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Thread: Other firearm bills currently in the House and Senate

  1. #1
    Campaign Veteran Verd's Avatar
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    Other firearm bills currently in the House and Senate

    Some of the bills in the House and Senate right now only help out Conceal Carry permit holders, which is in and of itself a 2nd Amendment violation so I'll just list out the bill numbers with a link if those of you who want to ask your represenatives and senators to support a bill for a violation of our rights, then go right ahead (HB 1045, HB 1319, HB 1369, HB 1483, SB 489, SB 637).

    There are some decent bills for those of us who want an unfettered 2nd Amendment:

    HB 1482 Specifies that the provisions regarding the crime of unlawful possession of a firearm will not apply to the possession of rifles or shotguns by a person who has not been convicted of a violent felony

    No, it doesn't give all felons the right to carry a firearm, nor does it give non-violent felons the right to carry a pistol, but it does give non-violent felons the right to carry certain firearms, rifles and shotguns, which will allow them to be able to take advantage of the Castle Doctrine.


    HB 1589 Repeals authority for political subdivisions to regulate open carrying of firearms and requires certain local ordinances incorporate statutory justifications

    Yup, one of three OC Preemption bills. Why we are only talking about SB680 I do not know, for all three of these OC Preemption bills should be supported through calling, writing, and emailing our represenatives and senators.


    HB 1618 Removes the provision granting authority to regulate open carrying of firearms to political subdivisions and requires ordinances regulating the discharge of a firearm to incorporate all justification defenses

    Second OC Premption bill.


    HB 1621 Specifies that it will be an unlawful employment practice to discriminate against an individual because he or she has a concealed carry endorsement or uses a firearm for a lawful purpose

    This bill will not force employeers to allow the carrying of a firearm on their private property, but it will make it a discrimination if they refuse to hire someone for their choice to carry a firearm. It is a decent bill, could be better, but (as people were saying about HB1369) it is a start.


    HB 1683 Requires 911 operators to receive training on state laws regarding selfdefense and defense of others

    This one, in my opinion, is also very important to get into committee and passed. People need to be told by 911 operators that they have the right to use deadly force against intruders instead of telling them that they cannot advise on the situation.


    HB 1686 Prohibits the discharge of a firearm within or into a municipality with criminal negligence.

    The way the summary is written on this one makes it sound bad, but in my opinion, when you read the actual text of the bill, it is a rather decent bill. What it does is add the following text between sections 1 and 2 of 571.030, RSMo:
    2. (1) This subsection shall be known and may be cited as "Blair's Law".

    (2) A person commits the crime of unlawful use of a weapon if, with criminal negligence, he or she discharges a firearm within or into the limits of any municipality.

    (3) This subsection shall not apply if the firearm is discharged:

    (a) As allowed by a defense of justification under chapter 563;

    (b) On a properly supervised range;

    (c) To lawfully take wildlife during an open season established by the department of conservation. Nothing in this subdivision shall prevent a municipality from adopting an ordinance restricting the discharge of a firearm within one-quarter mile of an occupied structure;

    (d) For the control of nuisance wildlife as permitted by the department of conservation or the United States Fish and Wildlife Service;

    (e) By special permit of the chief of police of the municipality;

    (f) As required by an animal control officer in the performance of his or her duties;

    (g) Using blanks;

    (h) More than one mile from any occupied structure; or

    (i) In self defense or defense of another person against an animal attack if a reasonable person would believe that deadly physical force against the animal is immediately necessary and reasonable under the circumstances to protect oneself or the other person.
    Which, in effect, limits the definition of unlawful discharge within city limits. It does not allow for accidental discharges, such as hitting the trigger while holstering a weapon, but I think that would be hard to legislate and this bill seems to be doing what it can to cover many of the bases as to why a discharge in a city limit should be acceptable.


    HJR 49 Proposes a constitutional amendment specifying that the right of every citizen to possess or purchase ammunition and articles for the proper functioning of arms must not be infringed or limited

    While I have not seen any local government from passing laws that limit certain ammunition, until recently many local governments had these types of laws in place. In other words, I will be asking my represenatives and senators to support this bill (and I hope others will do so as well).


    SB 680 SB 680 - Under current law, political subdivisions may enact ordinances regulating the open carrying of firearms. This act removes that authority so political subdivisions may not regulate the open carrying of firearms.
    This act also requires that local ordinances regulating the discharge of firearms incorporate justification defenses provided by statute, which include self defense, defense of others, and defense of property.

