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Companies new CCW policy - not sure they got this right.

tomm1963

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 28, 2008
Messages
176
Location
mke, ,
Weapons in Vehicles & Registration of Weapons Policy

The Wisconsin state law permits concealed carry weapons – handgun, electric weapon or knife other than a switchblade – in a vehicle while in company parking lots. While signage will prohibit weapons of any sort in or around our buildings, we will comply with the storage of a weapon in a vehicle while in company parking lots. However, employees and guests (contractors, vendors, suppliers, etc.) on the Campus must comply with these Company standards:

• Notify Security in person that you have or intend to periodically have a weapon in your vehicle, and provide a copy of a permit issued by the State of Wisconsin
• The firearm must be stored in a secure location such as a locked glove compartment or trunk
• All safety mechanisms must be installed and it is strongly preferred the firearm be unloaded while on company property
• While on Company property, the firearm shall never be in plain view
• If the weapon is a knife or other bladed weapon, the weapon will be sheathed and placed in a secure location of the vehicle where it cannot be seen in plain view

Note: Long guns, rifles, bow and arrows, or any other weapons or explosives that are not specifically identified as being a concealed carry weapon, are prohibited anytime and anywhere on the Milwaukee Campus.


Seems like this policy has some issues to address...
Can a private company actually demand to see my CCW permit in order to park in their lots???
Can they prohibit long guns in their lots? Say I go from work to trap shooting. Shotgun in trunk saves me a trip home between.
They also are forcing "conceal" but what if a person does not have a CCW permit and open carry's in their vehicle on the way to work.

I would like some input from the mass of knowledge lurking in this forum. Thanks
 

protias

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 18, 2008
Messages
7,308
Location
SE, WI
Weapons in Vehicles & Registration of Weapons Policy

The Wisconsin state law permits concealed carry weapons – handgun, electric weapon or knife other than a switchblade – in a vehicle while in company parking lots. While signage will prohibit weapons of any sort in or around our buildings, we will comply with the storage of a weapon in a vehicle while in company parking lots. However, employees and guests (contractors, vendors, suppliers, etc.) on the Campus must comply with these Company standards:

• Notify Security in person that you have or intend to periodically have a weapon in your vehicle, and provide a copy of a permit issued by the State of Wisconsin
• The firearm must be stored in a secure location such as a locked glove compartment or trunk
• All safety mechanisms must be installed and it is strongly preferred the firearm be unloaded while on company property
• While on Company property, the firearm shall never be in plain view
• If the weapon is a knife or other bladed weapon, the weapon will be sheathed and placed in a secure location of the vehicle where it cannot be seen in plain view

Note: Long guns, rifles, bow and arrows, or any other weapons or explosives that are not specifically identified as being a concealed carry weapon, are prohibited anytime and anywhere on the Milwaukee Campus.


Seems like this policy has some issues to address...
Can a private company actually demand to see my CCW permit in order to park in their lots???
Can they prohibit long guns in their lots? Say I go from work to trap shooting. Shotgun in trunk saves me a trip home between.
They also are forcing "conceal" but what if a person does not have a CCW permit and open carry's in their vehicle on the way to work.

I would like some input from the mass of knowledge lurking in this forum. Thanks

No
Yes
I don't know offhand.
 

tomm1963

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 28, 2008
Messages
176
Location
mke, ,
No
Yes
I don't know offhand.

Can you site where the law allows employers to ban long guns.
As i read act 35
(15m)(b) An employer may not prohibit a licensee or an
out−of−state licensee, as a condition of employment,
from carrying a concealed weapon, a particular type of
concealed weapon, or ammunition or from storing a
weapon, a particular type of weapon, or ammunition in
the licensee’s or out−of−state licensee’s own motor
vehicle, regardless of whether the motor vehicle is used
in the course of employment or whether the motor
vehicle is driven or parked on property used by the

"particular type of weapon" isn't a long gun a particular type of weapon?
 
H

Herr Heckler Koch

Guest
Carefully differentiate between matters of law and conditions of employment. Wisconsin is not a right-to-work state. ETA: Which is to say that you will likely have to take legal action to enforce your wishes against the employers policy. It will be interesting to see a goonion's position on this, vis-a-vis their usual prog-liberal bent.
 
