If I answer zero to these questions should I carry?

A Friend of mine(Who is an english major) wrote me after I told her I open carry. Tonia wrote: "I realize you have a right to bear arms, but just a few questions: 1 - How many people (outside of the military and law enforcement) do you know personally, that have successfully defended themselves with a gun. 2 - How many people do you know have been subject to a violent attack, and could have successfully defended themselves had they owned a gun? (mind you, the gun has to be within reach to be successful). And 3 - How many people do/did you know that have been seriously injured/killed by a gunshot?"

I know the answer to her questions 1 and 3 for me personally would be zero. Could someone help me here? How should I respond? I don't want to feel like I have no reason to carry when I know how I feel but can't convey it. Any help would be appreciated thanks.

Every day that I come home alive, I have successfully defended myself with a gun.

The questions are argumentative distractions and not to the point.

The point being the "once is enough." We do not expect to need protection, but rather chose to have the option so that if and when we are not the tailor made victim.

Actually, I could list several in each category, but they are not pertinent. I cannot affect an outcome that has already occurred. My concern is not yesterday, but today - here and now.

Exactly, Grape

It is not the number of times you did not need a gun and had one, it is the one time you needed one and did not have it.

The hard part is knowing when that one time will be, so hedge your bets.

Unless you do know when that one time will be, in which case I suggest going to the Circle-K and buying a lottery ticket.

I have fire extinguishers and smoke detectors in my home but my house has never caught fire. You have a spare tire in your car but have you had a flat?

Firearms are in the same class. They are for emergencies that are not foreseen. Any other argument is as Grape said a distraction from the issue.

Thanks alot that helps!

One of my pet peeves is the tendency to lump together "police and military" for this sort of thing, but for the sake of argument, I'll answer her first question with a question:

The percentage of LEOs and military personnel who ever fire a shot in anger, much less actually use a gun to defend themselves from violent attack is tiny; does that mean they don't need firearms?

"Past Performance is No Guarantee of Future Results"

Ask her how many people she knows personally who have had their house burn down. If zero, does that mean she doesn't think anyone should have fire extinguishers?

Ask her how many people she has known personally who were killed in a car accident. If zero, does that mean she doesn't see the need for seatbelts?

As touched upon in subsequent posts... when she develops a 100% accurate ability to see the future, and she can guarantee that you will never need it, that's when you no longer have to carry a gun.

The staggering illogic here makes my head hurt. It is obviously verifiable that some people are victims of violent crime, and through no fault of their own. Where is the logical connection between the fact that you might not happen to personally know any of them, and the chance that it will happen to you in the future?

Ah, here's one... does she personally know anyone who has ever won the lottery? If not, then I guess she doesn't buy lottery tickets... because if she doesn't know them, then it doesn't happen, right? (Interestingly enough, I do know a guy who won a few hundred thousand a number of years ago... and in spite of that, I do not play the lottery... I see it as a tax on people who don't understand statistics... )

TFred

All three are personal questions that many if not most that would fall under 1-3 won't answer, or at least in a public forum. A few close friends may know but not the general public.

Ask her if she's ever had fantasies of sex with her father or had an abortion or a lesbian relationship. I expect you'll get a "Mind your own Business" answer.

Carry if you feel the need or just if you want to, but don't base it on the crosses others have to bear. It's not an academic game.

swinokur said:

I have fire extinguishers and smoke detectors in my home but my house has never caught fire. You have a spare tire in your car but have you had a flat?

Firearms are in the same class. They are for emergencies that are not foreseen. Any other argument is as Grape said a distraction from the issue.

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Oh, you're just one of those, "fire-extinguisher" nuts! You're just doing that to protect some abstract "right to bear fire-extinguishers!". We all know you secretly hope your house will catch fire, just so you can whip out your fire-extinguisher! We pray that no child gets ahold of your fire-extinguisher and whaps another child upside the head with it. Or, worse yet, decides to take it to school with him! And what if there really were a fire, why don't you just depend on the fire department, like any sensible person would?

user said:

oh, you're just one of those, "fire-extinguisher" nuts! You're just doing that to protect some abstract "right to bear fire-extinguishers!". We all know you secretly hope your house will catch fire, just so you can whip out your fire-extinguisher! we pray that no child gets ahold of your fire-extinguisher and whaps another child upside the head with it. Or, worse yet, decides to take it to school with him! And what if there really were a fire, why don't you just depend on the fire department, like any sensible person would?

