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Opinions? Carry while working at a nightclub

NMadole

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 24, 2011
Messages
70
Location
Traverse City, MI
One of my side jobs is working as security at a bar/nightclub. At my workplace the security does not carry. One of my good friends works at a nightclub down the street and his security staff all carry (mostly open, but some concealed). This is completely legal (everyone has there CPL and permission for the owner to CC while working and open carry is always legal with your CPL).

My question is what is your take on bar security staff carrying (and how should they carry)?

Not sure how I feel....
 

thebigsd

Founder's Club Member
Joined
Mar 23, 2010
Messages
3,535
Location
Quarryville, PA
Well, I think just about everybody should carry, security guards are no exception. Do you wear uniforms? Are you clearly identified as security? Do you feel comfortable with your whole team carrying? Are you in constant close contact with club patrons? How would you go about training the team? I would support you carrying but there many factors to consider.
 

DrTodd

Michigan Moderator
Joined
Jun 20, 2008
Messages
3,272
Location
Hudsonville , Michigan, USA
Well, I think just about everybody should carry, security guards are no exception. Do you wear uniforms? Are you clearly identified as security? Do you feel comfortable with your whole team carrying? Are you in constant close contact with club patrons? How would you go about training the team? I would support you carrying but there many factors to consider.

+1
 

WARCHILD

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 18, 2008
Messages
1,768
Location
Corunna, Michigan, USA
Given the sue happy country we are in; just some food for thought.

I would check with the owner about the coverage of his liability insurance underwriters to see if he is covered to have "armed" security staff.
If he is not; I would suggest you either get bonded yourself or ask him to provide the liability insurance if you're going to be employed as armed security.

just my .02
 

NMadole

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 24, 2011
Messages
70
Location
Traverse City, MI
We do wear gear that identifies us as bar employees... We have very close and constant contact with bar patrons


My buddy who carries while working owns a private security firm... the bar contracts his company to provide security so the liability lies with the private security firm...
 

alphamale

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 1, 2011
Messages
215
Location
Michigan
Drunks are the quickest at grabbing for your weapon PERIOD!

So I always carried concealed to avoid a number of problems.

1. a drunk grabbing my weapon because he thinks it's funny or a joke.
2. a drunk grabbing the weapon to be violent.
3. Drunks seeing you have a weapon and get instant Superman complex and start screaming shoot me and challenge me/you because we ain't so tough garbage.

I did it for years and when alcohol is involved it's best to not let anyone know you have a weapon till the time it is needed.

Remember a deterrent like a seen weapon only works on sane people, and drunks typically are insane when drunk.


One of my side jobs is working as security at a bar/nightclub. At my workplace the security does not carry. One of my good friends works at a nightclub down the street and his security staff all carry (mostly open, but some concealed). This is completely legal (everyone has there CPL and permission for the owner to CC while working and open carry is always legal with your CPL).

My question is what is your take on bar security staff carrying (and how should they carry)?

Not sure how I feel....
 

Shadow Bear

Michigan Moderator
Joined
Dec 17, 2010
Messages
1,004
Location
Grand Rapids
Dalton: All you have to do is follow three simple rules. One, never underestimate your opponent. Expect the unexpected. Two, take it outside. Never start anything inside the bar unless it's absolutely necessary. And three, be nice. »

Dalton: I want you to be nice until it's time to not be nice. »

Dalton: If somebody gets in your face and calls you a **********, I want you to be nice. Ask him to walk. Be nice. If he won't walk, walk him. But be nice. If you can't walk him, one of the others will help you, and you'll both be nice. I want you to remember that it's a job. It's nothing personal. »

Roadhouse

Otherwise,


U.S. Marine Corps Rules:

