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Thread: Morgantown Mall OC issues, building isnt posted...

  1. #1
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    Morgantown Mall OC issues, building isnt posted...

    Morgantown Mall and open carry allowed, banned??
    I am a frequent visitor to the "Big Mall" here in town. I have been exercising my right to OC for over a year since I retired from the military. I have been a weekly visitor there to socialize with friends and to shop. In the year i have been OC in there I have never had a member of security stop me or heard of any complaints about my OC, I have been asked and then explained that WV law says i can as a law abiding citizen and legally own my handgun and then OC as long as its not posted. Recently while there I was in a shop with several friends when the head of mall security and another security person came in and asked me, "Why are you wearing that?" my reply was because the law says i can, this building isnt posted on any of its entrances. He then informed me the D entrance is the main mall entrance and that its posted there(Its not). He proceded to tell me he has been meaning to talk to me several times over it, yet never has any of his security people said a word about it when we've been in casual conversation and one of them was present. He then handed me a small card with the mall code of conduct on it. The specific code he pointed out states "Openly carrying instruments that could be used to cause injury to another person" and he said the property owner has the right to say i cant OC. I agreed that the owner can, but that they also have to post it legally in a noticable location so people can obey the law. He made no comment on my statement. He then left, didnt ask me to leave or check it in, he just left.
    I went to the mall three times this week to see if the doors have been posted yet, they still havent. I was informed by the shop owner i frequent, that the head of security has said, he will just call the state police and have me arrested if he sees me OC again. 2 of the trips I saw plenty of the security people walking laps in the mall. I went in again friday, and was only in there about 5 minutes when i noticed the head of security, watching me from the main hallway. he then cam into the store, and was oobviously looking to see if i was carrying. He then left, but came back an hour later, and again tried to see if i was carrying. he left again, an hour after that one of the security people came in, and again in looked to see if i was carrying. Now granted they may actually have been checking out the store, but they deliberately did a circuit of where i was to check me from all sides. Nothing was said as i left the weapon secured in my vehicle, and went in with an empty holster.
    So after this tale my question is, what part of state code 67, says he can lie about the posting, not post OC signs, and then continually come very close to harassment in checking me for OC. I do know the part of the code that says the property owner can ask me to leave it off or check it in. But I need the part to show the mall that they have to legally post it to stop OC. I am abiding by the property owners "request" but I refuse to let them violate my right if they are just jealous i have a weapon they dont. I would also like to know if anyone else who exercises OC in there has seen a posted sign, or been stopped as of yet. I dont want someone to walk into a hornets nest that i seem to have caused. I wasnt the only person in there carrying at the time, a friend who is US military, had his OC as well.
    I thank you for taking the time to read this, and any help you can shed on the subject.

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    sir i am not well enough educated on all the laws as yet, im learning everyday, thats why im wanting a meet and greet with some more experienced OC's in the near future. It would seem to me that if an agent working for the property owner, ask you not to OC then verble warning has been given and thus you would be breaking the law and could face penelty's.

    Now this is only my opion, I hope some people with more knowledge can answer more indepth.

    im going to try to make me a wallet size card stating case law to have on hand so as to give real and reasonable answers to LEO or a rent a cop.
    I am not a gun nut, nor am I a nut with a gun
    I simply rufuse to be a helpless victim, I may be unable to stop myself from being a victim but at least I wont be helpless

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    Sounds like a bunch of us need to fire off some emails letting the owner know that we , our families and our friends will no longer shop there if OC is banned.
    "Let your gun be your constant companion during your walks" ~Thomas Jefferson

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    We got to take a stand, our Sherrif said open carry is just so unusual, I told him we have had 2 home invasions in houses I can hit with a rock from my porch it's not that UNUSUAL
    I am not a gun nut, nor am I a nut with a gun
    I simply rufuse to be a helpless victim, I may be unable to stop myself from being a victim but at least I wont be helpless

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    Regular Member Sig229's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eamelhorn View Post
    We got to take a stand, our Sherrif said open carry is just so unusual, I told him we have had 2 home invasions in houses I can hit with a rock from my porch it's not that UNUSUAL
    Seeing a UFO is "unusual".
    Open carry of a firearm is "legal".