Last edited:

protias

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 18, 2008
Messages
7,308
Location
SE, WI
Can you site where the law allows employers to ban long guns.
As i read act 35
(15m)(b) An employer may not prohibit a licensee or an
out−of−state licensee, as a condition of employment,
from carrying a concealed weapon, a particular type of
concealed weapon, or ammunition or from storing a
weapon, a particular type of weapon, or ammunition in
the licensee’s or out−of−state licensee’s own motor
vehicle, regardless of whether the motor vehicle is used
in the course of employment or whether the motor
vehicle is driven or parked on property used by the

"particular type of weapon" isn't a long gun a particular type of weapon?

Long guns are not covered under a CCL.

175.60 License to carry a concealed weapon. (1)
DEFINITIONS. In this section
(bm) “Handgun” means any weapon designed or
redesigned, or made or remade, and intended to be fired
while held in one hand and to use the energy of an explosive
to expel a projectile through a smooth or rifled bore.
“Handgun” does not include a machine gun, as defined
in s. 941.27 (1), a short−barreled rifle, as defined in s.
941.28 (1) (b), or a short−barreled shotgun, as defined in
s. 941.28 (1) (c).
 
H

Herr Heckler Koch

Guest
I believe his question is of storing a particular type of weapon. "An employer may not prohibit a licensee ..., as a condition of employment, ... from storing a ... particular type of weapon, in ... the licensee’s ... own motor vehicle, regardless ... "
 

skidmark

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Jan 15, 2007
Messages
10,444
Location
Valhalla
As I read things -

Can a private company actually demand to see my CCW permit in order to park in their lots??? - Yes. The law says the priviledge is extended only to licensees, thus your employer has a right to verify that you are a valid licensee.

Can they prohibit long guns in their lots? Say I go from work to trap shooting. Shotgun in trunk saves me a trip home between. - Hard to say with surity, but it reads as if the answer is "no". Their policy addresses both concealed weapons and weapons in general:
...that you have or intend to periodically have a weapon in your vehicle, and provide a copy of a permit issued by the State of Wisconsin.... [note - this fails to recognize valid out-of-state licenses, which may invalidate the entire policy. see a real attorney for a better understanding of that issue.]
The firearm must be stored ....

They also are forcing "conceal" but what if a person does not have a CCW permit and open carry's in their vehicle on the way to work. - The law only applies to licensees. Discussing the "common sense" aspect of not wanting to invite thievery/vandalism of their employees'/visitors' vehicles is beyond the point. They are not prohibited from refusing to allow those without a license from bringing firearms/weapons (as their policy addresses the matter) onto their property.

Go get your license. Even if you never carry concealed it seems to offer you worthwhile advantages.

stay safe.
 

tomm1963

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 28, 2008
Messages
176
Location
mke, ,
Long guns are not covered under a CCL.

It seems when the legislature wanted to spell out that a certain aspect of the law only covered "hand guns" they spelled it out.

167.31 (2) (b) Except as provided in sub. (4), no person
may place, possess, or transport a firearm, bow, or
crossbow in or on a vehicle, unless the firearm is a handgun,
as defined in s. 175.60 (1) (bm), unless the firearm
is unloaded and encased, or unless the bow or crossbow
is unstrung or is enclosed in a carrying case.


So when they say

"An employer may not prohibit a licensee...from storing a
weapon, a particular type of weapon, or ammunition in
the licensee’s or out−of−state licensee’s own motor
vehicle"

I read it that a licensee may store any weapon in their personal vehicle.

I agree with you Skidmark "Go get your license. Even if you never carry concealed it seems to offer you worthwhile advantages."

I was just pointing out the catch 22 situation for open-carriers. I still question if they can actually demand to see a license.
 

MKEgal

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 8, 2010
Messages
4,383
Location
in front of my computer, WI
A wonderful time to apply "don't ask, don't tell", especially the "don't tell" part.

tomm1963 said:
I still question if they can actually demand to see a license.
They can ask, you can deny having one to show them.
You don't carry it on your person at work, right? (The license, that is.)
If you do, this might be a good time to stop.
And it looks like you'd have to stop off the property, out of sight, to go from being able to protect yourself in your own car to having it in the safe & relying on whatever your employer has set up to protect everyone.
(Which, if they're like most places, is absolutely nothing.)
 

Dobb

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 26, 2010
Messages
34
Location
Milwaukee
a wonderful time to apply "don't ask, don't tell", especially the "don't tell" part.