    The third OC Preemption bill that we have been talking about for the past few weeks.

    EDIT: And in case anyone is unfamiliar with how bills become laws, check out this pdf: http://www.house.mo.gov/billtracking/info/habbl.pdf so that we are all on the same page.
    Last edited by Verd; 02-12-2012 at 01:10 AM. Reason: Added the bill process pdf
    One loves to possess arms, though they hope never to have occasion for them. Thomas Jefferson to George Washington, 1796.
    If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun. - Dalai Lama (Seattle Times, 05-15-2001).
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    Regular Member Redbaron007's Avatar
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    Thanks Verd for posting!

    I'm not sure about HB1686. I've read it several times and it still hasn't set well. Not sure what the issues are, but for some reason, I'm not sure I like it. I'm not against it, but I haven't decided to throw support around it either.

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    Regular Member G30Mike's Avatar
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    Great post. Info is much appreciated.
    "Ever notice once in a while you come across somebody you shouldn't have f***ed with......That's me." -Clint Eastwood "Gran Torino"

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    Campaign Veteran Verd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redbaron007 View Post
    Thanks Verd for posting!

    I'm not sure about HB1686. I've read it several times and it still hasn't set well. Not sure what the issues are, but for some reason, I'm not sure I like it. I'm not against it, but I haven't decided to throw support around it either.
    Right now, without HB1686, cities can make it unlawful to discharge a weapon in the city limits. Meaning, that if the city wanted to, they could charge you with unlawful use of a firearm even if you discharged it to defend yourself. HB1686 makes it where even if a local government makes it illegal to discharge in the city limits, there are stipulations to what constitutes an unlawful discharge of a firearm. It strengthens the ability of people to be able to protect themselves (plus it allows the use of blanks, which are not allowed as of now).
    One loves to possess arms, though they hope never to have occasion for them. Thomas Jefferson to George Washington, 1796.
    If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun. - Dalai Lama (Seattle Times, 05-15-2001).
    Find businesses that are pro gun and those that aren't. Support Friend or Foe by using it!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Verd View Post
    Right now, without HB1686,
    Thank you for the conversation and consideration a few days ago, I know I am a hard ass and the printed word makes it worse, but your polite demeanor and ability to listen as well as communicate effectively is appreciated.

    2012 may well do some things for firearm owners and it is because of folks like you, and I as well as all of the others bothering to read and support that it will happen.
    John C. Eastman Associate Dean of Chapman Universityís School of Law "the Second Amendment, like its sister amendments, does not confer a right but rather recognizes a natural right inherent in our humanity."

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    This is a good post to keep track. Thanks Verd .

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    Campaign Veteran Verd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by G30Mike View Post
    Great post. Info is much appreciated.
    You are welcome.

    Quote Originally Posted by LMTD View Post
    Thank you for the conversation and consideration a few days ago, I know I am a hard ass and the printed word makes it worse, but your polite demeanor and ability to listen as well as communicate effectively is appreciated.

    2012 may well do some things for firearm owners and it is because of folks like you, and I as well as all of the others bothering to read and support that it will happen.
    No problem, sometimes asswipes like ourselves need to move beyond the text medium to fully understand one another.

    Quote Originally Posted by Festus_Hagen View Post
    This is a good post to keep track. Thanks Verd .
    No problem. I'll keep check on these bills and update the information in this thread whenever the House/Senate's site changes in regards to the above gun bills.
    One loves to possess arms, though they hope never to have occasion for them. Thomas Jefferson to George Washington, 1796.
    If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun. - Dalai Lama (Seattle Times, 05-15-2001).
    Find businesses that are pro gun and those that aren't. Support Friend or Foe by using it!

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    Campaign Veteran Verd's Avatar
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    Updates:

    HB 1482 has been given to a committee, General Laws
    HB 1621 has been given to General Laws as well
    HJR 49 also was given to General Laws committee

    The Committee on General Laws may consider matters referred to it relating to general or miscellaneous issues as determined by the Speaker of the House.
    General Laws
    | Committee Description | Bills Assigned to Committee | Committee List |

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Committee
    Franz, Ward, Chair
    Richardson, Todd, Vice Chair
    Colona, Mike
    Cross, Gary L.
    Day, David
    Funderburk, Doug
    Houghton, Jay
    McCaherty, John
    McCreery, Tracy
    McDonald, Tom
    Parkinson, Mark
    Pollock, Darrell
    Scharnhorst, Dwight
    Schupp, Jill
    Swearingen, Jay
    HJR 49 has 4 of its sponsors on the committee, including the committee chair, which suggests good news.
    HB 1621 has only one sponsor on the committee, which is, again, the committee chair. Good news in my opinion.
    One loves to possess arms, though they hope never to have occasion for them. Thomas Jefferson to George Washington, 1796.
    If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun. - Dalai Lama (Seattle Times, 05-15-2001).
    Find businesses that are pro gun and those that aren't. Support Friend or Foe by using it!