    Why are WV and S.W.PA Police Officers so damn hardheaded? I have never encountered police officers like the ones in this area. They act like they are CIA or FBI agents running around.
    Ive lived in 13 states, and except for a few Baltimore city cops, these morons around here take the cake.

    And I dont want to be labeled as a cop hater, my cousin is a LEO and also is on the Bomb Squad in Madison Wisconsin and my father was a Railroad Police for CSX.





    .
    "Let your gun be your constant companion during your walks" ~Thomas Jefferson

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    I am respecting the property owners wishes by not open carrying in there. But it took a year for them to say something, which is very odd to me. I've gone to everydoor and taken pics, an they are not posted as of last sunday night. With htat little circle slash over a pistol sign. Ive sent a few emails, my friends wife has sent a few nice ones, but they are ignoring her. I personally believe its the head of security whos making it an issue. He has to ask a wearer to sign it in or secure it before they can call the police on you. If any of you go to the mall, be careful. And if you find out anything please share.

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    Cool Open Carry in the Mall.

    Quote Originally Posted by SgtMac View Post
    Morgantown Mall and open carry allowed, banned??
    I am a frequent visitor to the "Big Mall" here in town. I have been exercising my right to OC for over a year since I retired from the military. I have been a weekly visitor there to socialize with friends and to shop. In the year i have been OC in there I have never had a member of security stop me or heard of any complaints about my OC, I have been asked and then explained that WV law says i can as a law abiding citizen and legally own my handgun and then OC as long as its not posted. Recently while there I was in a shop with several friends when the head of mall security and another security person came in and asked me, "Why are you wearing that?" my reply was because the law says i can, this building isnt posted on any of its entrances. He then informed me the D entrance is the main mall entrance and that its posted there(Its not). He proceded to tell me he has been meaning to talk to me several times over it, yet never has any of his security people said a word about it when we've been in casual conversation and one of them was present. He then handed me a small card with the mall code of conduct on it. The specific code he pointed out states "Openly carrying instruments that could be used to cause injury to another person" and he said the property owner has the right to say i cant OC. I agreed that the owner can, but that they also have to post it legally in a noticable location so people can obey the law. He made no comment on my statement. He then left, didnt ask me to leave or check it in, he just left.
    I went to the mall three times this week to see if the doors have been posted yet, they still havent. I was informed by the shop owner i frequent, that the head of security has said, he will just call the state police and have me arrested if he sees me OC again. 2 of the trips I saw plenty of the security people walking laps in the mall. I went in again friday, and was only in there about 5 minutes when i noticed the head of security, watching me from the main hallway. he then cam into the store, and was oobviously looking to see if i was carrying. He then left, but came back an hour later, and again tried to see if i was carrying. he left again, an hour after that one of the security people came in, and again in looked to see if i was carrying. Now granted they may actually have been checking out the store, but they deliberately did a circuit of where i was to check me from all sides. Nothing was said as i left the weapon secured in my vehicle, and went in with an empty holster.
    So after this tale my question is, what part of state code 67, says he can lie about the posting, not post OC signs, and then continually come very close to harassment in checking me for OC. I do know the part of the code that says the property owner can ask me to leave it off or check it in. But I need the part to show the mall that they have to legally post it to stop OC. I am abiding by the property owners "request" but I refuse to let them violate my right if they are just jealous i have a weapon they dont. I would also like to know if anyone else who exercises OC in there has seen a posted sign, or been stopped as of yet. I dont want someone to walk into a hornets nest that i seem to have caused. I wasnt the only person in there carrying at the time, a friend who is US military, had his OC as well.
    I thank you for taking the time to read this, and any help you can shed on the subject.
    I checked the code of conduct sign, at the Morgantown Mall entrance D, it is there and clearly states that know one may carry any kind of weapon in the Mall. This sign has been mounted on the wall at all entrances, ever since I moved here in 1998. You may note the water damage at the bottom of the sign for signs of it's age. Oh and I did notice that the sign is missing from entrance A, but it was there last year, I remember reading it after a smoke break from shopping. It is my understanding of the law that a property owner can deny access to their property by persons who OC. Remember your rights end where another's begin. Good luck finding OC carry properties.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SilentScream View Post
    I checked the code of conduct sign, at the Morgantown Mall entrance D, it is there and clearly states that know one may carry any kind of weapon in the Mall. This sign has been mounted on the wall at all entrances, ever since I moved here in 1998. You may note the water damage at the bottom of the sign for signs of it's age. Oh and I did notice that the sign is missing from entrance A, but it was there last year, I remember reading it after a smoke break from shopping. It is my understanding of the law that a property owner can deny access to their property by persons who OC. Remember your rights end where another's begin. Good luck finding OC carry properties.
    The sign is on the inside of the mall where you do not see it when you enter the property. Im not disagreeing with the landowners right to say, please dont carry. My point is mark the building correctly so legal open carry people do not get into trouble. It says nothing about conceal carry on the property though. I'll be in there tonight waiting to see if i get harassed again. Thanks to you all for reading nad commenting on this. If anyone has the state code that shows the way its supposed to be posted still looking for that.

