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Thread: Passing through

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    Passing through

    I will be passing through Maryland on my way to the outerbanks. My research shows that Maryland does not recognize a Michigan permit, yet Michigan recognizes a Maryland permit. Whats up with the no reciprocity? I also see that I will have to lock up my pistol while transporting through your state. Am I correct here in what I have found? Any comments, suggestions and advice is welcome.

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    Regular Member Dreamer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken56 View Post
    I will be passing through Maryland on my way to the outerbanks. My research shows that Maryland does not recognize a Michigan permit, yet Michigan recognizes a Maryland permit. Whats up with the no reciprocity? I also see that I will have to lock up my pistol while transporting through your state. Am I correct here in what I have found? Any comments, suggestions and advice is welcome.
    Maryland doesn't recognize ANY permit from other states. Sometimes they don't even honor their OWN permits. And sometimes (if you are a REALLY connected insider clerk of the court, brandishing a gun in front of two police officers, on an expired permit) they will look the other way.

    In other words, in MD, there is essentially no Rule of Law, and everything depends on who you are, how much money you have, and whether or not some sticker on your car, the color of your skin, the size of your political contributions to the Governor's re-election campaign, or some random reading material on your back seat sets off the LEO who is looking to pin something on you...

    With regards to the un-reciprocal reciprocity between MD and MI, there are MANY states who recognize MD permits--generally states with VERY freedom-loving gun laws (NC is another with one-way recognition). Some states think that if you qualify for a permit in one state, it should be good in EVERY state. The MD State Police (who issue MD permits) on the other hand, has actually stated in official testimony before the MD General Assembly that they consider all other LEAs to be so utterly incompetent in their investigative techniques, and so devoid of scruples in issuing permits, that they cannot be trusted under MD's "strict issuing policies". (which BTW, has no training requirement or range qualification requirements, but DOES have a "WWW" requirement--wealthy, white, and well-connected)

    What that really means is that many states will issue permits to blacks, hispanics, women, poor people, and people who aren't politically connected, and in MD, the State has decided those are the "wrong kinds of people" to be carrying firearms.


    On a more upbeat note:

    FOPA transport rules DO apply in MD, regardless of what MD LEAs may believe. If you are truly transiting MD (meaning you are NOT making any long stops like to go shopping or attend an event, or stay overnight) you are PERFECTLY legal to transport a firearm through MD under FOPA rules--unloaded, locked up, with ammo in a separate container. (Magazines CAN be loaded, just not in the same container with the firearm). If you follow FOPA, you are 100% legal to transport a firearm THROUGH Maryland.

    Now, if you get pulled over for some reason, and the LEO discovers you have a gun in your car, it will probably be seized, you will probably be detained, and if you even attempt to protest or cite Federal law in your own defense, you will probably be arrested, beaten and Tazed.

    Because that's how they roll in MD.

    My advice is that the ONLY way to be 100% safe in transporting a gun through MD is NOT to travel through MD with a gun. Go around this god-forsaken cess-pit of corruption and graft, and see the sights of 2A-friendly states like PA, WV and VA. A few more miles and a few more hours added on to your trip will be rewarded with beautiful landscape, friendly people, and the Freedom to carry your legally-owned firearm in whatever mode your permit allows.

    One more pointer about traveling in MD--if you have any pro-2A stickers or Tea Party type stickers (like Gadsden Flags) on your vehicle, be advised that the MSP issued a training memo last year advising MD LEOs that such stickers/magnets were reason to exercise EXTREME caution during traffic stops, because the driver was probably an armed, belligerant illegal gun smuggler, bringing illegal guns into MD to sell to the gang-bangers in Baltimore and PG County. Really--you can't make this stuff up...

    http://www.ammoland.com/2011/06/06/b...decal-warning/

    Good luck with your trip.
    Last edited by Dreamer; 01-18-2012 at 09:26 PM.
    It is our cause to dispel the foggy thinking which avoids hard decisions in the delusion that a world of conflict will somehow mysteriously resolve itself into a world of harmony, if we just don't rock the boat or irritate the forces of aggression—and this is hogwash."
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    Thanks Dreamer, I have been looking at the map for alternate routes just to avoid even entering MD. You paint a very dismal picture. If I do stay on the major E-ways then my pistol will be locked in the safe under my back seat and if stopped do I have to tell them I have my pistol with me and locked up properly? Mich. has tagged our DL's with CPL info so if its run it will come up I have a CPL. What good is having one if you are not going to carry? so 2 + 2= he's got a gun! I'll figure out something. Thanks again.

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    Regular Member Dreamer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken56 View Post
    Thanks Dreamer, I have been looking at the map for alternate routes just to avoid even entering MD. You paint a very dismal picture. If I do stay on the major E-ways then my pistol will be locked in the safe under my back seat and if stopped do I have to tell them I have my pistol with me and locked up properly? Mich. has tagged our DL's with CPL info so if its run it will come up I have a CPL. What good is having one if you are not going to carry? so 2 + 2= he's got a gun! I'll figure out something. Thanks again.
    If your state includes CHL tags in their DVM database info, and you get stopped in MD, you will most likely be treated as a hostile and dangerous suspect, not just a guy with a burned-out tail light. If you see flashing blues, expect to be detained if your DL info has CHL tags on it. Expect to have your car searched--with or without your consent. Expect to be harassed. Expect to be treated like a criminal. Expect to have your civil rights violated.

