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Thread: More proof that gunshow policies are dumb.

  1. #1
    Regular Member TheSzerdi's Avatar
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    More proof that gunshow policies are dumb.

    http://www.theblaze.com/stories/man-...nnah-gun-show/

    He was reportedly leaving the show when he inadvertently discharged a round and shot himself in the leg at the Savannah Civic Center around 5:10 p.m. The incident occurred as he was attempting to re-load his pistol in the civic center parking lot, as loaded guns weren’t allowed inside the show.
    Applies to non-cpl holders driving in Michigan too.

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    Yep.

    Im just waiting (hoping) for someones gun to be taken while they case or uncase out in front of everyone as the law requires.

  3. #3
    Founder's Club Member thebigsd's Avatar
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    Explain how a man shooting himself is caused by a gun show policy. Negligent discharges are caused by careless people not policies.
    "When seconds count between living or dying, the police are only minutes away."

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    When the law, or policy requires that a person disarm, they increase the amount of time that a gun is handled. Mathematically, this increases the probability that a mistake can be made, resulting in an NG.

    The laws and policies share in the blame.

  5. #5
    Founder's Club Member thebigsd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    When the law, or policy requires that a person disarm, they increase the amount of time that a gun is handled. Mathematically, this increases the probability that a mistake can be made, resulting in an NG.

    The laws and policies share in the blame.
    I disagree, NDs are caused solely by the individual. How much time a person spends handling it has nothing to do with. Follow the basic safety rules and you will avoid a ND every time. There's a reason it's called negligent.
    "When seconds count between living or dying, the police are only minutes away."

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    Its a human thing. People screw up, even wth the best of intentions, and the best of training. Its an unavoidable statistical fact that these policies will result in thefts and shootings.

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    Founder's Club Member thebigsd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    Its a human thing. People screw up, even wth the best of intentions, and the best of training. Its an unavoidable statistical fact that these policies will result in thefts and shootings.
    Really, you have a cite for that? How is a policy at fault for someone screwing up? I don't like the policy, but don't blame it for someone's ineptitude. People screw up- you got that part right.
    Last edited by thebigsd; 02-11-2012 at 06:57 PM.
    "When seconds count between living or dying, the police are only minutes away."

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    Founder's Club Member thebigsd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    for me too, lol.
    "When seconds count between living or dying, the police are only minutes away."

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    Regular Member MilProGuy's Avatar
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    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by thebigsd View Post

    ...NDs are caused solely by the individual..

    ...Follow the basic safety rules and you will avoid a ND every time.
    These two statements say it all!
    Proud Veteran ~ U.S. Army / Army Reserve

    Mississippi State Guard ~ Honorably Retired


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    Regular Member NHCGRPR45's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MilProGuy View Post
    These two statements say it all!

    Roger That! First Sargeant!
    But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security. Declaration of Independence July 4, 1776

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    Take another look at what you wrote there, Stainless1911. I trust you didn't write what you meant to say.

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    Regular Member TheSzerdi's Avatar
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    At one gun show I went to they had a barrel of sand to point your gun at while unloading your chambered round. It had holes in it.

    Gotta say, when they first pointed me to the barrel of sand to unload the first thought to cross my mind was, 'You gotta be kidding me . . . am I supposed to fire into this thing or what?!?"

    (I did NOT shoot the barrel of sand.)

    Admittedly it is the ignorant owners fault, but the policies / laws don't help. Accidents happen, even to responsible gun owners. Most cases it's a negligent discharge, but not always.

    Example hypothetical accident: Non-CPL holder unholstering to put his/her gun in the trunk slips on ice and reflexively clenches his/her hand. A finger could slip into the guard and fire the weapon. (Double actions like Glocks don't have manual safeties. Round chambered means you're hot.)

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    Michigan Moderator Shadow Bear's Avatar
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    There are three types of people; ones who have experienced an accidental discharge, those who will, and those who THINK it will never happen to them (A.K.A. damn fools).

    Needlessly requiring law abiding persons to disarm / unload for no logical reason simply increases the odds that it will happen.

    Me? I walk away from criminal empowerment zones; may they wither & die. Nothing in there concerns me; I vote with my feet & wallet.

    Did get a couple of sweet deals at On Target and Bullets & Barrels while fully armed.
    'If the people are not ready for the exercise of the non-violence of the brave, they must be ready for the use of force in self defense. There should be no camouflage.....it must never be secret.' MK Gandhi II-146 (Gandhi on Non-Violence)-- Gandhi supports open carry!

    'There is nothing more demoralizing than the fake non-violence of the weak and impotent.' MK Gandhi II-153 (Gandhi on Non-Violence)

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    What would you do if you were without a CPL? Could you effectively function outside of those criminal empowerment zones?

    You're right though, there are 3 types. I had an ND once, as a teen with a gun that I shouldn't have had. Nobody taught me about guns, was an "adult" thing or something. This is one reason I teach my kids young.
    Last edited by stainless1911; 02-12-2012 at 01:45 PM.

