TFred
Regular Member
Place holder for longer first post.
TFred
TFred
As most of us know, the CHP law grants localities the authority to require by statute that fingerprints must be submitted with one's first CHP application.
The last time I ever paid attention to any details, they were taking the prints on a card, and giving the card to the parents. No adding to "the system" of any kind. That would seem fine to me, parents could file away in a safe place, hopefully never to be needed, but there in case.How many kids have been fingerprinted in elementary school as part of an counter-kidnapping program? I remember it was very popular when I was a kid here. Only much, much later did I realize what was really going on there. IIRC, parental consent was required for the "program" and everybody gave it, of course.
The only reason that I am posting this is that there may be some small chance that there are others who are going through the same thought process that I did.
. . .
After my correspondence with the local Detective, I discovered that my thoughts on the role of prints in the CHP process were wrong. I was assured that the "ten prints" used for a CHP application are compared only to the database of known criminals, those who have prior records, and not against the "unknown data base of latent impressions."
. . .
TFred
Are you stating that if I leave prints at the scene of a burglary, then some time later apply for a CHP (assuming that they leave the requirement in place) that I will be caught?Um, no, once the prints are in the system, they stay for 99 years and US, state, local, and probabaly international police have access to them for investigations. Usually, one hopes, the prints help catch bad guys.
Sometimes, the authorities abuse their power and wrongfully accuse the innocent of being a criminal or terrorist. See http://forejustice.org/wc/mayfield/jd/brandon_mayfield_jd_issue25.htm
How many kids have been fingerprinted in elementary school as part of an counter-kidnapping program? I remember it was very popular when I was a kid here. Only much, much later did I realize what was really going on there. IIRC, parental consent was required for the "program" and everybody gave it, of course.
I suspect that the Fourth Amendment kicks in here somewhere. If they take prints which are voluntarily given for one specific purpose and use them for a completely different purpose without my permission, that would seem to violate the prohibition against reasonable searches.Hmmm. One part of me says prints should be checked against all databases. The other part of me says a CHP application shouldn't be a crimefighting tool. I'm surprised they don't take prints when we vote. Wait, that's a civil rights issue. My bad.
I suspect that the Fourth Amendment kicks in here somewhere. If they take prints which are voluntarily given for one specific purpose and use them for a completely different purpose without my permission, that would seem to violate the prohibition against reasonable searches.
One section of code that I think we tend to overlook is 15.2-915.3, which spells out a little more clearly the defined purpose for which a locality may require the fingerprinting for CHPs:
§ 15.2-915.3. Requiring fingerprinting for concealed handgun permit.
Notwithstanding § 15.2-915, a county or city may by ordinance require any applicant for a concealed handgun permit to submit to fingerprinting for the purpose of obtaining the applicant's state or national criminal history record; however, such ordinance shall not require fingerprinting for the renewal of an existing permit pursuant to subsection I of § 18.2-308.
That tells me that they are only authorized to use the prints to search for a past record, not for unsolved crimes.
TFred
That would directly contradict what the detective told me . . . .
TFred
Between the 30 years of military security clearences and civillian jobs in Law Enforcement and private security, I have ZERO chance of my prints NOT being on multiple systems.
If I were ever to become a criminal, I would have to always wear gloves.
Hell, I know I even have a DNC sample in the system.
Guess I better not become a criminal.
Between the 30 years of military security clearences and civillian jobs in Law Enforcement and private security, I have ZERO chance of my prints NOT being on multiple systems.
If I were ever to become a criminal, I would have to always wear gloves.
Hell, I know I even have a DNC sample in the system.
Guess I better not become a criminal.