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    Actually...

    Quote Originally Posted by SgtMac View Post
    The sign is on the inside of the mall where you do not see it when you enter the property. Im not disagreeing with the landowners right to say, please dont carry. My point is mark the building correctly so legal open carry people do not get into trouble. It says nothing about conceal carry on the property though. I'll be in there tonight waiting to see if i get harassed again. Thanks to you all for reading nad commenting on this. If anyone has the state code that shows the way its supposed to be posted still looking for that.
    SgtMac,

    It's a little-known loophole in the WV state code that those little "no gun" signs don't mean a thing on private property. Even if those signs are posted, unless an official of the private property approaches you and asks you to leave the premises or check your firearm, it is not illegal to carry - i repeat, even IF the signs are on the door! Even then, it isn't a firearms charge; it is simply trespassing. PA's gun laws are VERY similar to those in WV, and the signs operate similarly there - they have no legal bearing.

    Public property where those are posted (courthouses, etc.) DO have legal bearing, so be aware of whether you're on public or private property.

    I am not an attorney nor am I dispensing legal advice, this is just my interpretation of the law.
    Last edited by lwheatcraft; 02-24-2012 at 01:59 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SgtMac View Post
    Morgantown Mall and open carry allowed, banned??
    I am a frequent visitor to the "Big Mall" here in town. I have been exercising my right to OC for over a year since I retired from the military. I have been a weekly visitor there to socialize with friends and to shop. In the year i have been OC in there I have never had a member of security stop me or heard of any complaints about my OC, I have been asked and then explained that WV law says i can as a law abiding citizen and legally own my handgun and then OC as long as its not posted. Recently while there I was in a shop with several friends when the head of mall security and another security person came in and asked me, "Why are you wearing that?" my reply was because the law says i can, this building isnt posted on any of its entrances. He then informed me the D entrance is the main mall entrance and that its posted there(Its not). He proceded to tell me he has been meaning to talk to me several times over it, yet never has any of his security people said a word about it when we've been in casual conversation and one of them was present. He then handed me a small card with the mall code of conduct on it. The specific code he pointed out states "Openly carrying instruments that could be used to cause injury to another person" and he said the property owner has the right to say i cant OC. I agreed that the owner can, but that they also have to post it legally in a noticable location so people can obey the law. He made no comment on my statement. He then left, didnt ask me to leave or check it in, he just left.
    I went to the mall three times this week to see if the doors have been posted yet, they still havent. I was informed by the shop owner i frequent, that the head of security has said, he will just call the state police and have me arrested if he sees me OC again. 2 of the trips I saw plenty of the security people walking laps in the mall. I went in again friday, and was only in there about 5 minutes when i noticed the head of security, watching me from the main hallway. he then cam into the store, and was oobviously looking to see if i was carrying. He then left, but came back an hour later, and again tried to see if i was carrying. he left again, an hour after that one of the security people came in, and again in looked to see if i was carrying. Now granted they may actually have been checking out the store, but they deliberately did a circuit of where i was to check me from all sides. Nothing was said as i left the weapon secured in my vehicle, and went in with an empty holster.
    So after this tale my question is, what part of state code 67, says he can lie about the posting, not post OC signs, and then continually come very close to harassment in checking me for OC. I do know the part of the code that says the property owner can ask me to leave it off or check it in. But I need the part to show the mall that they have to legally post it to stop OC. I am abiding by the property owners "request" but I refuse to let them violate my right if they are just jealous i have a weapon they dont. I would also like to know if anyone else who exercises OC in there has seen a posted sign, or been stopped as of yet. I dont want someone to walk into a hornets nest that i seem to have caused. I wasnt the only person in there carrying at the time, a friend who is US military, had his OC as well.
    I thank you for taking the time to read this, and any help you can shed on the subject.
    sounds like they were just attacking you my friend..you said they didnt have signs posted? but the owner did tell you that he doesnt allow it? hmmm well they definitely have things messed up there because i can go there and open carry since they havent told me..if theres no signs posted then your good unless they say otherwise..if this is the case i say we need to get as many OCers there at one time in a group and see what happens lol..not sure if that sounds stupid or not but hes only applying the rule to one person at a time right now with failing to put signs up...if they dont like it move a state down to maryland..they'll get along with them just fine