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    Nice post Verd. We all need to be on the same issues because one impacts the other. I will agree that "permitted" concealed carry is a violation of 2A. We need Constitutional carry plain and simple.

    If most knew the in-depth process about bills being submitted at any level then many would already know why we're talking about one specific bill rather than all of the others. At any point in time when a bill is submitted there are usually at least 2 or 3 other forms of the bill submitted right along side of it. Some will have the same language, some similar, and some will have different language while attaining the same meaning and end. Where one might not pass due to language another just might due to changes in the language.

    I certainly agree that we need to give attention to the other bills as well and suggest that those politicians support the other bills as well.

    "HB 1621 Specifies that it will be an unlawful employment practice to discriminate against an individual because he or she has a concealed carry endorsement or uses a firearm for a lawful purpose

    This bill will not force employeers to allow the carrying of a firearm on their private property, but it will make it a discrimination if they refuse to hire someone for their choice to carry a firearm. It is a decent bill, could be better, but (as people were saying about HB1369) it is a start
    ."

    This particular bill will be just as much a waste of time and resources as having Vets Services at the DOL. We'll never be able to make a legitimate claim on the matter and since Missouri is an at-will State they could immediately fire someone and lie about the reason even if it's really because of a protected issue. Vets Services suggestion to employers: The squeaky wheel gets the grease, so if it remains squeaky then just replace it. (DC refused to answer why this was said to several employers when it came to legitimate and proven military discrimination claims)

    CCW permit information is private by law. So if the employer even asks the applicant should NEVER answer.

    This bill is inherently dangerous to the open carry community as well. It opens the door for carded OC or OC only with a CCW endorsement to be protected by law and that's not going to be an acceptable outcome now is it.

    We MUST get our lawmakers on the right page so that we're protected and unrestricted no matter what our choice of carry is. Our right to life through self-preservation should not cease at the doorstep of a business, government building, park, or anything else for that matter.


    Verd, did you read any of the other bills? There's one that's been submitted that will grant OC to CCW permit holders. That bill alone could lead to some major changes for the OC crowd, so watch the inter-linking of several of these gun bills. Several will truly accompany one another and will lead to a direction that most won't like.

    See them in THIS order and hopefully you'll see a directional pattern emerging:
    HB1319
    HB1369
    HB1045 (and all of the others)

    My prediction is that there will be mandated safety training, background checks, and possibly carded carry for OC on the horizon in Missouri on or OC will become only allowed with a CCW endorsement for those same reasons. As a firearm instructor I support training, but I don't like that particular direction I've predicted or government involvement and if it truly gets that far our politicians had better have enough sense to write a protection into the law that if we're stopped by a LEO and carrying our card then it's looked at and we're left on our merry way unless they have RAS that we have committed a crime. We also need to be allowed to document such stops without RAS by a LEO straight to the MOAG and if a pattern emerges it triggers an immediate State-level investigation with one hell of a heavy penalty.

    What truly irks me is that our politicians still refuse to see things through to the full end and potential consequences. SB489 is just that example. That bill will attempt to undue the problem created by the Aug. 2011 changes, but it fails to get to the very end of the issue by protecting any and all certificates issued from any future changes.
    Last edited by REALteach4u; 02-20-2012 at 01:16 AM.

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    Regular Member Redbaron007's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Verd View Post
    Right now, without HB1686, cities can make it unlawful to discharge a weapon in the city limits. Meaning, that if the city wanted to, they could charge you with unlawful use of a firearm even if you discharged it to defend yourself. HB1686 makes it where even if a local government makes it illegal to discharge in the city limits, there are stipulations to what constitutes an unlawful discharge of a firearm. It strengthens the ability of people to be able to protect themselves (plus it allows the use of blanks, which are not allowed as of now).
    Appreciate the defining. This is what I thought it said; however, it just didn't flow like that for me.