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lol.

luv_jeeps said:

lol.

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Seconded.

Just don't get caught brandishing your fire-extinguisher...

ProShooter said:

Every day that I come home alive, I have successfully defended myself with a gun.

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+1

1 - How many people (outside of the military and law enforcement) do you know personally, that have successfully defended themselves with a gun. 2 - How many people do you know have been subject to a violent attack, and could have successfully defended themselves had they owned a gun? (mind you, the gun has to be within reach to be successful). And 3 - How many people do/did you know that have been seriously injured/killed by a gunshot?"

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Total BS, crime doesn't tell you when its going strike. That was just in the news about ODU, getting robbed.

know personally

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No, but I hear so many stories from NRA and the internet.

Thats like saying, I am not going to wear my seat belt because I am going to be fine.

sol said:

Just don't get caught brandishing your fire-extinguisher...

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Or worse - don't get caught pointing your finger while carrying a fire extinguisher even if it is holstered.
http://deist.com/holster-for-12-oz-handheld-fire-extinguisher-p-232.html

user said:

Oh, you're just one of those, "fire-extinguisher" nuts! You're just doing that to protect some abstract "right to bear fire-extinguishers!". We all know you secretly hope your house will catch fire, just so you can whip out your fire-extinguisher! We pray that no child gets ahold of your fire-extinguisher and whaps another child upside the head with it. Or, worse yet, decides to take it to school with him! And what if there really were a fire, why don't you just depend on the fire department, like any sensible person would?

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lulz.

Thank you for that. I'll keep that one for later.

wylde007 said:

Seconded.

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Third.

lol

I would answer all question HONESTLY and the ask her for the same (respect) on just ONE question

Regardless of your answers to her questions...Can she 100% GUARANTEE that you (or she) will never find yourselfs in a situation where carrying a firearm would save your life...

Outdoorsma1

user said:

Oh, you're just one of those, "fire-extinguisher" nuts! You're just doing that to protect some abstract "right to bear fire-extinguishers!". We all know you secretly hope your house will catch fire, just so you can whip out your fire-extinguisher! We pray that no child gets ahold of your fire-extinguisher and whaps another child upside the head with it. Or, worse yet, decides to take it to school with him! And what if there really were a fire, why don't you just depend on the fire department, like any sensible person would?

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What if it were accidentally discharged because you didn't lock the trigger? Are you liable for leaving it within easy reach of your child?

Too funny! I am an advocate of the emergency tools discussion, but rarely are people listening.

OK guys, I don't want to hijack this thread, but I DO have an observation that I want to throw in...

We often use the "fire extinguisher in your house" argument in an attempt to strengthen people's understanding of why we carry. But it has been my experience that this argument ONLY makes sense to people who are already on our side, or at the very least, are sympathetic with our ideas of self-sufficiency and knowledge that "emergency responders" are REALLY just there to string the "caution tape" and take statements AFTER the SHTF...

It has been my experience that the VAST majority of people who are strongly anti-2A are living in such complete denial of the dangers of the world, and in such blind nanny-state dependence on the non-existent promise of "rescue" by "authorities", that most of them don't have fire extinguishers in their kitchen either...

You gotta understand the level of abject cluelessness and ostrich-like denial under which these people function.

Although the "fire extinguisher" metaphor is a VERY illustrative one, I think that with most anti-2A people it doesn't hold much water, because they actually believe that the Fire Department is there to protect them from fires, just like they believe that the police will protect them from BGs...

In other words, we may want to try a different metaphor, because it has been my experience that MOST of the sorts of folks who are vocally against OC (and CC) are so clueless about their personal safety that they don't even own a fire extinguisher...