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    Sir,
    I applaud you for exercising your right, however I would like to point out a couple of things. I'm pointing this out not to embarrass or belittle you but because everytime one of us makes a mistake like this it gives the anti weapon folks ammo to use. They can be wrong all the time with no ill effect but it only take being wrong once by one of us to cast a shadow on CW/OC as a whole. we have to do things better and cleaner then the other guy so to speak.


    Quote Originally Posted by SgtMac View Post
    I have been asked and then explained that WV law says i can as a law abiding citizen and legally own my handgun and then OC as long as its not posted.
    This statement is incorrect on two parts.
    One: WV does not have a Open carry law, It is common that what is not restricted by law is allowed. so by saying "WV law says" is not correct.
    Two: WV has NO signage requirements dealing with size, shape, color, location or placement. posting of a no weapons signs is a courtesy not a requirement.

    Contact JimMullinsWVCDL on here, he's an attorney in WV that knows the laws dealing with CW / OC


    I am not an attorney nor am I dispensing legal advice
    Last edited by wvguy; 02-29-2012 at 03:29 AM.

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    1) I'm a some-time resident, but not licensed to practice law, in West Virginia.

    2) Chances are that if they have you arrested for going to that mall, they're going to rely on the fact that they gave you notice in person when that security guy handed you the printed card with the "code of conduct" on it. Generally speaking, when you have actual notice of the landowner's conditions for "licensing" you to be on the property, and you violate the conditions, then you're trespassing. If they gave you actual notice and you persist in the trespassory act, that's punishable as a crime.

    3) Let's all vote with our dollars. I'll never go into the Morgantown Mall again (it's on the way to my farm, and a convenient stop off for me, btw, and near the law school where I occasionally take required continuing education courses) unless and until I hear they've lifted that policy. Just don't buy anything in that mall, and tell everyone you know why.
    Daniel L. Hawes - 540 347 2430 - HTTP://www.VirginiaLegalDefense.com

    By the way, nothing I say on this website as "user" should be taken as either advertising for attorney services or legal advice, merely personal opinion. Everyone having a question regarding the application of law to the facts of their situation should seek the advice of an attorney competent in the subject matter of the issues presented and licensed to practice in the relevant state.

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    I dont know the if they are making it a personal issue or not. I havent been in there in a few weeks, but im planning on going in tomorrow. Mostly to see if they are still looking for just me or not. But if anyone goes in there open carry, just know that the head of security has stated he wont warn anyone, just call the state police and have the carrier arrested. I havent been able to get back into looking up the laws, but I saw somewhere that, they have to post signs so you know its a no carry location. Its a law 'wiggle room" fight if its pressed, but i am thinking it does need pressed. Ive just been taking the mag out and taking the slide off, then storing them about my person when i go in. So im not actually carrying a weapon, just parts. I do use the phrase law interchangeably with state code, so I do apologize on that one.
    Last edited by SgtMac; 03-01-2012 at 05:34 PM.

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    To show where I am coming from on this issue i redid some homework...

