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"An armed society is a peacful one."

Coastal9mm

New member
Joined
Jan 23, 2012
Messages
1
Location
Coast,OR
Howdy Folks,
I am from down here in southern oregon on the coast. I am 18 years old and just started OCing a few days ago. Now i have been living on my own and raising a kid since i was 16. I would say i personally think i am very mature enough too OC. I carry a 9mm semi auto on me in a black uncle mikes hip holster. The last few days around town i have been very surprised when watching everyones reactions too my firearm. Most people do not even notice, for i just go about my own business and do not make it a big deal. The few people that do notice are all differnt. You have your people that give you a nasty look, the ones who do nothing at all, and the ones that make a hurry too get out of your way. . . . . Besides the one older gentleman who talked too me today which leads too my story.

So today i ran a few towns over too pick up a load of hay for my horses. On my side like always i had my 9mm. On the way back too home i stopped at our local quick stop called circle k. When i was inside i was going about my own business when i noticed an older gentleman giving me a curious look. I smiled and said hi and went about my shopping. When i got in line he happend too get in directly behind me. He said hello and we started too talk. He asked me. .. Have you ever heard the saying "An Armed Society Is A Peaceful One" i said no. We talked a little more and i told him that is why i OC'd. I told him how people i know are against it. Like i said too him, it does not hurt anyone i go about my business as i normally would and if for whatever reason i needed it its there. There is only good that comes from it in my eyes he agreed the same and i learned he carried concealed.

Now ever since i talked too that nice old man the saying he told me has stuck in my mind. "An Armed Society Is a Peaceful One." This is so true. If more people OC'd enough too where there was at least one armed citizen in every store and around town the criminals would be too scared too make a problem. I think this saying just fits perfectly into the cause we are all joined together in. Just thought i would share.

Thank you. . Zach
 

Contrarian

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 18, 2009
Messages
259
Location
Seattle,WA, , USA
"Armed Society"

The quote he mentioned was written by Robert Heinlein, s-f writer.

The full quote is, "An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life."

THe book it's from is "Beyond This Horizon", written in 1942.
 

Steeler-gal

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Joined
Oct 29, 2011
Messages
560
Location
Fairfax County, VA
The quote he mentioned was written by Robert Heinlein, s-f writer.

The full quote is, "An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life."

THe book it's from is "Beyond This Horizon", written in 1942.

I never heard this either. It is interesting but I think it makes an assumption on behavior. Wasn't there a time when everyone was armed? There were still crimes, right?
 

Fallschirjmäger

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Aug 4, 2007
Messages
3,823
Location
Cumming, Georgia, USA
It all depends on the point of view; some people see it as though it means others must be scared of their actions.
Others see the quote as meaning "that other guy can't be a bully when it means I possess the means to defend myself."
 

Fallschirjmäger

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Aug 4, 2007
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Location
Cumming, Georgia, USA
Pardon, but... call me names... mock me, ? I left the third grade too many years ago to even want to think about... However...
Don't I have the same means, the same weapons at hand as he? Can I not call him names? mock him in turn?

It's been said that human beings only have two ways to deal with one another: reason and force. If you want me to do something for you, you have a choice of either convincing me via argument, or force me to do your bidding under threat of force. Every human interaction falls into one of those two categories, without exception. Reason or force, that’s it. (The Gun is Civilization takes that thought much further.)


Only an idiot or a fool would draw a deadly weapon for such slights as you suggest. Human nature is to believe that others would do as one himself thinks or fears he might; that being the case, the idea that someone might behave as you suggest is the furthest thing from my mind. I'm reminded of Dear Abby's reply, something along the lines of "Only those who are inclined to hide in the bedroom closet think to look for someone hiding there."


I think better of myself, and in turn I think better of others.
 
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sawah

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 22, 2011
Messages
436
Location
Virginia
I have to say I have never seen a more polite group of people than when I am at a gun show. Everyone is all 'please and thank you and excuse me'. So the Maxim holds in my experience (quoted correctly).
 

1245A Defender

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 7, 2009
Messages
4,365
Location
north mason county, Washington, USA
Wow!!!