They can ask, you can deny having one to show them.
You don't carry it on your person at work, right? (the license, that is.)
if you do, this might be a good time to stop.
And it looks like you'd have to stop off the property, out of sight, to go from being able to protect yourself in your own car to having it in the safe & relying on whatever your employer has set up to protect everyone.
(which, if they're like most places, is absolutely nothing.)


ftmw.
 

GreenCountyPete

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 18, 2009
Messages
145
Location
Green County, Wisconsin, USA
or park on the street , when my brother worked for Bobcat in North Dakota , bobcats corporate policy was no guns on company property , a public street ran thru the facility every one with a gun parked on the street.

this and other instances like it are the reason they wrote our CCL law to provide for employees being able to park and secure their cars
 

smithman

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 28, 2007
Messages
718
Location
Waukesha, Wisconsin, USA
My advice is to not give them any information and keep a long gun and ammo out of sight in the trunk. And don't talk about it to others at your company. They are really grasping at straws but it is way more hassle to try to change their minds then to just do it and shut up. Your liberty to have any firearm in your car is not dependent on your company's permission.
 

apjonas

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 11, 2006
Messages
1,157
Location
, ,
A Long Gun is not a Weapon

At least for this purpose.

175.60(j) “Weapon” means a handgun, an electric weapon,
as defined in s. 941.295 (1c) (a), a knife other than a
switchblade knife under s. 941.24, or a billy club.

Since your ability to store a weapon in your vehicle stems from possession of a CWL, it seems reasonable for your employer to verify that you have one.

The other requirements for storage may be permissible if they serve an important interest of the employer and don't substantially interfere with your ability to store your weapon under Act 35. For instance, notifying security once may be ok. Every time you drive on the lot, probably not. Storing in a safe manner = ok. Cleaning your pistol every time you arrive - no.

Whether or not a weapon must be hidden from plain view is a more difficult question. But why would anyone want to leave a weapon in the open anyway?

If you are not a licensee then you are subject to your employer's policy and good will.
 
Last edited:

apjonas

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Messages
1,157
Location
, ,
Lot of Factors but

Carefully differentiate between matters of law and conditions of employment. Wisconsin is not a right-to-work state. ETA: Which is to say that you will likely have to take legal action to enforce your wishes against the employers policy. It will be interesting to see a goonion's position on this, vis-a-vis their usual prog-liberal bent.

RTW really isn't relevant. Since storing a weapon in the car is really at the fringes of work-relatedness, a union probably wouldn't be to eager to jump into the fray. They generally don't like (anybody but their people) to have guns anyway.
 

bigdaddy1

Regular Member
Joined
May 7, 2009
Messages
1,320
Location
Southsider der hey
At least for this purpose.

175.60(j) “Weapon” means a handgun, an electric weapon,
as defined in s. 941.295 (1c) (a), a knife other than a
switchblade knife under s. 941.24, or a billy club.

Since your ability to store a weapon in your vehicle stems from possession of a CWL, it seems reasonable for your employer to verify that you have one.

The other requirements for storage may be permissible if they serve an important interest of the employer and don't substantially interfere with your ability to store your weapon under Act 35. For instance, notifying security once may be ok. Every time you drive on the lot, probably not. Storing in a safe manner = ok. Cleaning your pistol every time you arrive - no.

Whether or not a weapon must be hidden from plain view is a more difficult question. But why would anyone want to leave a weapon in the open anyway?

If you are not a licensee then you are subject to your employer's policy and good will.

That which is reasonable isn't always legal. Also if I am going skeet shooting after work and have my shotgun in the trunk I have still complied with the transportation law and any concealed carry license has no bearing. My employer has no legal right to search my car, therefore anything in my car does not pertain to my employer. Act 35 provides additional permissions with concealed carry but doesn't eliminate the transportation laws from before the law was signed.
 
Last edited:

hermannr

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Mar 24, 2011
Messages
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Location
Okanogan Highland
IMHO, it is none of their business if I have a permit/or not; if I have a pistol in my car, or not..privacy issue, I don't give a da## what they want, or why they want it, it is none of their business for an employee to do anything that is legal, that does not imact his work, or their security.

If they have a safety concern, and want you to wear steel toe boots, they can supply them. If you have a safety concern and you wish to wear steel toe boots in an office environment, it is none of their business. Boot's, your driver's license (unless you drive one of their cars) and guns are just somethings that are legal, that some companies want to regulate, but if you push back, they soon find they cannot.

The state says you can have a gun in your car, it is absolutely none of their business if you actually do or not. They can only do it if you allow them to. Does not WI state that permits are private? Keep them private.
 
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