    The Constitution of West Virginia protects the right of the people to keep and bear arms.[3] West Virginia preempts local regulation of several aspects of firearms, though local regulations which were in effect prior to 1999 were grandfathered.[1][2][4] Further, State agencies and institutions are not precluded from enacting laws which regulate firearms.[5] Charleston, Dunbar, and South Charleston are known to have grandfathered local ordinances which prohibit weapons on city property and in city buildings. The City of Martinsburg is known to have a local ordinance that was passed after 1999, which prohibits weapons in city buildings, that is not grandfathered.[6][7][8]

    There are no firearms known to be prohibited by State law. Prohibited places include correctional facilities, primary and secondary school property; buses; and events, courthouses, the State Capitol Complex and grounds, private property where posted, certain areas in Charleston, Dunbar, and South Charleston.[9] There are age restrictions on the possession of firearms and some people are prohibited from possessing firearms due to certain criminal convictions or naturalization status. Private sales of firearms, including handguns, are legal and do not require the seller to perform a background check; however, it is unlawful to sell a firearm to a prohibited person.[1][2]

    Open carry of a handgun without a permit is legal in West Virginia at age 18, withstanding other applicable laws. Concealed carry of a handgun is prohibited except for persons who hold a valid license or who hold certain positions. West Virginia shall issue a license to carry a concealed handgun to applicants over 21 years of age; or 18 years of age if required for employment; provided that they meet certain safety training requirements and do not have any disqualifying criminal convictions.[1][2]

    West Virginia enacted the castle doctrine on April 10, 2008.[10]

    West Virginia Constitution – Article III, §3–22. Right to keep and bear arms. A person has the right to keep and bear arms for the defense of self, family, home and state, and for lawful hunting and recreational use.

    §8-12-5a. Limitations upon municipalities' power (...) Localities may not regulate the purchase, possession, transfer, ownership, carry, transportation, sale or storage of any revolver, pistol, rifle or shotgun or any ammunition or ammunition components, except ordinances that were in place prior to 1999.[6]

    §61–7–14. Right of certain persons to limit possession of firearms on premises. Private property, where posted

    As I am a mostly law abiding citizen,( I speed and illegal u turn a lot) I want to know laws, state statutes, ordinances, so that I am not adding to the headache, but helping find the cure so to speak. IF any of you reading this have links please shoot them my way. I'm off to my conceal carry class. Take care.

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    Quote Originally Posted by user View Post

    3) Let's all vote with our dollars. I'll never go into the Morgantown Mall again (it's on the way to my farm, and a convenient stop off for me, btw, and near the law school where I occasionally take required continuing education courses) unless and until I hear they've lifted that policy. Just don't buy anything in that mall, and tell everyone you know why.
    Thats a very good idea. However, I have found that works best when the owner/manager knows why you are choosing not to shop there.

    Let get some contact info and start telling them why we, our families and all of our friends are going to stop shopping there.
    "Let your gun be your constant companion during your walks" ~Thomas Jefferson

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sig229 View Post
    Thats a very good idea. However, I have found that works best when the owner/manager knows why you are choosing not to shop there.

    Let get some contact info and start telling them why we, our families and all of our friends are going to stop shopping there.
    My wife has the contact numbers, i'll try to get her to post them in here tomorrow. I know the mall owner is a company out of ohio, and the mall office is pretty much useless.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SgtMac View Post
    §61–7–14. Right of certain persons to limit possession of firearms on premises. Private property, where posted
    Below is §61-7-14 in its entirety. Show me where it states "Where Posted", You can't cause its not part of WV law at this time. You have been informed that WV has NO signage requirements, that posting of a no weapons signs is a courtesy not a requirement. It has been suggested you talk with JimMullinsWVCDL an attorney on here and yet you continue to insist someone has to post a sign. If you continue in that belief you will end up getting yourself in trouble and you only have yourself to blame.

    source: http://www.legis.state.wv.us/WVCODE/...&section=14#07


    §61-7-14. Right of certain persons to limit possession of firearms on premises.
    Notwithstanding the provisions of this article, any owner, lessee or other person charged with the care, custody and control of real property may prohibit the carrying openly or concealed of any firearm or deadly weapon on property under his or her domain: Provided, That for purposes of this section "person" means an individual or any entity which may acquire title to real property.