But he can. The bully can call you all sorts of names. Mock you. Harass you. Even assault you with less than deadly force, and you can't just draw your gun and fire.

Please feel free to Mock me and Harass me too, BUT If you assult me with less than deadly force,
I WILL draw my Gun and use it to
smack you upside your big stupid head, with less than deadly force!!! Ill do that untill you realize that you should stop...

I cant fathom why anybody would think that they could freely assault someone, but
since that particular someone is carrying a gun, that someone couldnt fight back.
 

sawah

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 22, 2011
Messages
436
Location
Virginia
Please feel free to Mock me and Harass me too, BUT If you assult me with less than deadly force,
I WILL draw my Gun and use it to
smack you upside your big stupid head, with less than deadly force!!! Ill do that untill you realize that you should stop...

I cant fathom why anybody would think that they could freely assault someone, but
since that particular someone is carrying a gun, that someone couldnt fight back.

For non-lethal assaults, I carry a feisty girlfriend with pepper spray.
 

Uber_Olafsun

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Joined
Dec 9, 2009
Messages
583
Location
Alexandria, Virginia, United States
Pistol whipping someone in the head would be deadly force.

Really? So instead of cops shooting people they should just hit them with the gun? Pistols have some magic property that another heavy object such as a police baton doesn't have? Cops use the fear of their life during a shooting to justify shooting someone who may be unarmed? Gerald Ung shot someone who may or may not have just whooped his butt bit the jury felt it was justified.
 

Elimsitna

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 8, 2012
Messages
33
Location
West Seattle
While the thought of using a gun only in a non-lethal capacity to beat on someone is hilarious, and would certainly make a point to your assailant...
I would make a similar point to Raven....
That wielding a gun as a "rock" is a 'Threat of lethal force' and would cause escalation. If the guy started the fight with a knife, almost everyone here would agree he would get shot. Just cause a broadsword can be used as a bat for non-lethal doesn't mean others see it as anything less then a sword.
So pulling your gun is asking for the other guy to escalate/retreat, but by continuing the force-exchange you're causing a third party who may enter to see a lethal force scenario.

Just $0.02
 

Vitaeus

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May 30, 2010
Messages
596
Location
Bremerton, Washington
Folks, if I get "assaulted" by someone who knows I have a firearm and does it anyway, is going to scare teh sh!t out of me. The issue is fearing for your life, someone attacking an armed citizen is either crazy or so out of control that he will likely not stop at non-lethal force.
 

Aknazer

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 6, 2011
Messages
1,760
Location
California
If I were to be assaulted while OCing I would be scared that they would be after my gun. After all, why would you assault someone that you know is armed unless you are after their weapon or want to cause serious bodily harm?

Note that I'm not talking about a woman slapping you or some other relatively minor thing, but a full up fight.
 
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WOD

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Feb 13, 2012
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224
Location
Onalaska WA
Some "full-on" fights can strictly remain just that... a fistfight. Whether you are getting your ass whooped, or are doing the whooping, there is no reason to pull a gun... unless... they pull a knife, broken bottle, chair, or they go for your/their gun, thereby escalating the threat level. As soon as something other than a fist, foot, or body part comes into play, the level of life endangering threat goes up, respond accordingly.
 

Steeler-gal

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Oct 29, 2011
Messages
560
Location
Fairfax County, VA
Some "full-on" fights can strictly remain just that... a fistfight. Whether you are getting your ass whooped, or are doing the whooping, there is no reason to pull a gun... unless... they pull a knife, broken bottle, chair, or they go for your/their gun, thereby escalating the threat level. As soon as something other than a fist, foot, or body part comes into play, the level of life endangering threat goes up, respond accordingly.

So, I can't say I was in fear for my life just because the assailant is using his fists to pummel me to death? I disagree.
 

Daylen

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Aug 29, 2010
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America
I never heard this either. It is interesting but I think it makes an assumption on behavior. Wasn't there a time when everyone was armed? There were still crimes, right?