    And make sure your life insurance is up-to-date.

    My suggestion to ANY out-of-staters with guns passing through MD is to NOT PASS THROUGH MD if you can at all avoid it.

    COMMENTS REMOVED BY ADMINISTRATOR: Bashing other gun rights groups
    It is our cause to dispel the foggy thinking which avoids hard decisions in the delusion that a world of conflict will somehow mysteriously resolve itself into a world of harmony, if we just don't rock the boat or irritate the forces of aggression—and this is hogwash."
    --Barry Goldwater, 1964

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    Regular Member hermannr's Avatar
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    No guns-No money works for states too. Send the MD tourist board a note tilling them they missed your money because of their gun laws.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamer View Post


    On a more upbeat note:

    FOPA transport rules DO apply in MD, regardless of what MD LEAs may believe. If you are truly transiting MD (meaning you are NOT making any long stops like to go shopping or attend an event, or stay overnight) you are PERFECTLY legal to transport a firearm through MD under FOPA rules--unloaded, locked up, with ammo in a separate container. (Magazines CAN be loaded, just not in the same container with the firearm). If you follow FOPA, you are 100% legal to transport a firearm THROUGH Maryland.

    .
    FOPA does not require separation of gun and ammo.

    § 926A. Interstate transportation of firearms

    Notwithstanding any other provision of any law or any rule or regulation of a State or any political subdivision thereof, any person who is not otherwise prohibited by this chapter from transporting, shipping, or receiving a firearm shall be entitled to transport a firearm for any lawful purpose from any place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm to any other place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm if, during such transportation the firearm is unloaded, and neither the firearm nor any ammunition being transported is readily accessible or is directly accessible from the passenger compartment of such transporting vehicle: Provided, That in the case of a vehicle without a compartment separate from the driver’s compartment the firearm or ammunition shall be contained in a locked container other than the glove compartment or console.
    States don’t have rights. People do.

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    hermannr, I think thats a fine idea to let the tourist board know I will not be spending any of my money in their state and the reason I won't be. You have convinced me to avoid entering Maryland all together and enjoy West Virginia and Virginia. I will let you know what I send them.

  8. #8
    Regular Member Dreamer's Avatar
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    I often drive to VA to put gas in my car, and try to not spend any money in MD unless it can't be avoided, like day to day groceries. I buy all my clothes, books, gun supplies, etc, in other states, or online. MD doesn't get ANY sales tax and MD businesses don't get any of my money if I can avoid it.

    I don't just talk the talk, I try to walk the walk.
    It is our cause to dispel the foggy thinking which avoids hard decisions in the delusion that a world of conflict will somehow mysteriously resolve itself into a world of harmony, if we just don't rock the boat or irritate the forces of aggression—and this is hogwash."
    --Barry Goldwater, 1964

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    Regular Member Dreamer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrjam2jab View Post
    FOPA does not require separation of gun and ammo.
    But MD transport laws do, and so I would rather err on the side of caution when traveling through MD. Best not to give a MD LEO an excuse to violate my rights or steal my property on some misperceived phantasm of local authority trumping Federal law, which is a common occurance in MD...
    It is our cause to dispel the foggy thinking which avoids hard decisions in the delusion that a world of conflict will somehow mysteriously resolve itself into a world of harmony, if we just don't rock the boat or irritate the forces of aggression—and this is hogwash."
    --Barry Goldwater, 1964

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    Michigan Moderator DrTodd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamer View Post
    If your state includes CHL tags in their DVM database info, and you get stopped in MD, you will most likely be treated as a hostile and dangerous suspect, not just a guy with a burned-out tail light. If you see flashing blues, expect to be detained if your DL info has CHL tags on it. Expect to have your car searched--with or without your consent. Expect to be harassed. Expect to be treated like a criminal. Expect to have your civil rights violated.

    And make sure your life insurance is up-to-date.

    My suggestion to ANY out-of-staters with guns passing through MD is to NOT PASS THROUGH MD if you can at all avoid it.

    COMMENTS REMOVED BY ADMINISTRATOR: Bashing other gun rights groups

    My understanding is that the CPL info in LEIN (Michigan's DL and arrest Database) is not transmitted with the information to other states. This may have changed, though.
    Giving up our liberties for safety is the one sure way to let the violent among us win.

    "Though defensive violence will always be a 'sad necessity' in the eyes of men of principle, it would be still more unfortunate if wrongdoers should dominate just men." -Saint Augustine

    Disclaimer – I am not a lawyer! Please do not consider anything you read from me to be legal advice.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DrTodd View Post
    My understanding is that the CPL info in LEIN (Michigan's DL and arrest Database) is not transmitted with the information to other states. This may have changed, though.
    I only see VA when running tags or OLN's. Have never seen a Utah or Florida, the two most sought after.

    That may change, once we get National Reciprocity. One would hope.

    Carl

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