  16. #16
    Regular Member TheQ's Avatar
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    I carry a Springfield XDm -- "locked and loaded", of course.

    The only thing that stands between me and a discharge is a backstrap safety and a trigger safety. SOOOOOOOO -- When I go to bed, I wrap it in a towel and stick it under my pillow. Before I do this I take the chambered round out (I know about set-back, don't preach to me, please) and I leave it with a loaded magazine and an empty chamber. (I'm not interested in anyone's comments or opinions about how I store my weapon overnight -- unwanted feedback will be duly ignored.)

    This to say -- I load and unload my weapon nearly every day. Not one ND or even close to an ND.

    Learning safe habits goes along way. Some people are stupid, even stupid people have RKBA. Whether or not some people should own weapons is up for debate, but I will never advocate for infringing on their rights.

    LEARN SAFE HANDLING TECHNIQUES BEFORE YOU CARRY A GUN!!!!
    Last edited by TheQ; 02-12-2012 at 04:21 PM.
    Call for a cop, call for an ambulance, and call for a pizza. See who shows up first.

    I am not a lawyer (merely an omnipotent member of a continuum). The contents of this post are not a substitute for sound legal advice from a licensed attorney in your jurisdiction.

    Comments and views stated in my post are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. unless stated otherwise in the post.

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    Removing the unloaded and tied policies at gun shows will not stop ND's. IIRC, many of the ND's were from vendors that,

    A: Unholstered their so-called unloaded pistol to allow a costumer to handle...Bang. Vendor(s) retrieve pistol...Bang.
    B: Unholstered their so-called unloaded pistol to show/showoff to customer...Bang.

    Also, IIRC, there were a couple of ND's by off-duty LEO's acting as security. Those ND's, I guess, were the holsters fault or they claimed something (debris) was in the holster that was the cause of the ND.
    Last edited by SpringerXDacp; 02-12-2012 at 05:19 PM.

  18. #18
    Regular Member .40S&W's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheSzerdi View Post
    At one gun show I went to they had a barrel of sand to point your gun at while unloading your chambered round. It had holes in it.

    Gotta say, when they first pointed me to the barrel of sand to unload the first thought to cross my mind was, 'You gotta be kidding me . . . am I supposed to fire into this thing or what?!?"

    (I did NOT shoot the barrel of sand.)
    That's a military thing. We had to do it when I was in the Army. It's not there for you to shoot into, it's there in the case of an AD. Murphy's Law folks.
    Last edited by .40S&W; 02-12-2012 at 05:29 PM.

  19. #19
    Founder's Club Member thebigsd's Avatar
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    Some folks are expounding the theory that the more times you handle a gun the more likely you are to have a negligent discharge. This is flat out false. I have loaded/unloaded dozens of different types of guns. Rifles, pistols, shotguns, revolvers- all different styles and calibers- I have never had an ND. If the the myth were true, I should have had a ND by now. I'll say it again, if you follow the basic rules of firearm safety you will NEVER have a negligent discharge.
    "When seconds count between living or dying, the police are only minutes away."

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    Its not a myth, you just haven't meet the odds yet.

  21. #21
    Regular Member NHCGRPR45's Avatar
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    Making someone un-load there firearm in public is only asking for trouble, I don't go to the gibraltar trade shows and leave my daughter behind when I do because of the policy to load un-load your firearm at the gate. A gun in the holster should remain there until needed. Anyone can have an accident, as we have all seen.
    But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security. Declaration of Independence July 4, 1776

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  22. #22
    Regular Member .40S&W's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thebigsd View Post
    Some folks are expounding the theory that the more times you handle a gun the more likely you are to have a negligent discharge. This is flat out false. I have loaded/unloaded dozens of different types of guns. Rifles, pistols, shotguns, revolvers- all different styles and calibers- I have never had an ND. If the the myth were true, I should have had a ND by now. I'll say it again, if you follow the basic rules of firearm safety you will NEVER have a negligent discharge.
    I agree with you. In my entire military career plus my time handling firearms as a civvy I have never had an AD. However, you do have your occasional doofus that shouldn't be operating a weapon let alone a microwave.

  23. #23
    Founder's Club Member thebigsd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    Its not a myth, you just haven't meet the odds yet.
    Explain how you have an ND is you follow the basic firearms rules.
    "When seconds count between living or dying, the police are only minutes away."

  24. #24
    Regular Member autosurgeon's Avatar
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    Firearm malfunction. Such as a sear failure. It has happened.

    Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk
    Anything I post may be my opinion and not the law... you are responsible to do your own verification.

    Blackstone (1753-1765) maintains that "the law holds that it is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer."

  25. #25
    Regular Member NHCGRPR45's Avatar
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    Stainless get rid of the creepy spider,,,,just sayin! I'll have more than enough to deal with when I get to where I am going!
    But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security. Declaration of Independence July 4, 1776

    Michigan Concealed Pistol Instructor. Cost 80.00 With advanced techniques included free. PM for more information!

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