    P.S. I was close to your neck of the woods this weekend; Branson, Cape Fair....my wife doesn't like the roads..to 'S'...or maybe it's my driving! LOL!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Verd View Post
    Right now, without HB1686, cities can make it unlawful to discharge a weapon in the city limits. Meaning, that if the city wanted to, they could charge you with unlawful use of a firearm even if you discharged it to defend yourself. HB1686 makes it where even if a local government makes it illegal to discharge in the city limits, there are stipulations to what constitutes an unlawful discharge of a firearm. It strengthens the ability of people to be able to protect themselves (plus it allows the use of blanks, which are not allowed as of now).
    In the matter of justifiable use of force this is completely a non-issue.

    RSMO 563.074 protects the person using justified force from criminal prosecution and civil liability that could normally stem from the use of such justified force.
    http://www.moga.mo.gov/statutes/C500-599/5630000074.HTM

    It's another illustration that our politicians are not reading the laws that are currently on the books and thinking things through to the true ends and consequences.
    Last edited by REALteach4u; 02-21-2012 at 01:08 AM.

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    Campaign Veteran Verd's Avatar
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    HB 1621 had its Public Hearing on the 21st at 4pm. No other information was given.

    If everything went well (and continues to do well), it should be placed on the calendar soon-ish.
    One loves to possess arms, though they hope never to have occasion for them. Thomas Jefferson to George Washington, 1796.
    If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun. - Dalai Lama (Seattle Times, 05-15-2001).
    Find businesses that are pro gun and those that aren't. Support Friend or Foe by using it!

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    Campaign Veteran Verd's Avatar
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    HB 1683 was given over to General Laws committee on the 23rd.
    One loves to possess arms, though they hope never to have occasion for them. Thomas Jefferson to George Washington, 1796.
    If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun. - Dalai Lama (Seattle Times, 05-15-2001).
    Find businesses that are pro gun and those that aren't. Support Friend or Foe by using it!

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    Campaign Veteran Verd's Avatar
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    HJR 49

    HJR 49 -- RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS

    SPONSOR: Brattin

    COMMITTEE ACTION: Voted "do pass" by the Committee on General
    Laws by a vote of 5 to 4.

    Upon voter approval, this proposed constitutional amendment
    specifies that the right of every citizen to possess, purchase,
    reload, or manufacture ammunition and any other parts or articles
    essential to the proper functioning of arms must not be infringed
    nor the amounts limited.

    FISCAL NOTE: Estimated Net Effect on General Revenue Fund of an
    income of $0 or a cost of More than $7,000,000 in FY 2013, an
    income of $0 in FY 2014, and an income of $0 in FY 2015. No
    impact on Other State Funds in FY 2013, FY 2014, and FY 2015.

    PROPONENTS: Supporters say that many groups are attempting to
    suppress this right since ammunition is currently not expressly
    protected in our State Constitution. The state needs to be on
    the forefront in protecting this important United States
    Constitution Second Amendment right.

    Testifying for the bill were Representative Brattin; and
    Missourians for Personal Safety.

    OPPONENTS: There was no opposition voiced to the committee.
    Looks like this one should get passed!
    One loves to possess arms, though they hope never to have occasion for them. Thomas Jefferson to George Washington, 1796.
    If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun. - Dalai Lama (Seattle Times, 05-15-2001).
    Find businesses that are pro gun and those that aren't. Support Friend or Foe by using it!

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    Campaign Veteran Verd's Avatar
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    HB 1621 update
    Summary of the Committee Version of the Bill

    HB 1621 -- DISCRIMINATION AGAINST PERSONS FOR THE LAWFUL CARRY OR

    USE OF FIREARMS

    SPONSOR: Brown (116)

    COMMITTEE ACTION: Voted "do pass" by the Committee on General

    Laws by a vote of 9 to 3.

    This bill specifies that it will be an unlawful employment

    practice for an employer to discriminate against an individual

    who has a concealed carry endorsement or uses his or her firearm

    for a lawful purpose including, but not limited to, self defense

    by failing or refusing to hire or to discharge any employee;

    discriminating with respect to his or her compensation, terms,

    conditions, or privileges; or limiting, segregating, or

    classifying employees or applicants in any way which would

    deprive or otherwise adversely affect his or her status as an

    employee.

    These provisions cannot require employers to allow the carrying

    and use of weapons on their property except as mandated by other

    law or to grant preferential treatment to employees that hold

    concealed carry endorsements or own firearms.

    FISCAL NOTE: No impact on state funds in FY 2013, FY 2014, and

    FY 2015.

    PROPONENTS: Supporters say that the bill prevents employers from

    discriminating against any employee who lawfully carries a

    concealed weapon but does not require an employer to allow an

    employee to carry a concealed weapon on the businessís premises.

