MOC Members hassled in Capitol Area District Library

stainless1911 said:

Pregnant crying people, OCers shoving guns in peoples faces, what's next?

Click to expand...

LIBRARY REACTS TO GUN INCIDENTS: ENFORCEMENT OF LIBRARY GUN BAN IS FOR SAFETY OF ALL PATRONS
Since December 11, 2010, the Downtown Lansing location of the Capital Area District Library has been the site of regular visits by openly armed members of the group Michigan Open Carry (MOC). The MOC members have attempted to openly carry rifles and handguns in CADL’s Downtown Lansing library. “Carrying weapons is in direct violation of CADL’s Code of Conduct and is also causing a great deal of alarm and panic among staff and patrons” according to Lance Werner the Director of CADL. Most recently, a staff member was so terrified that she was unable to work and had to be removed from her shift at a public service desk.
CADL’s Code of Conduct states “All weapons are banned from Library premises to the fullest extent permitted by law”. Because the Capital Area District Library is an autonomous municipal entity under Michigan law, with policy making authority, the Board of Trustees has the ability to set policy that is legally enforceable. All public libraries have some type of Code of Conduct to ensure appropriate behavior and a safe environment for all visitors, adults and children. “CADL’s weapon’s policy will continue to be enforced unless the Board is otherwise instructed by a court of law” Werner said.
CADL contracts with Joseph A. Young & Associates to provide security services at our Downtown Lansing and South Lansing locations. In each instance where an openly armed member of MOC has visited the Downtown location, a security guard has asked the person to leave because carrying weapons in the library violates CADL’s Code of Conduct. Initially, these MOC visitors complied, but recently have refused to leave stating that they have the right to open carry in CADL locations. According to Werner, “At first, the Lansing Police Department was willing to help enforce CADL’s Code of Conduct with respect to the open carrying of firearms. Unfortunately, LPD stopped responding to CADL’s calls for assistance”.
As a result, CADL has had to solely rely on the expertise and willingness of security personnel from Joseph A. Young to manage conflicts arising from MOC armed visits. As a preventive measure, security guards are being placed with open carry visitors so as to avoid potential conflict with some of CADL’s patrons. One of the larger concerns is that patrons could misread a situation and attempt to disarm a gun carrying MOC visitor.
“It is very important to me that the safety of our customers and staff comes first” Werner said. “Sadly, the repeated attempts to violate CADL’s Code of Conduct by MOC members carrying weapons in to the library is making our goal of ‘safety first’ more costly for CADL” he added.
The Capital Area District Library system serves all of Ingham County with the exception of East Lansing. For more information, visit cadl.org.

Click to expand...

scot623 said:

http://www.lansingcitypulse.com/lans...re-scared.html

"The library also has had to hire more security guards because the Lansing Police Department “stopped responding to CADL’s calls for assistance.”"

Awe, man. Those damn police respecting the rights of OCers.

Click to expand...

TheQ said:

CADL Press Release Date 2011 Feb 9

(Emphasis added)


At least they concede they are a municipality...

Click to expand...

scot623 said:

http://www.lansingcitypulse.com/lans...re-scared.html

"The library also has had to hire more security guards because the Lansing Police Department “stopped responding to CADL’s calls for assistance.”"

Awe, man. Those damn police respecting the rights of OCers.

Click to expand...

smellslikemichigan said:

my favorite part of this whole thing is that the PD is no longer responding to the the "library that cried wolf"

Click to expand...

Bikenut said:

The library is fortunate there are no penalties attached to disobeying MCL 123.1102 because if there were penalties then the library would be calling the PD to help them enforce an illegal policy.... and the library's board that instituted said illegal policy would end up being arrested themselves. Oh sweet irony!

Which brings to my mind a question. Since MCL 123.1102 is an actual law, albeit without any penalties attached, wouldn't it be appropriate for LE at least issue a citation or notification of illegal behavior of some kind to those who disobey said law? I'm hoping someone with much more legal knowledge than I can answer that one.... or if it is even possible to put the offender on some kind of "notice".

It would be absolutely wonderful if a paper trail of a council engaging in illegal activity could be generated.

Click to expand...

TheQ said:

CADL Press Release Date 2011 Feb 9

(Emphasis added)


At least they concede they are a municipality...

Click to expand...

TheQ said:

Scott Webb on WILS 1320 AM Pt.1 and Pt. 2

I'm looking forward to Monday the 14th when Scott and Robb will both be in the studio and accepting calls from other people (General public)!

Click to expand...

Bikenut said:

The library is fortunate there are no penalties attached to disobeying MCL 123.1102 because if there were penalties then the library would be calling the PD to help them enforce an illegal policy.... and the library's board that instituted said illegal policy would end up being arrested themselves. Oh sweet irony!

Which brings to my mind a question. Since MCL 123.1102 is an actual law, albeit without any penalties attached, wouldn't it be appropriate for LE at least issue a citation or notification of illegal behavior of some kind to those who disobey said law? I'm hoping someone with much more legal knowledge than I can answer that one.... or if it is even possible to put the offender on some kind of "notice".

It would be absolutely wonderful if a paper trail of a council engaging in illegal activity could be generated.

Click to expand...

T Vance said:

I'm noticing a theme with all of these interviews. The interviewER seems to be asking the interviewEE about their personal need to carry. Now a majority of the interview is discussing reasons for carrying into a library, fears, etc...

Next time someone does an interview about this, they need to turn it around. Ask the interviewER why they are not questioning the real problem. Why is it that the library is blatently going against state law and why aren't they being held accountable? According to their own news letter, they admit they are a government entity! (see below)

Click to expand...

T Vance said:

I'm noticing a theme with all of these interviews. The interviewER seems to be asking the interviewEE about their personal need to carry. Now a majority of the interview is discussing reasons for carrying into a library, fears, etc...

Next time someone does an interview about this, they need to turn it around. Ask the interviewER why they are not questioning the real problem. Why is it that the library is blatently going against state law and why aren't they being held accountable? According to their own news letter, they admit they are a government entity! (see below)

http://www.cadl.org/news/gunsstatement010611.pdf

If a business decided tomorrow to establish a smoking section inside their business, you can bet that the city/county would be going after said business and issuing them a citation, possibly worse. Why is it that local units of government aren't held to the same standards? Ask them that!

(here is an example of a business going against state law ---look how quick the city jumped on it; they even talked about shutting them down completely!)
http://www.mlive.com/news/jackson/index.ssf/2011/02/hunt_club_restaurant_in_jackso.html

Click to expand...