    Any person carrying or possessing a firearm or other deadly weapon on the property of another who refuses to temporarily relinquish possession of such firearm or other deadly weapon, upon being requested to do so, or to leave such premises, while in possession of such firearm or other deadly weapon, shall be guilty of a misdemeanor, and, upon conviction thereof, shall be fined not more than one thousand dollars or confined in the county jail not more than six months, or both: Provided, That the provisions of this section shall not apply to those persons set forth in subsections (3) through (6) of section six of this code while such persons are acting in an official capacity: Provided, however, That under no circumstances may any person possess or carry or cause the possession or carrying of any firearm or other deadly weapon on the premises of any primary or secondary educational facility in this state unless such person is a law-enforcement officer or he or she has the express written permission of the county school superintendent.


    One more thing.. If convicted under this section the sheriff could use that conviction as justification to revoke and/or refuse you a CCW permit.



    I am not an attorney nor am I dispensing legal advice .
    Last edited by wvguy; 03-04-2012 at 03:25 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by user View Post
    1) I'm a some-time resident, but not licensed to practice law, in West Virginia.

    2) Chances are that if they have you arrested for going to that mall, they're going to rely on the fact that they gave you notice in person when that security guy handed you the printed card with the "code of conduct" on it. Generally speaking, when you have actual notice of the landowner's conditions for "licensing" you to be on the property, and you violate the conditions, then you're trespassing. If they gave you actual notice and you persist in the trespassory act, that's punishable as a crime.

    In WV it wouldn't be tresspass since its covered by its own code 61-7-14 http://www.legis.state.wv.us/WVCODE/...&section=14#07

    What’s funny about WV trespass law is a person can only be trespassed by Law Enforcement and they have to refuse to leave before its a crime. Even if the property owner tells me 100 times i'm trespassing. its not chargeable till LE tells me i'm trespassing and I refuse to leave, If I leave at that point its over.





    I am not an attorney nor am I dispensing legal advice . .
    Last edited by wvguy; 03-04-2012 at 03:45 AM.

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    In this discussion there have been alot of statement as to private property rights, and I would like to remind everyone, the rights to private property, that is like your own home, are not the same as the rights to private property of public accommodation.

    "Public Accommodation" does not mean just a motel or hotel, it means any place that is open to the public to visit without restriction, any retail also fits that discription.

    Think of it this way: Can a Mall restrict your access because you are a black, white, man, women...etc? No? Then (reguardless of whatever the law says) That mall cannot legally restrict your freedom of speech or your legal ability to carry for self defence.

    All of this law came from when the south tried to restrict the travel of blacks after the civil war. Basically, as a place of public accommodation, the mall realy is not "private property" in the manner your house is....(unless you just let anyone that comes along randomly enter your house, in which case you would not be covered by the 4th ammendment either)...but then that is your business.

    Think about it. All this talk about "private Property"...is it really "Private" or is it a "place of public accommodation"? Places like SAMs club and Costco, may have an argument, as they are a private, members only club, but their argument would be weak. Ever wonder why Wal-Mart and SAMs club's have a "state law" policy when it comes to legally carried guns? I would bet their lawyers see a "public accommodation" law suit in not following that type of policy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hermannr View Post
    In this discussion there have been alot of statement as to private property rights, and I would like to remind everyone, the rights to private property, that is like your own home, are not the same as the rights to private property of public accommodation.

    "Public Accommodation" does not mean just a motel or hotel, it means any place that is open to the public to visit without restriction, any retail also fits that discription.

    Think of it this way: Can a Mall restrict your access because you are a black, white, man, women...etc? No? Then (reguardless of whatever the law says) That mall cannot legally restrict your freedom of speech or your legal ability to carry for self defence.

    All of this law came from when the south tried to restrict the travel of blacks after the civil war. Basically, as a place of public accommodation, the mall realy is not "private property" in the manner your house is....(unless you just let anyone that comes along randomly enter your house, in which case you would not be covered by the 4th ammendment either)...but then that is your business.

    Think about it. All this talk about "private Property"...is it really "Private" or is it a "place of public accommodation"? Places like SAMs club and Costco, may have an argument, as they are a private, members only club, but their argument would be weak. Ever wonder why Wal-Mart and SAMs club's have a "state law" policy when it comes to legally carried guns? I would bet their lawyers see a "public accommodation" law suit in not following that type of policy.