Fewer, and there was still violence. Yet that is when manners were made and the loss in manners directly corresponds with the loss of arms and the right to duel.
 

georg jetson

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Sep 14, 2009
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Slidell, Louisiana
Some "full-on" fights can strictly remain just that... a fistfight. Whether you are getting your ass whooped, or are doing the whooping, there is no reason to pull a gun... unless... they pull a knife, broken bottle, chair, or they go for your/their gun, thereby escalating the threat level. As soon as something other than a fist, foot, or body part comes into play, the level of life endangering threat goes up, respond accordingly.

You would take the risk of getting knocked out and your attacker gaining control of your weapon?
 

GhostOfJefferson

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Feb 17, 2012
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137
Location
Lewis Center, OH
I never heard this either. It is interesting but I think it makes an assumption on behavior. Wasn't there a time when everyone was armed? There were still crimes, right?

The point of the quote isn't that a society is crime free that is fully armed. The only people foolish enough to perpetrate crimes in the open in an unashamedly armed society are sociopaths and the insane (or those temporarily insane through drugs/alcohol). However, those types are never stopped from perpetrating crimes by anything, by definition. There are a large swath of "undecideds" though, to whom the quote is quite relevant. Talking about the guy who thinks hitting up a liquor store is more profitable than working, but stops short when everybody in the store is armed, because he then knows the odds. It's not profitable to die, after all. Hence, where he walked in to cause bad times, he then either exits thusly or becomes quite polite and does no crime, and we find then that the wheels of gentile society are oiled.

Really, getting down to it, one of the reasons I OC is precisely because of the sociopaths and insane, as well as being a passive crime preventer for the undecideds. The folks who consider crime in my vicinity who fall into neither category of insane nor sociopath have thus far, apparently from a lack of any crimes in my vicinity, chosen a different path once they realized I was armed.

I believe that's the spirit of the quote.
 

MamaLiberty

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Nov 8, 2006
Messages
894
Location
Newcastle, Wyoming, USA
Some "full-on" fights can strictly remain just that... a fistfight. Whether you are getting your ass whooped, or are doing the whooping, there is no reason to pull a gun... unless... they pull a knife, broken bottle, chair, or they go for your/their gun, thereby escalating the threat level. As soon as something other than a fist, foot, or body part comes into play, the level of life endangering threat goes up, respond accordingly.

You seem to be forgetting the "disparity of force" part of this thing. If two men of equal ability begin to fist fight, either one introducing a weapon into the deal would be seriously escalating the level of force and become the overall aggressor - regardless of who actually punched first. They each have a, more or less, equal opportunity to injure each other or to prevail otherwise.

But if that initial aggressor was larger, stronger, more able than the person he/she assaulted, we have a whole different dynamic. The stronger/larger person could quite easily cause great bodily harm or death to the less able victim. For that victim to draw a gun in that situation, there is only a matter of self defense.

Now, realize that this is not always clear in the heat of the moment, and there are endless variations possible, which is why a grand jury or coroner's jury may well be required to sift the evidence and decide that after the fact.

This is why the gun is considered the "equalizer." No, it's not perfect... but it most certainly does help.

And, as one who carries a gun, I am constantly reminded to be even more polite, courteous and patient than even my ordinary nature might cause me to be. I am aware at all times that I have no right to impose myself or be unpleasant just because I am armed. I have found that the most polite and reasonable people around me are the ordinary men and women who carry. It can't be just a coincidence after all these years.
 

Daylen

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Aug 29, 2010
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America
Some "full-on" fights can strictly remain just that... a fistfight. Whether you are getting your ass whooped, or are doing the whooping, there is no reason to pull a gun... unless... they pull a knife, broken bottle, chair, or they go for your/their gun, thereby escalating the threat level. As soon as something other than a fist, foot, or body part comes into play, the level of life endangering threat goes up, respond accordingly.

Only if you agree to settle whatever dispute there is by fisty cuffs and agree that the victor gets to decide your fate. In my case I would likely not agree to such terms and use every tool at my disposal to dissuade such a perpetrator from inflicting violence upon me.
 
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