlywed as of 12/30/2011. But, I do appreciate the "RIGHT ON!" Congrats on your upcoming 30th anniversary!

    It wasn't so long ago that I was a worshiper of state violence, believing in the myths of cops and soldiers as heroes. Ian Freeman,Ademo and Pete were among those who started to open my eyes to the reality of what was really going on. Stefan Molyneux opened my eyes with his "gun in the room" speeches. Howard Zinn opened my eyes with his expose on the U.S. military slaughter of the Filipinos after having set them "free" from Spanish occupation following the Spanish-American war.

    Once the myths of heroism, patriotism, American Exceptionalism, etc. fall as scales from one's eyes, the reality of what is really going on...police and military violence, murder, and mayhem against the innocent...the true nature of the state cannot be denied. One cannot ever look on the state and its agents in the same way ever again; that is, one can no longer be blinded by anthems, pomp, parades, etc. and deluded into seeing the state and its agents as anything but the thugs and murderers they are.

  22. #22
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    This thread has taken a definite turn beyond the purpose and intent of OCDO. We shall not provide a forum to list/rant what some perceive as normal, routine or everyday misconduct by those in our law enforcement community. Contrary to that position, we hold that by and large those that chose and live that avocation are good and honorable men and women.

    More importantly the direct connection, when is expressed in the manner as some posts above, is outside the parameters of OCDO - normalizing OC in our everyday lives. Such a general thread might be tolerated in the Social Lounge but not within the state/other sub-forums. Individual news items of events that occur in a particular state being obviously on target if the stay on topic. The needed element is to speak to the facts and neither emotionalize, aggrandize nor generalize such as being typical of all LEOs or LEAs.

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