    That may be the case where you are from but remember the law is different in each state and in WV even "a place of public accommodation", malls, department stores, banks, Etc. Etc. can claim the same rights as any other property owner. I recall not long ago WVCDL was working on Legislation to make it so any place used for the public such as stores and malls can't restrict but to date property owners of all types (except cities covered by the state exemption law) can restrict that’s just the fact of it.

    As for your Civil rights argument the US Supreme Court has upheld what they call reasonable restrictions to your civil rights. Such as yelling fire in a crowd when there isn’t a fire isn't protected free speech.

    Don’t get me wrong I agree places open to the public should not be able to restrict but that is not how it is at this time.

  21. #21
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Morgantown WV
    Posts
    10
    [QUOTE=wvguy;1714139]Below is §61-7-14 in its entirety. Show me where it states "Where Posted", You can't cause its not part of WV law at this time. You have been informed that WV has NO signage requirements, that posting of a no weapons signs is a courtesy not a requirement. It has been suggested you talk with JimMullinsWVCDL an attorney on here and yet you continue to insist someone has to post a sign. If you continue in that belief you will end up getting yourself in trouble and you only have yourself to blame.

    source: http://www.legis.state.wv.us/WVCODE/...&section=14#07

    I allready know this code and admit i follow it. I havent contacted Mr. Mullins as of yet becuase life is taking too much time for me. I plan on contacting him after I finish my 2 cent ramble here though, professional advice is usually a great help. But as for the posting Even the conceal carry class I took the instructors paperwork states buildings must be clearly marked. So ok maybe in chasing a ghost on the marked buildings, but that brings the question this, Im legally open carrying, and i walk into BW3's somewhere, no one says anthing, and then im confronted by uniformed police for carrying. How do I know its not legal to carry without posted signage? if there is no signage requirement, why do several locations have it like Toy R Us. My Bank and local citybuilding have no signage and allow open carry. This is amine field I want to be able to get through in one piece, thats why i posted here. As i've repeatedly stated, This isnt about me getting one over on that mall, its getting that place so any law abiding citizen doesnt walk into a time bomb going in there open carrying. I want to lean and under stand, hence i keep posting. I thank you all for your input.
    Last edited by SgtMac; 03-19-2012 at 09:08 AM.

  22. #22
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Clarksburg,WV, ,
    Posts
    17
    [QUOTE=SgtMac;1723002]
    Quote Originally Posted by wvguy View Post
    Below is §61-7-14 in its entirety. Show me where it states "Where Posted", You can't cause its not part of WV law at this time. You have been informed that WV has NO signage requirements, that posting of a no weapons signs is a courtesy not a requirement. It has been suggested you talk with JimMullinsWVCDL an attorney on here and yet you continue to insist someone has to post a sign. If you continue in that belief you will end up getting yourself in trouble and you only have yourself to blame.

    source: http://www.legis.state.wv.us/WVCODE/...&section=14#07

    I allready know this code and admit i follow it. I havent contacted Mr. Mullins as of yet becuase life is taking too much time for me. I plan on contacting him after I finish my 2 cent ramble here though, professional advice is usually a great help. But as for the posting Even the conceal carry class I took the instructors paperwork states buildings must be clearly marked. So ok maybe in chasing a ghost on the marked buildings, but that brings the question this, Im legally open carrying, and i walk into BW3's somewhere, no one says anthing, and then im confronted by uniformed police for carrying. How do I know its not legal to carry without posted signage? if there is no signage requirement, why do several locations have it like Toy R Us. My Bank and local citybuilding have no signage and allow open carry. This is amine field I want to be able to get through in one piece, thats why i posted here. As i've repeatedly stated, This isnt about me getting one over on that mall, its getting that place so any law abiding citizen doesnt walk into a time bomb going in there open carrying. I want to lean and under stand, hence i keep posting. I thank you all for your input.
    As stated in WV there is no law what so ever about the use of off limits signs. If a sign is posted that is like the owner saying its off limits, If you go into a business and you aren't confronted then you are good to go. If at any point someone who has care, custody or control of that property asks you to leave while you are OC/CC then you must leave. be sure to ask Mr. Mullins about the signage and you'll see your CC class material is incorrect

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