    No other state currently has this kind of provision and the bill

    places Missouri at the forefront in providing this protection to

    employees.

    Testifying for the bill were Representative Brown (116); National

    Rifle Association - Institute for Legislative Action; and

    Missourians for Personal Safety.

    OPPONENTS: There was no opposition voiced to the committee.
    One loves to possess arms, though they hope never to have occasion for them. Thomas Jefferson to George Washington, 1796.
    If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun. - Dalai Lama (Seattle Times, 05-15-2001).
    Find businesses that are pro gun and those that aren't. Support Friend or Foe by using it!

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    Campaign Veteran Verd's Avatar
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    Two of the OC Preemption bills were moved to committee on 3/8 to the General Laws Committee (HB 1589 and HB 1618). I am still very optimistic about one of these bills making it to the Senate as they are currently written.
    One loves to possess arms, though they hope never to have occasion for them. Thomas Jefferson to George Washington, 1796.
    If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun. - Dalai Lama (Seattle Times, 05-15-2001).
    Find businesses that are pro gun and those that aren't. Support Friend or Foe by using it!

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    Campaign Veteran Verd's Avatar
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    Have to say, seriously surprised that there are two stickied threads about SB680 and yet this thread which talks about all three of the open carry preemption bills as well as all the other gun bills that are not directly related to conceal carry is not stickied.

    Disappointed to say the least.
    One loves to possess arms, though they hope never to have occasion for them. Thomas Jefferson to George Washington, 1796.
    If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun. - Dalai Lama (Seattle Times, 05-15-2001).
    Find businesses that are pro gun and those that aren't. Support Friend or Foe by using it!

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    I am with you...Needs a sticky!!

    Please sticky this thread!!
    GOD gave me rights!!!....The Constitutuion just confirms it!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by zekester View Post
    Please sticky this thread!!
    Second this... Bump..

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    Regular Member mspgunner's Avatar
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    I hope you are all going to Gun Day at the capitol April 18th. They don't know what ou want if you don't tell them. This is the day to do it, along with a few hundred other folks!
    If you pull it, you use it. If you pull it and you don't use it, you've done some thing wrong and you might not get another chance. Think about it before you pack it!
    I worked 24/7 for 2A OC rights! Don't like what I did? Try it yourself, it was my full time job!
    Certified NRA Range Safety Officer - RSO

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    Campaign Veteran Verd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mspgunner View Post
    I hope you are all going to Gun Day at the capitol April 18th. They don't know what ou want if you don't tell them. This is the day to do it, along with a few hundred other folks!
    Then this thread will get stickied? Because it would be much more helpful if people who went to Gun Day on the 18th knew to ask for more than SB680, you know, maybe ask for their wants for the others (THREE TOTAL) open carry bills. Maybe they might like to ask for the other gun bills that are in this thread that most of which have stalled. You know, just maybe.
    One loves to possess arms, though they hope never to have occasion for them. Thomas Jefferson to George Washington, 1796.
    If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun. - Dalai Lama (Seattle Times, 05-15-2001).
    Find businesses that are pro gun and those that aren't. Support Friend or Foe by using it!

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    Campaign Veteran Verd's Avatar
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    HJR 49 Update: 4/12/2012 - Reported to the Senate and First Read (S)

    This means it is that much closer to becoming a law.

    HB 1621 Update: 4/11/2012 - Public Hearing Held (S)
    One loves to possess arms, though they hope never to have occasion for them. Thomas Jefferson to George Washington, 1796.
    If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun. - Dalai Lama (Seattle Times, 05-15-2001).
    Find businesses that are pro gun and those that aren't. Support Friend or Foe by using it!

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    Regular Member usmcbess's Avatar
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    Who' offices should I contact to let know I support these bills and urge them to do so? I live in Villa Ridge. I wanna do my part to get OC preempted!

  24. #24
    Campaign Veteran Verd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by usmcbess View Post
    Who' offices should I contact to let know I support these bills and urge them to do so? I live in Villa Ridge. I wanna do my part to get OC preempted!
    Your senators and representatives in Missouri. You can make sure which ones are representing your area by using your zip code.
    One loves to possess arms, though they hope never to have occasion for them. Thomas Jefferson to George Washington, 1796.
    If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun. - Dalai Lama (Seattle Times, 05-15-2001).
    Find businesses that are pro gun and those that aren't. Support Friend or Foe by using it!

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