1. Be courteous to everyone, friendly to no one.
2. Decide to be aggressive enough, quickly enough.
3. Have a plan.
4. Have a back-up plan, because the first one probably won't work.
5. Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everyone you meet.
6. Do not attend a gunfight with a handgun whose caliber does not start with a "4."
7. Anything worth shooting is worth shooting twice. Ammo is cheap. Life is expensive.
8. Move away from your attacker. Distance is your friend. (Lateral & diagonal preferred.)
9. Use cover or concealment as much as possible.
10. Flank your adversary when possible. Protect yours.
11. Always cheat; always win. The only unfair fight is the one you lose.
12. In ten years nobody will remember the details of caliber, stance, or tactics. They will only remember who lived.
13. If you are not shooting, you should be communicating your intention to shoot.
 

MAC702

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Jul 31, 2011
Messages
6,331
Location
Nevada
Check laws regarding armed security.

Having a personal sidearm while working as a security guard may be considered "Armed Security" which is a whole 'nuther area of security that may require specific legal training and certification. It does in my state. Carrying concealed MAY make a difference in the legal aspects of carrying as a security guard, but my guess is that it probably does not.
 

NMadole

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 24, 2011
Messages
70
Location
Traverse City, MI
Check laws regarding armed security.

Having a personal sidearm while working as a security guard may be considered "Armed Security" which is a whole 'nuther area of security that may require specific legal training and certification. It does in my state. Carrying concealed MAY make a difference in the legal aspects of carrying as a security guard, but my guess is that it probably does not.

There are no such laws in Michigan regarding armed security (I also work for Brinks and there is no Michigan "Guard Card")... the only stipulation for concealed carry in a bar is that you are authorized to do so by the owner and that your are acting as an employee providing security for the bar...
 

DrTodd

Michigan Moderator
Joined
Jun 20, 2008
Messages
3,272
Location
Hudsonville , Michigan, USA
There are no such laws in Michigan regarding armed security (I also work for Brinks and there is no Michigan "Guard Card")... the only stipulation for concealed carry in a bar is that you are authorized to do so by the owner and that your are acting as an employee providing security for the bar...

This is correct...
 

xmanhockey7

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2010
Messages
1,195
Security would have to get CPLs to carry concealed though right? I'm assuming that the bar would not be considered their place of business unless they were the owner.

(2) A person shall not carry a pistol concealed on or about his or her person, or, whether concealed or otherwise, in a vehicle operated or occupied by the person, except in his or her dwelling house, place of business, or on other land possessed by the person, without a license to carry the pistol as provided by law and if licensed, shall not carry the pistol in a place or manner inconsistent with any restrictions upon such license.
 

Golden Eagle

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 3, 2009
Messages
253
Location
SW Michigan
xmanhockey7 said:
Security would have to get CPLs to carry concealed though right? I'm assuming that the bar would not be considered their place of business unless they were the owner.
You are correct

I have a friend with out a CPL who cc's at work and is not the owner. So she shouldn't? It is her "place of business".
 
Last edited:

xmanhockey7

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2010
Messages
1,195
I have a friend with out a CPL who cc's at work and is not the owner. So she shouldn't? It is her "place of business".

I would argue it is not her "place of business". Just because she works there does not make it hers. I wonder what the "legislative intent" is behind this and if we have any cases regarding this issue.
 

stainless1911

Banned
Joined
Dec 19, 2009
Messages
8,855
Location
Davisburg, Michigan, United States
You have to be the owner. Nowhere in MI law, is it OK for a citizen to grant the right to conceal to anyone.

234d does allow a person to openly carry a firearm in those prohibited places, and 425o allows one to gain permission to carry OC or CC in a church, but only if that person already has a CPL.
 

xmanhockey7

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2010
Messages
1,195
On another note when I was talking to some people about MI gun laws one mentioned that bouncers at some bar or club carry concealed without CPLs. He said he asked the sheriff in the area whether it was legal and the sheriff told him because they're on private property there is nothing they can do. I'm not saying this is right because the sheriff said so I'm just telling you that is what the sheriff said when asked about it.
 
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